Weird Russian Acoustic - Any info?

[BlackAngusYoung]

I found an interesting guitar marked only "MADE IN USSR." To me, it looks like was made primitively and sensibly but differently than any guitar I've seen. Here are some pictures. Anyone have any comments or info to share?

I'd like to know if this would be considered a collector's piece that should be kept original, or if I should replace the tuners and whatever else needs it and try to get it playing. I don't want to "ruin" it but I think I'd like to play it a little.
It sounds like it could have a good sound, but now the strings are really old and the tuners don't work. They're made out of a kind of metal I've seen on old toys that just seems to crumble and break apart.






The only writing anywhere on the guitar.



Looks like one bolt with some weird kind of wing nut holding the neck on.



Bridge is lifting. Any tips on how to fix?

There is glitter on the bridge and headstock. I'm doubting that's original. It makes sense to me that having glitter at the points where the strings meet the body would make for a more rocking guitar.
Now, the glitter's not exactly nice... but I do think it's kinda cool that it's there. It's like this guitar was made for Glam Delta Blues.



Shortly after being advised here on my electric's fretboard overhang.... it's kinda funny to find a guitar put together like this.

So, any info would be appreciated and comments welcome.... but at least I hope somebody enjoys these pictures of something I think is pretty cool.

Thanks. Rock on, y'all!

[newey]

I'd like to know if this would be considered a collector's piece that should be kept original, or if I should replace the tuners and whatever else needs it and try to get it playing. I don't want to "ruin" it but I think I'd like to play it a little.

I doubt it will ever have much value to a collector, but even if it does, changes that help playability generally don't destroy value to a collector. That includes replacing tuners, so long as the new ones are close to the originals.

By all means, get it playable so you can do campfire renditions of "Back In The USSR" for all your friends. ;D

To find out more info about it, you might try posting the photos at VintAxe.com. Steve and the rest of the regulars there are pretty good at IDing unknown guitars.

VintAxe

Or, post it to this guy, who seems to run the definitive website on Soviet-era guitars. Mostly electrics, but he might have some info:
Cheesy Guitars

[BlackAngusYoung]

Yeah, I just saw that Cheesy Guitars site after posting this. I like how he put it... that Russian guitars never sounded good and never will sound good and will never be the key to some new kind of music... or something like that. Of course, he's talking mostly electrics but I'm sure it applies enough to know that there shouldn't be anything too special about this one I found. (Except the glitter, I mean. That's pretty special.)

I gotta admit I kinda like the look of a lot of the guitars he calls ugly, though. Not that I don't see their ugliness, too. There's just something so otherworldly about their amoebic shapes. It's interesting that they were supposed to be designed without any influence from American guitars. They are on eBay for around $200, for collectors of lousy guitars I guess.

One cool thing about having a guitar that looks like the one I have is that I could probably tell people I made it myself and seem pretty believable. Not that I'd do that, but it's interesting to have something with that look.

I think I'll try to get it playable and a little more photogenic before posting it to those sites. Never heard of VintAxe before. Thanks.

[D2o]

BAY,

I think a lot of those ugly OLD Russki guitars were made in furniture factories, and would likely have been normal enough in appearance and have solid tops, but the solid top would be much thicker than normal (perhaps thicker than yours appears to be - although I have never seen one in person).

Unfortunately, the "MADE IN USSR" sticker appears to be the most compelling thing about your guitar. The guitar does not look OLD old, or anything ... maybe it was a cheap toy-ish "First Actsky" kind of deal?

How does it play? How does it sound? What did you pay for it?

I had a crappy guitar that had a bridge that was pulling away once. I no longer have it ... but I can cross off "1) smash an acoustic guitar to smithereens" off my list. No, I am not kidding.

I am not suggesting you should follow suit, of course (but I still think it was worth it).

Yippee-ki-yay, strummerplucker!

D2o

[BlackAngusYoung]

Aug 2, 2010 16:43:16 GMT -5 D2o said:

How does it play? How does it sound? What did you pay for it?

I haven't got new strings on it yet and the tuners won't let me get these old ones in tune. But, one dead old string at a time, I think it sounds potentially good and with nice volume.

I really like the feeling/shape of the neck and the fact that overall the guitar looks very much like your theory is correct... like it could have been made in a furniture factory. The neck joint looks more like something you'd see under a table holding the legs on, than something inside a guitar.

What I paid is really a non-issue in this case. I have a secondhand shop and this is just one of the things we got from our suppliers (country auctions.) I could keep it if I wanted or sell it in pretty much any shape and make a profit, and I can sell it now or in ten years and it wouldn't really make a difference.

It just seems like something I would have fun with if it sounds half-decent, even if I just use it as a prop around the store. People go nuts about anything guitar- or music-related, even if they have no idea what they're looking at.

Thanks for the reply.
And don't worry about me... the store provides me with many useless guitars I could smash if I really felt like it. And glassware, too!

[D2o]

Yeah, it has an interesting neck joint to be sure (and the way the neck/fretboard kinda cranes over the soundboard is neat too).

The one thing I kept from the deceased guitar is a set of (crappy) tuners that might fit your little Russky.

PM me if you need 'em ... 'cause I sure don't!

EDIT: scratch that offer ... I just checked and they will not work. Sorry if I got your hopes up.

[BlackAngusYoung]

Thanks for the intent to offer, D2o. I am wondering if I can replace the tuners because they are differently spaced than the similar ones I have, which I believe to be the standard kind we'd be used to around here. So I might not be able to replace them if I don't have authentic Russian parts.

[D2o]

I was thinking about this some more last night. I don’t know if this will work, but …

If you squint a little, the tuners I have look something like the ones on the left below – except all three are mounted on the same piece of metal that gets screwed to the headstock.

With mine, the steel winding posts go through the back of the headstock and poke out the front / top, and the strings are wound above the face of the headstock as they are on most steel string acoustics (whereas yours are wound sort of “in” the headstock as would be typically found on a classical style acoustic).

I wonder what would happen if you were to unscrew and remove the steel posts from mine and then screw the winding posts that you currently have into where you just removed the steel posts from? Just because mine have steel posts and screw into the back of the headstock doesn’t mine they may not also be McGyvered to screw into the side of the headstock …

If you want to take measurements of the space between the tuners (holes) so I can see if they are by chance the same dimension, let me know. For that matter, if you want the tuners to otherwise cannibalize and try to figure something out on the fly, PM me your address.

Nothing ventured, nothing gained. After all, I only kept them forrrrrrr … I dunno … in case something like this ever came up on the forum, I guess. The worst that can happen is you get to use your trashcan to dispose of the donor tuners.

... so they’re yours for the asking (no charge, in case that’s not clear).

Cheers,
D2o

[BlackAngusYoung]

Thanks, D2o, but it sounds like what you have are the same as the extras I have and can't fit on. Still, I would appreciate comparing the measurement in case. Ya never know. The Russian pegs are exactly 4cm apart.

With just the couple examples I've seen, I pretty much concluded the same thing you're suggesting... that the same sort of units fit into both kinds of guitar heads. I think they call the classical-looking style a "slotted headstock." I had a guitar with the pegs coming through the wood as you described, all connected like yours, and I put them on a guitar with the slotted headstock. They were the same as the ones I took out, just needed to be flipped over to be used in that way. The little tapered (or rounded or whatever) tips above the string hole end up sitting inside the hole through the wood in the centre of the head. So if they're spaced correctly, I would expect them to be usable. But I sadly don't expect them to be spaced correctly.
Thanks for the offer in any case!

[D2o]

Exactly 4 cm. Okay - I'll check it out when I get home.

BTW, funny that you mention "cm" - for two reasons.

1) I am not old, but I am old enough that I still tend to resist parts of Canada's change to the Metric system (yeah! that's right - I'm a real rebel) and so I think of some measurements in Imperial units first (i.e. inches, in this case) ... even though cm and, especially, mm is more accurate, and

2) Exactly 4 cm is likely not accidental, as the Metric system would have been used in USSR pretty much whenever your guitar was made.

Stay tuned for most useless insight ... ;D

Cheers,
D2o

[BlackAngusYoung]

Yes, I thought that was a good sign that the USSR must use the metric system. I try to use the Imperial measurements on forums just because I assume most people reading it will be from the US. But I usually just go with whatever seems more accurate for the specific measurement. Personally, I like the Metric system because that's what I was taught and the whole X10 thing makes sense to me.

The American (I guess) part like this that I have measures 3 3/4" which I guess makes sense, too.

[D2o]

BAY,

The distance between the winding posts appears to be exactly 4cm. (well, to be completely accurate, since the actual posts aren’t always the most stable, I measured the distance between the screws holding the posts, which is exactly 4cm – and it follows that the posts will be as well). Will they do you any good?

D2o

[BlackAngusYoung]

Aug 4, 2010 8:24:21 GMT -5 D2o said:

BAY,

The distance between the winding posts appears to be exactly 4cm. (well, to be completely accurate, since the actual posts aren’t always the most stable, I measured the distance between the screws holding the posts, which is exactly 4cm – and it follows that the posts will be as well). Will they do you any good?

D2o

Well, yeah, I guess it seems they would be good! That's really cool. I didn't expect them to be the right measurements. And you really don't need 'em? Thanks!

[bongocol]

It`s just amazing! I bought a guitar completely identical to this last week at a local auction in town for £7 (GBP). I suppose I was attracted by the unusual "made in USSR" label. It is in "as new", unused condition with what look like original slightly tarnished strings. The tuners are unworn. It tuned up very easily and stays in tune. The bass strings have a bit of a dead sound but it plays ok with quite a low action. I only play a few chords at the top end so ok for me. It is about three-quarter size and fits nicely into a guitar bag I already have. All in all I quite like it and it seems very strongly made. I just like the bolt that holds the neck to the body!
I am sure guitar snobs would look down on it but who cares, I like it and it did not exactly break the bank to buy!

[newey]

bongocol-

Hello and Welcome to G-Nutz2! We haven't heard back from Black Angus Young in a while, so no news on how his repair went. But the fact that there are at least two examples of this guitar bodes well for finding out more information about it.

You might consider posting it to the other forums mentioned above to see if you can find out some more history.

Anyway, be sure to visit us again from time to time.

[classjazz]

Hello well guess what guys I have on those student classical guitars made in USSR as well...that makes three of us?
 I found it in my mother in law's basement...very clean!
I restrung and she sounds sweet.

Any more information on them? I was going to sell...but can't figure on a price
Daver

[classjazz]

OH and I think its a solid cedar wood top???
Daver

[newey]

Classjazz-

Hello and Welcome to G-Nutz2!

We haven't seen or heard anything more than what you read above. There's not much of a market for student-sized ex-Soviet acoustics, AFAIK. It's worth whatever someone will pay you for it- who knows what that amount is?

My only suggestion is the same one I made to Black Angus back in 2010- post it to one of those other sites and see if you can find out more information.

[classjazz]

Thank you for your input.
trying to figure out if its a solid cedar top.
I can't see any plywood around the edge of the soundhole.

It sure looks and sounds cool.

Best

[kuupik]

Hey!

I have one too! It has these stickers inside: Would be great to find out more about the guitar because it was left for me by my grandfather.

[newey]

Kuupik-

Hello and Welcome to G-Nutz2!

The stickers are probably supremely helpful. How's your Russian?

On the sticker to the far right in your photo, the first word is "Gitara"; OK, pretty obvious. After that, however- well, let's just say that I took one semester of Russian 101, and got a "D". This was about forty years ago. Enough said.

[kuupik]

Hey! Cheers.

My russian skills are limited to know that theyre just opening their mouthes and sound comes out

If someone knows someone from russia it'd be great to know what that means... Even google translate doesn't help cause I can't write them letters in there

[newey]

The first sticker. the one that starts out "Gitara", seems to be the model number and the name/address of the maker. More than that, I can't tell. The wording on the second sticker is partially obscured by the strings, so if you can get a better photo that might help, too. I don't think you'd need to de-string it, you can probably slide a smartphone underneath the strings at the hole

[Deleted]

Here we go :
Guitar
Article no : 367
RTU-RSFSR 672-60 (it must be abbreviation to smth)
Price : 25 Rubles
Guarantee to : 9 months

City of Leningrad, P61
25 Chalaeva Str

....

and this came with minimal Serbian that i know....

[Deleted]

Slavic music interests me a lot. Actually my minimal contacts with ex-Yugoslavia got me into a magical world (and not only music-related), and opened the doors not only to the balkans but to almost half of europe, as well.

Anyways, since this is about guitars, here is some really interesting guitar from Russia :

Seven-string traditional guitar : en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_guitar


Also there are the guitars with this headstock :


which look like the same design with those from northern Serbia :


After seeing identical designs, shared by nations who have been separated for more than 1500 years, leads me to think that maybe the guitar was invented in eastern europe... The wealth of designs but also the presence of similar designs across a very wide geographical regions strengthens this argument as well.