dbass
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Post by dbass on Mar 14, 2007 14:39:30 GMT -5
I recently bought a Jackson guitar with a bad tone pod. Found myself needing to replace both tone and volume. Got it working just fine, until I tested this old fuss power-wah combo pedal. The pedal worked. Now, nothing works. I plug the guitar straight into the amp and it's dead. It's not the cable, and it's not the amp. Something happened to the guitar. Can anyone help. Could I have blown something by testing that pedal? Thank You...
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Post by dd842 on Mar 14, 2007 15:10:46 GMT -5
..... Found myself needing to replace both tone and volume. Got it working just fine ..... Now, nothing works. I plug the guitar straight into the amp and it's dead. It's not the cable, and it's not the amp. Hi dbass, and Welcome to GN2! I can't help but think that the sudden death of your axe is related to the recent work you have done. But first, I am going to ask you a question that may appear to be a smart-aleck comment. It is not intended to be, so please do not take it as such: Did you turn the volume pot up on the guitar? I ask because I, er - I mean a friend, yeah - once complained of a similar symptom that turned to be caused by checking things out with the volume set at zero. But I am assuming you haven't done what, uh, my friend did, and so taking into account that you have just replaced the tone and volume pots, my first guess is that a wire has come loose. Have you had a look inside to see if anything is out of place? Given your work a little tug (and I do mean little, don't go yanking it) to see if anything that does not appear to be loose is actually loose? Barring that, you are faced with either redoing the whole soldering job - OR - even better, you may be able to diagnose your problem with reading from a multimeter. Depending on the readings, it can reveal a what type of problem it may be, and where the problem may be. But, more on that later ... as I hope it turns out to be something simple. Dan P.S. I bet it is not the cable or amp but, out of curiosity, how did you come to know it is not the cable or amp?
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Post by sumgai on Mar 14, 2007 17:02:45 GMT -5
Dan,
+1 for admitting to a Class A stupidity with grace and humor!
sumgai
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dbass
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Post by dbass on Mar 14, 2007 17:33:39 GMT -5
Thank you dd842, The volume pot was raised and lowered with no response. I then tested both the amp and same cable with another working guitar succesfully. I also had a look inside the Jackson to make sure no wiring came apart, it was just as I left it. I'm wondering if if could possibly be the pickup switch. Thanks again, dbass
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Post by dd842 on Mar 14, 2007 18:52:21 GMT -5
Dan, +1 for admitting to a Class A stupidity with grace and humor! sumgai Sumgai, thank you … I think … I appreciate that. dbass, You are wondering if it could possibly be the pickup switch. Well, it certainly could be that. But I think a few readings from a mutimeter would be helpful at this point. If you don’t already have a multimeter, this would be a great time to get one – they are very useful ... and cheap too! But don’t go measuring all sorts of stuff with it until you really understand how they work. It would not take much to blow the fuse. If you were to take a multimeter and connect the probes to the “COM” and the “Volt/Ohms” or “Volt/Ohms/mA” inputs, you may be able to give us enough info to tell you more about what is going on with your guitar. If anyone here has better instructions than the following for dbass to take readings, by all means please jump in. I am not certain what the resistance of your pickup(s) will be – but I hope you will be safe in setting your multimeter to 20k ohms. If you touch the tips of the probes together you should see a 0 on the display. So, now you plug one end of your cord into your guitar. Now connect either one of the probes to the tip of the loose end of the guitar cord, and connect the other probe to the sleeve of the guitar cord. With the volume control at minimum, you should have a reading of 0. Next, with the volume at maximum, you should have a higher reading – it could be up to 15000 ohms (in which case your display would say 15.00). Then set the meter to 2000k ohms. With the probes still attached, rotate the volume knob and record the highest level of resistance (it should be 125 – 250, depending on your pot) – it should occur somewhere near the middle volume. Don’t worry if these numbers aren’t working out for you … your guitar’s dead, so they probably won’t. But if you can get the readings, it should give us something to work on. Dan P.S. I will be on vacation for the balance of the week and I will not be spending much time in cyberspace – there are lots of guys on here who can give you direction based on your readings in the meantime, otherwise I'll try to help you more next week.
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Post by sumgai on Mar 14, 2007 21:46:31 GMT -5
dbass, Welcome to these here forums! A real clue revails itself to us in that you get absolutely no output whatsoever, even though the cable and amp are known to be good. If you rotate the volume pot, and get no change in the output, then the only questions I'd have at this point are "Do you have any noise coming out of the amp at all? Is the amp stone dead quiet, or does it maybe have just a tiny amount of hiss, crackle, hum, noise, whatever?" If the amp is dead quiet, then the input is grounded. Prove this by disconnecting the cable from your guitar - the amp should now make some kind of noise, particularly as you turn it up. (You did say that the cable is good.) Pull the cable out of the amp, and it returns to church-mouse quiet. The probable cause in your guitar is a dead short between the output "Hot" lead and ground. Might be right on the jack itself, could be anywhere else between the jack and the volume control, or even just near the volume control. If the amp is making noises, but the guitar signal isn't getting through (pulling your cable out of the guitar makes no difference in the noise coming from the amp), then your "Hot" signal lead has become disconnected from the output jack. That disruption might be elsewhere in the circuit, not just the jack itself, but that is the cause of this symptom. In either case, take it all apart again, and look it over very carefully. At this point, a multimeter is a godsend - if you don't have one, correct that error before going any further. Follow Dan's instructions in the post above, and you should be able to find the problem, no matter which way the wind blew. One exception: It is considered the best policy when reading resistance to always set your meter to its highest resistance range, no matter what the scale/multiplier. This is more for the health of the meter than anything else. Once you have determined that the reading is too low to read on the meter face, you can safely switch to a lower scale. This advice applies to all meters, digital or analog. Obviously, an auto-ranging meter will take care of itself. HTH sumgai
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Post by UnklMickey on Mar 15, 2007 11:13:47 GMT -5
Dan, +1 for admitting to a Class A stupidity with grace and humor! sumgai wow, i'm sure that didn't come out exactly like ya meant it. looks like you're talkin' about his entire post.
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Post by sumgai on Mar 15, 2007 20:03:37 GMT -5
unk, Nah, yer lookin' in the wrong di-rection there, Billy JoeBob. I was speakin' to his admission of cranking the volume all the way down, then wondering why he's getting no output from his axe. I think he was OK with that, in his subsequent post. (Emphasis on the "think" part. ) And I wouldn't have Exalted him for a stupid post, you can do the Toma act with that. Come to think of it, I don't recall more than one or two stupid posts since the days of a certain spud.... how 'bout you, anything like that ring a bell with you? sumgai
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Post by UnklMickey on Mar 16, 2007 16:15:33 GMT -5
... I was speakin' to his admission of cranking the volume all the way down, then wondering why he's getting no output from his axe. ... sure, i got that even before my reply. but AFTER i read VERY carefully. at first it looked like a backhand, and to anyone who didn't take the time, it still might. ...i'm just sayin'
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Post by dd842 on Mar 16, 2007 18:27:41 GMT -5
Dan, +1 for admitting to a Class A stupidity with grace and humor! sumgai Sumgai, thank you … I think … I appreciate that. Unk, Sumgai: I am checking emails occasionally and, of course, can’t resist checking into see what’s going on at GN2! Unk, I really appreciate your gesture in defending me from that Sumgai dude. And you are, of course, both correct. Unk, you are correct that Sumgai’s wording was open to interpretation. Sumgai, you are correct that I interpreted it as intended. I am sorry that my response to Sumgai’s compliment turned out to be a failed attempt at humor this time, and appeared to leave my thoughts and fellings up in the air. What I meant was "Sumgai, thank you. I appreciate that ... like ... so fer sure, eh?" ;D Seriously, I do thank you both. God bless you, Dan
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Post by UnklMickey on Mar 16, 2007 19:53:12 GMT -5
Unk, I really appreciate your gesture in defending me from that Sumgai dude. i read your post. i knew what you were saying. i was actually trying to defend "that Sumgai dude" from looking like a meanie to the casual observer. this thing has really gone astray hasn't it? ......who's on first? .
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Post by dd842 on Mar 16, 2007 22:50:04 GMT -5
Unk, I really appreciate your gesture in defending me from that Sumgai dude. i read your post. i knew what you were saying. i was actually trying to defend "that Sumgai dude" from looking like a meanie to the casual observer. this thing has really gone astray hasn't it? ......who's on first? . NOW I get ya! And now I appreciate what you wrote for a different reason. On that note, I will simply say to the casual observer that, like unk, sumgai is a real class act. I could not imagine anything with malicious intent being written by either. + 1 to each of you, just for being you. Very best regards, Dan
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Post by sumgai on Mar 17, 2007 1:50:02 GMT -5
Dan, Say, you didn't by any chance check your imagination at the door, did you? ;D
Feeling donkey!1
sumgai
1. American GI version of German term 'vielen danke', which means "many thanks".
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Post by UnklMickey on Mar 17, 2007 1:57:01 GMT -5
...Feeling donkey!1
sumgai
1. American GI version of German term 'vielen danke', which means "many thanks". and here i was, thinkin' it was a Shrek thing.
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Post by sumgai on Mar 17, 2007 1:57:29 GMT -5
unk, All, If I went back and edited that infamous post now, everything that comes afterwards would look rather out-of-place. I'll have to let it stand, but yeah, the point was, doing something like turning down the volume control prior to testing for output is rather silly, foolish, or indicative of forgetfulness. So I equated that with a moment of insanity, or more commonly called, stupidity. Sorry for the confusion. I'll try to remember to be a little more PC the next time I have a frain bart. But I still say Dan knows how to make the phunny! ;D sumgai
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dbass
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Post by dbass on Mar 17, 2007 23:43:16 GMT -5
I'm new to all of this. What I do understand is that some guy is the administrator so, he has the leverage to what is posted and what/not. My question is "why the MAYHAM", in March? Do july in June?, do you dance in rocktober? And as for "who's on first?". I WAS. Please don't get me wrong, I like humor. Now, if we can just all get along without the manotny, that'll be just great. It's just that, I really don't need to be reading you'alls bickering b/tween one another on my space.... Or do I? Cause if I do, this just ain't for me. much abliged to you dd842 and sumgai for your advise, dbass
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Post by dd842 on Mar 18, 2007 12:32:09 GMT -5
I'm new to all of this. What I do understand is that some guy is the administrator so, he has the leverage to what is posted and what/not. My question is "why the MAYHAM", in March? Do july in June?, do you dance in rocktober? And as for "who's on first?". I WAS. Please don't get me wrong, I like humor. Now, if we can just all get along without the manotny, that'll be just great. It's just that, I really don't need to be reading you'alls bickering b/tween one another on my space.... Or do I? Cause if I do, this just ain't for me. much abliged to you dd842 and sumgai for your advise, dbass Hey dbass, Naw man, that was all just an act to try to lure you back - we thought you'd want to be a part of the lovefest ;D Seriously, YES ... we got off track dbass. Sorry about that. Please let us know what readings you get, as we'd love to help you. But we do need the readings. Dan P.S. This forum is a bunch of guys helping a bunch of guys, and sometimes we do revert back to our caveman days (i.e. we become "meanderthals") and you just have to put up with it. But don't be put off by it. At the end of our circuitous journey, we are still trying to help you.
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dbass
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Post by dbass on Mar 18, 2007 16:11:36 GMT -5
OK then, let me give you the scoobydoo on the doowah diddy diddy regarding the multimeter. I plugged a cord into the guitar and put my leads on the other end of the cable. One on the tip and the other on the shaft. Volume down I got 00, as I went up, so did the readings. Now on about 8 or 9 it hit 125.8k ohms. As I continued to peak volume it rapidly climbed downward finishing off at 8.34k ohms. Is this what you all wanted to know? Thank You, dbass
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Post by dd842 on Mar 18, 2007 20:07:08 GMT -5
OK then, let me give you the scoobydoo on the doowah diddy diddy regarding the multimeter. See, 4 posts and you fit right in That is a good start. I have read through many old posts on GN2 that described problems of all types and gave theories on probable causes of those problems. As far as I know, these appear to be normal values, and you say you are getting NO sound output, correct - not reduced sound output. If dbass is getting measured output but NO sound, and says the cord and amp are fine, could it be the output jack itself may be to blame somehow (as opposed to a short)? dbass, I'm just guessing at this point, so don't go ripping anything apart. Let's wait for some thoughts from those who are really knowledgeable about these things. Hang tight. Members of the forum will just keep bouncing ideas back and forth until hopefully we hit the right one and get your axe up and running. Dan
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Post by sumgai on Mar 19, 2007 2:28:53 GMT -5
Costello, As Dan said, your readings indicate a perfectly behaved guitar. There is no short circuit between Hot and Ground, or else you'd not see the higher value Ohm readings, let alone the final value of 8.34KΩ when the volume pot is at 10. Ditto for the fact that the circuit is complete, there are no "open" connections anywhere.
At this point, I'd hesitantly suggest that the problem is not the wiring, but the pickups themselves. Either they are not very close to the strings, or else they have completely lost all ability to bestir a current within one or more coils. Bring a screwdriver blade close to each magnet..... find any weak ones?
sumgai
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dbass
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Post by dbass on Mar 20, 2007 22:24:37 GMT -5
I put a screwdriver to the magnets and found the inner ones a little stronger than the outer ones. (both pickups) Is this not a good sign? thank you sumgai, dbass
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Post by sumgai on Mar 21, 2007 2:04:27 GMT -5
dbass, I spoke, and then ended my sentence too quickly. What I meant to say was, as you bring the screwdriver into contact with the magnetic pole pieces, you should hear a fairly loud click from the amp/speaker. As you draw the screwdriver away, there might be another softer click. You said that one coil was a bit stronger than the other, but that doesn't mean that it was louder - you could have meant that the screwdriver was pulled harder by the one coil . Let me presume that's what you meant, though, and I'd have to say, the pickups are definitely working. But that would mean that strings can excite your pickups too, thus you should have beautiful music coming out of the amp. Curiouser and curiouser.......... Say, just for drill (insert first four notes of Dragnet theme music here)....... what kind of strings did you mount on that beast of yours? sumgai
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dbass
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Post by dbass on Mar 22, 2007 23:50:22 GMT -5
Well, well, well, through the process of elimination, thanks to you guys, I decided to mess w/the pickup switch and guess what? WHA-LA, it was sticking. When I replaced my pods I decided to spray the switch w/contact cleaner. I don't know if that's what made it stick but, I just kept on messing w/it and I got crackling sound coming in and out. I'm feeling real good right now and I'm looking forward to getting that switch replaced. Hellaluya, farout ,out-a-sight, neatoe, and groovy. dd842 and sumgai, I want to thank you two for everything. I really do APPRECIATE it.
I am much ablidged, dbass
P.S. my name is Dan too...
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Post by sumgai on Mar 23, 2007 1:31:37 GMT -5
Dan II, That is indeed good news. I for one am not going to look a gift horse in the mouth. sumgai
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Post by dd842 on Mar 23, 2007 8:01:46 GMT -5
..... through the process of elimination, thanks to you guys, I decided to mess w/the pickup switch and guess what? ..... Dan, That is awesome! And THANKS for reporting back to us on what happened. That was first class of you, as we like to learn too - I hope you will be a regular visitor. By the way, your second post: Thank you dd842, The volume pot was raised and lowered with no response. I then tested both the amp and same cable with another working guitar succesfully. I also had a look inside the Jackson to make sure no wiring came apart, it was just as I left it. I'm wondering if if could possibly be the pickup switch. Thanks again, dbass ... "I'm wondering if if could possibly be the pickup switch." ... turns out - you guessed right. Kudos! Don't be a stranger, Dan! Dan
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