Unique Strat Wiring

[middy]

I'm trying to design a circuit for a strat wiring scheme, but I have little idea what I'm doing so I need help.

Here's what I want to do:

The strat will have a 3-way switch like a 50s strat. I don't like 5-way switches or the quack tones.

The first tone will be the master tone for the switch.

The second tone will be a push-pull pot that will override the 3-way switch setting and activate the neck+bridge pickups in parallel. I will also serve as the tone pot for this setting.

Assuming the push-pull switch lugs are like this:

AB
CD
EF

where C is connected to E and D is connected to F when the switch is down.

I'm thinking that I can run leads from the neck and bridge input lugs on the 3-way switch to lug D, then leads from lug B to the volume and tone2 pots.

Then run a lead from the common lugs on the 3-way switch to lug C, and from lug E to the volume pot. The second pole lugs on the 3-way switch will be jumpered together to use tone1.

Will this work? If not, is this configuration even possible with a single DPDT switch?

[middy]

Thinking about this more...

I don't think it's possible. I think I would need to wire it for master tone like a tele, and replace tone2 with a 3PDT toggle switch.

Am I wrong?

[asmith]

Hey Middy, welcome to GuitarNutz2 - The Ampere Strikes Back.

You can connect the neck and bridge together in parallel and bypass the 3-way switch with a DPDT with no problem. But to add a specific tone control in there as well would require an extra pole. You'd need a pole to connect the neck and bridge together, a pole to connect the 3-way switch bypass to the pickups, and a pole to add the tone control into the mix.

That's the start of an old joke. 'Three Poles find themselves connecting in a 3-way...'

However, if you're comfortable with just a master tone control, you can wire your Strat like this.



That bypasses the switch and puts the Neck and Bridge pickups in parallel.

Depends what you wish to do. You could turn another tone into a separate volume control for the Neck or the Bridge, giving you a range of sound on the Neck+Bridge, perhaps.

[middy]

Hey, thanks!

I didn't even think of running through the push-pull first.

So I could wire the push-pull that way and bypass the tone pots altogether when in neck+bridge mode, and if I left everything else the same I would get normal tone pot function in 3-way switch mode, correct?

Man, it's too bad they don't make a 3PDT push-pull pot...

[asmith]

So I could wire the push-pull that way and bypass the tone pots altogether when in neck+bridge mode, and if I left everything else the same I would get normal tone pot function in 3-way switch mode, correct?

You can do that, sure. You only need two poles - one to swap between the tone control and the '3-way switch bypass,' and one to connect the Neck and Bridge together.

It'd look like this.

Click here for the old schematic.

Man, it's too bad they don't make a 3PDT push-pull pot...

You're goddamned right it is!

EDIT: Wait, you want to bypass both tone controls in Neck+Bridge mode, but in regular mode, you want the tone controls to work individually on the Middle and Neck pickups?



Boom.

[sumgai]

Jan 17, 2011 11:52:22 GMT -5 asmith said:

...welcome to GuitarNutz2 - The Ampere Strikes Back.

Now that was uncalled for..... I'm gonna have ta +1 ya, just ta keep ya in line. There, take that!

[sumgai]

Ace,

Hate to be the bearer of bad tidings, especially after sicking Rollie on ya, but in every diagram you've drawn so far, the Middle pup is still in play.... iow, it can be selected for use, no matter what position the P-P DPDT switch is in.

Me, I'd take this as a good thing, I happen to like that particular combo. But middy did say:

Jan 17, 2011 10:45:33 GMT -5 middy said:

The second tone will be a push-pull pot that will override the 3-way switch setting and activate the neck+bridge pickups in parallel.

I'm not sayin' anything here, I'm just sayin, ya know......


Well, I guess I could say that if you look at the whole rig a little longer, you'll find the solution.... just move a few wires, and it'll truly be Boom! time. ;D

HTH









sumgai

[asmith]

...in every diagram you've drawn so far, the Middle pup is still in play...

Alright, alright.

Click here for the old schematic.

Aha!

EDIT: The Death Star exploding was a little premature. In that latest diagram, the tone controls are still active in positions 1 and 3. Gawddamn. Back to the drawing board, to see if this is even possible.

EDIT #2: It is.

[sumgai]

Ace,

That did it!

The key, to me at least, was that in order to bypass the pickup selector switch entirely, the output jack/Vol pot was going to have to be able to choose between said switch, or the B+N combo.

But in your defense, I still like the idea of having all three pups in parallel. Some players don't like it, others do. In fact, at one point along my timeline, I eliminated N+M and M+B - whenever I needed "quack", I just went for "all three", and it was all over but the shouting.

And sadly, we all agree that the switch manufacturing industry is woefully lacking, when it comes to listening to instrument players/modders/owners/luthiers. As far as specialty stuff goes, they're almighty short-sighted, to say the least. In order to achieve middy's desired tone-pot selectability, we really do need that third pole.

HTH


~!~!~!~!~!~!~

BTW......

middy,

In case I forgot to say it:

Hi, and to the NutzHouse!




sumgai

[4real]

And sadly, we all agree that the switch manufacturing industry is woefully lacking, when it comes to listening to instrument players/modders/owners/luthiers. As far as specialty stuff goes, they're almight short-sighted, to say the least. In order to achieve middy's desired tone-pot selectability, we really do need that third pole.

Ahhh...but if you really, really have to have it...there is often a way if prepared to make it! We've seen recently ganging together 4 selectors...and although I took them out, my "uber pots" contained not only a dpdt push pull but a 4pdt side selector and a pot in one. They really did work, basically rigged a rotating mechanism to switch too tiny dpdt switches simultaneously...a bit too tricky to make though...so...

A couple of months ago, someone pointed toward the switch used in fenders 'elusive' S-1 which is a push-push action and it had me thinking.

You could make a 'cage' perhaps out of aluminium to house the switch and a pot and spring the pot on say neoprene (wet suit material...cut up a mouse mat)...you might be able to make a latching push push pot in this way where the back of the pot pressed the switch and bounced back...probably need to screw the cage in though and it would be hard to know what was selected by eye....perhaps a conventional 4pdt is the most practical solution...but if one were really keen, I dare say it could be done with enough 'will and ingenuity'...

...

I quite like the all three parallel setting, not a 'must have' like i find the N+B these days...kind of "soft" sounding in my guitar...interesting sound though.


I had a cheap strat wired with a mid pickup volume control that made some really nice sounds with a three way...standard n,n+b,b selections with a kind of dial a quack control.

Interestingly it had phase switches and out of phase the mid quack control seemed to do the opposite of quack and add in a bit of midrange boost.

[5150]

HI! New member here. I think these forums are excellent. I wasn't sure if this post should be in wiring or capacitor thread. I was thinking tone pot for bridge and the other for neck with separate capacitor for each. Wiring them so each pot/cap/pickup circuit is independent of the other (three toggle switches instead of the 5 way) Will this work or will they add their values together?

2nd brainstorm: use a variable capacitor possibly mounted so that it can be dialed in by removing the back cover?

[5150]

So I rewired: The bridge pickup through a Fwd/Rev phase push pull awitch on the bottom of a 250K pot with "Grease Bucket" caps & 4.7K for tone control on the bridge pickup only. The neck pickup through another 250K pot with standard .022uf cap, the push pull switch on it engages the neck pickup to the bridge at the 5way switch. Middle pickup open tone. I REALLY like the variation of tones! I'm using D'Addario EXL 115's. I decide not to make these changes to the other one, why have two guitars sound exactly the same?

[newey]

5150-

Sorry that no one welcomed you appropriately last month, so let me belatedly offer you a "Hello and Welcome"!

In any event, it looks like you answered your own question.

But:

the push pull switch on it engages the neck pickup to the bridge at the 5way switch.

Not sure what you mean here. Do you have a diagram of what you did?

[5150]

Thank You! I will post the schematic asap.