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Post by JohnH on Jun 14, 2010 0:03:43 GMT -5
I'm thinking to add some kind of vibrato device to one of my guitars, maybe the black LP studio. What do you guys think of this device?, which fits over the standard screws of a Gibson style tail piece and bridge. It seems simple, and would probably suit my playing style since I'm usually rested somewhere near the bridge. www.tremma.com.au/ Or do you know of other such devices? I like the look of a Bigsby on a black LP - very Neil Young, but possible more work to fit and maybe a harder job to play? I confess to never having had a whammy of any kind on a guitar. In Chris Isaak moments, a flex the neck of the Strat slightly. But LPs with 50's thick necks object to that! cheers John |
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Post by newey on Jun 14, 2010 5:39:14 GMT -5
Interesting. I like the concept.
But I wonder whether the plate installed beneath the TOM would raise the action unacceptably. Guess it depends on how high your bridge sits off the body to start with.
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Post by JFrankParnell on Jun 21, 2010 12:15:42 GMT -5
pretty cool device, but it doesnt seem like it could do the deeper surf bends. you can see that the main action of it is *up* in pitch. So, not useful for surf really. Dang, it's cool though.
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Post by sumgai on Jun 21, 2010 13:54:43 GMT -5
jfp, Did you say.... "surf"?  ~!~!~!~!~ John, Depending on the state of your wallet, and since it's in your own backyard, I'd say try it. If you don't like it, then you can take it off the guitar, resell it to someone else, and no one will know the difference. And by-the-by, if your Strat-style body doesn't already have a vibrato tailpiece, you might consider snatching up a "pawn shop special" with one, and seeing if that suits your playing style. Adjust the bridge to "float" above the body, and you'll be doing everything you see in that video, I'm sure. HTH sumgai |
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Post by JFrankParnell on Jun 21, 2010 17:16:34 GMT -5
Surf.  Perhaps Rockabilly, yes. Light, shallow, Bigsby-ish dives to go with the vibe. Or maybe you're more a fan of the "majestic superior cackling hen" ? |
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Post by sumgai on Jun 21, 2010 22:27:45 GMT -5
.... Or maybe you're more a fan of the "majestic superior cackling hen" ? Well, assuming that you're not referring to Steve Webb, on YouTube, then you are referring to the once-rife rumors of Dick Dale's demise. Jimi and Dick were good friends, both being left-handed and all that. Now as it happens, Dick and I don't know each other at all, but if he's the King of the Surf Guitar, then I'm most certainly the Crown Prince in waiting. ;D But I'll pass on inheriting that Father of Loud thing..... Ted Nugent can have that one, TYVM. So, JFrank, are you just gonna talk about it by referring sideways to its distant cousin (Rockabilly), or are you gonna come outta the closet?  Come on, don't be bashful now, I'm not the only one here who lusts after a pre-CBS Jazzmaster! sumgai |
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Post by JFrankParnell on Jun 22, 2010 10:32:36 GMT -5
haha, no, I'm not much for vintage guitars. I like em new and shiny and with lotsa switches and knobs. But, I digs me some twangy warbly Surf! And rockabilly! Rev Horton Heat (see: Wiggle Stick) style, if you please Do you think this Tremma would be good for that? I dont, but i think it would be good for a LP or PRS that you didnt want to route into. And the vibe he's puttin' on those lead licks is pretty unique. |
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Post by sumgai on Jun 22, 2010 13:25:51 GMT -5
JFrank, It's not for the "vintage" vibe, it's for the playability. Early 60's Jazzmasters and Strats had what was called at the time, the "speed neck". These things were thin, front to back, and the frets were way down low. You could play all night and never cramp up, and you could blister a pig's ear at 40 paces, the notes came so fast and furious. If you wanted/needed to play that way, of course.  Literally all later necks since those halcyon days are bigger, have higher frets, and simply don't compare for ease of use. Only the Mosrite ever equaled it, and most would say that neck is even better in all respects, but just try to buy one of those puppies now.....  Although Warmoth does make the "wizard" profile, and that looks to be about the same dimensions. Ditto for USACG, though they don't call it the "wizard". True surf purists demand that JM tone, and that's OK, but I can get that in other ways. I just wanna feel comfortable when I'm playing, that's all. And for the record, RHH is strictly Rockabilly. The only thing the two genres share in common (guitar-wise) is using the whammy bar, sometimes to an extreme, and sometimes with finesse. But he is good, I freely admit. It's easy to see why many listeners cross over between the two genres without any hesitation. But we're now way off-topic! John, made any decisions yet on whether or not to step up to the counter for that Tremma unit? sumgai |
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Post by JohnH on Jun 22, 2010 15:42:02 GMT -5
John, made any decisions yet on whether or not to step up to the counter for that Tremma unit? Well, I had a question about it and I thought Id test the waters by asking it of the manufacturer. I like to do this anyway before ordering from small on-line companies, just to make sure they are paying attention. If I get one of these, it would be to go on my LP Studio, which is US made. On the web site, it talks about 8mm metric bushes for asian made guitars, and it is not clear if it would work on my guitar. No response yet since last weekend. John |
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Post by chuck on Jun 22, 2010 22:41:00 GMT -5
the Warmoth Wizard profile is a copy of the Ibanez Wizard neck isnt it ? Fender actually had a neck that awesome ?? wow , i am stunned. the original Ibanez Wizard neck is simply amazing , and one of the best i have ever played. JFrank, It's not for the "vintage" vibe, it's for the playability. Early 60's Jazzmasters and Strats had what was called at the time, the "speed neck". These things were thin, front to back, and the frets were way down low. You could play all night and never cramp up, and you could blister a pig's ear at 40 paces, the notes came so fast and furious. If you wanted/needed to play that way, of course. Literally all later necks since those halcyon days are bigger, have higher frets, and simply don't compare for ease of use. Only the Mosrite ever equaled it, and most would say that neck is even better in all respects, but just try to buy one of those puppies now..... Although Warmoth does make the "wizard" profile, and that looks to be about the same dimensions. Ditto for USACG, though they don't call it the "wizard". True surf purists demand that JM tone, and that's OK, but I can get that in other ways. I just wanna feel comfortable when I'm playing, that's all. And for the record, RHH is strictly Rockabilly. The only thing the two genres share in common (guitar-wise) is using the whammy bar, sometimes to an extreme, and sometimes with finesse. But he is good, I freely admit. It's easy to see why many listeners cross over between the two genres without any hesitation. But we're now way off-topic! John, made any decisions yet on whether or not to step up to the counter for that Tremma unit? sumgai |
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Post by 4real on Jun 22, 2010 23:26:05 GMT -5
It seems a little too mild for my taste, just a bit of a woozy out of tuneness in the clips, not that classic semitone dip...plus, hard to use with palm muting...but it is an interesting thing and neater than some...
I had one of those old trems like a bigsby that replaced the tailpiece. Not the best, it could mark the guitar if not careful, but it didn't keep tune too well. Mainly you'd get hung up on the bridge saddles on my guitar, but of course the nut is always a problem on LP type guitars.
The Kahler I can completely recommend, a great bridge that gives great tone and clarity, able to adjust intonation and height plus string spread...and locks solid to a fixed bridge. The routing is small, but it does need to be done and it certainly isn't cheap.
But even with something like that, a lubed nut or locking (supplied with it) is minimum and with things like this or a bigsby, I'm surprised they don't use a roller bridge at least even on this one.
...
Love that "wicked game" semitone B string dip...and of course a huge surf fan.
I was a Gibson LP player for decades, but always had a bit of "trem envy", that is a large part of why I switched to strats, now with the the Khaler I am moving back to the LPs and even thinking of doing another one!
....
Still, a neat find for sure, I'm surprised that it doesn't have a bit more range, it doesn't even look like it would be that effective for holdsworth or Murphy "scoops".
If not convinced, a bigsby is an option and looks retro, but the tuning issues will always be a "problem" potentially on these kinds of guitars. Still, the cost is worth it to add wobble to things, so many cool effects are possible...good to see more interested in the things!
PS...I'd be surprised if a real gibson uses metric threads...all the kahler stuff for instance are weird USA threads and a bit hard to source
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Post by newey on Jun 23, 2010 2:25:47 GMT -5
Otherwise known as the English System of Measurement. Just in case anyone thought we came up with those weird threads all on our own! |
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Post by 4real on Jun 23, 2010 2:54:36 GMT -5
Otherwise known as the English System of Measurement. Just in case anyone thought we came up with those weird threads all on our own! Whatever, the point was, that in the video he suggests that this devices threads are metric, which is the Australian System, and being Australian, like johnH and the people who make this product, there could be a problem if the Gibson guitar is not metric...something to consider anyway! Plus, it is weird that no one can seem to settle on a "standard" for somethings... |
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Post by sumgai on Jun 23, 2010 4:56:02 GMT -5
chuck, the Warmoth Wizard profile is a copy of the Ibanez Wizard neck isnt it ? Sorry, I don't know the story on why Warmoth chose that name. I don't know for sure that they "copied" any particular neck, I only know, from measuring the necks on a friend's '62 and '63 JM's, the dimensions are very close to Warmoth's Wizard profile. For all I know, they did copy the Ibanez. Wouldn't that be a hoot?! Yes, but when CBS bought the company (in 1964, they took control on Jan 4, 1965), they made several changes for financial reasons. One of those was to stop making necks in all kinds of sizes and profiles. Thus the "speed neck" lasted only 4 or 5 years, depending on who you're talking to. Don't be. History has a way of repeating itself, whether we're aware of it or not. HTH sumga |
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Post by Runewalker on Jun 23, 2010 19:46:42 GMT -5
John, returning to topic, the device you point to with the palm lever looks awkward in relationship to the vibrato "feel." Jeff Beck will on occasion use the palm-heel press or even the finger pull approach to his tremolo manipulations, but it is more episodic than constant. There is a definite "feel" to the lever systems opposed to using your palm-heel on a device. Another comment is that the device mechanically is not dissimilar to a bigsby (sans lever) or a LesTrem in that they use coil springs to offset the string pull tension. My experience is that all of those are notoriously ineffective in returning to neutral tune, especially if used with any significant amplitude. www.stewmac.com/shop/Bridges,_tailpieces/Electric_guitar_tremolos/Les_Trem_Stop-Tailpiece_Tremolo.html o I think I remember you filled up the spring cavity on your Roadstar, but I think the standard Strat style vibrato is a better place to start. A backbox or similar is supposed to offset the return to tune issues. No personal experience there, but lots of personal experience with 6-screw, 2 post and FRs and they all (in my experience) fail to reliably return to neutral. I hope to try the backbox, but only seen them sold in Europe not the states. warble out RW |
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Post by JFrankParnell on Jun 23, 2010 20:48:47 GMT -5
I just installed a goldo backbox and it does work as advertised: joe.emenaker.com/TremStabilizers/BackBoxAuction.html These, though, are no good for the guys that want to rest their palm on the vib and jiggle it from there, like this Tremma. It purposely restricts that action. You *can* pull up with a back box on, but its stiffer than diving. |
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Post by gumbo on Jun 24, 2010 6:52:10 GMT -5
I just GOTTA say that Australia went metric in 1974... know because I was "Metric Conversion Officer" for the Oz end of a large multi-national at the time...
...what that REALLY meant was that 36 years later we are STILL making and marketing products that have their origins in Imperial dimensions...often 'relabeled' as metric..the hardware stores still stock nuts and bolts in both systems, and road speeds are still referred to as K.P.H., even though the proper nomenclature is km/h..only thing that really has changed is that no-one under the age of 35 knows that there are 63,360 inches in a mile, and if you ever play about with old cars in this country, you have to have three sets of spanners (sorry, 'wrenches'!)..... I guess it will take for all of us (old Buggers) to die out completely before anything at all will change...
Wanna be MORE off-topic?
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Post by chuck on Jun 24, 2010 11:13:17 GMT -5
lol .... we have to have both Metric and S.A.E tools here in America too .... our hardware stores stock both types of nuts , bolts , washers , studs , etc ....
i remember having to buy new tools to fit all the new cars at the time ... what a royal pain in the rear end THAT was.
NOW we have to have electronic diagnostic equipment for these fancy over computerized cars .
the joy of having to buy new tools NEVER ends ....
too bad my Flat Head valve adjusting wrenches are obsolete .... but i DID get to use my distributor wrench the other day !
talk about a blast from the past ...
... and off topic is not a bad thing.
life is off topic all the time.
it dosent fit into neat little boxes.
we are not machines
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Post by sumgai on Jun 24, 2010 14:28:05 GMT -5
chuck, ....
too bad my Flat Head valve adjusting wrenches are obsolete .... Didn't we used to call those "tappet wrenches"?  You and I could probably start a Tool Trivia thread. Post pictures and have the young whippersnappers guess what the tool's original purpose was. And for the record, I too was a member of the NAAFH. I'd nominate this motor to be the Poster chld of the KISS principle! sumgai |
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Perhaps Rockabilly, yes. Light, shallow, Bigsby-ish dives to go with the vibe.
Come on, don't be bashful now, I'm not the only one here who lusts after a pre-CBS Jazzmaster!
