hehehe new project idea

[frobro808]

ive recently rekindled my love of the dead... the greatful dead that is...
after further researching them i found out that jerry garcia had an insane setup and an insane guitar.
im sure you folks know how he has an fx loop in his guitar and does this using a mono to stero cable.
this raised some cute ideas in my head and now i have to ask the experts.

whats good about it? is it possible for a beginner such as myself to do it? would i be able to modify my already modified guitar with it?
and finally what are te drawbacks?

thank you for your replies in advance and for your unwavering patience
-frobro808

[newey]

frobro-

Garcia had several custom guitars, notably the most famous two were "Tiger" and "Wolf". Here's the only info I have on Tiger:

www.dozin.com/jers/guitars/tiger/info.html

It wasn't a mono-to stereo setup; he was using a TRS jack and cable to carry the signal for the effects loop out to a "Y" box, which would then connect to the effects, and then the extra conductor on the TRS cable would carry the "effects out" signal back into the guitar, to the volume and tone controls, etc. This allowed onboard control of the effects without actually having the effects in the guitar, and meant that the effects "saw" the full pickup signal, before the resistance of the pots was added.

Whether you can do this or not to your guitar is going to depend on what you have in there already, how much extra room you have and how willing you are to make more room if necessary. A custom guitar means the builder makes the extra space from the outset, it doesn't have to be jury-rigged later.

[sumgai]

frobie,

newey's correct in that it can be done, but there are things to consider before attempting it. Let's get the ball rolling....

First - what kind of guitar are you contemplating on doing this to?




sumgai

[frobro808]

Ought I got the cable part but I wasn't aware that both ends had were Tip,ring,sleeve (right?). But yes this is true I don't really have much room left in the guitar as is and I'd hate to ruin an awesome axe by trying too hard. I guess I just have to save up 8-10k to buy me one of them alembic guitars. Thanks guys!

-frobro808

[sumgai]

..... or buy a $75-100 cheapie off of craigslist/eBay, and not worry about how chopped up it looks. So long as it sounds cool, that is.

Remember, many a Nutzy axe has started out costing less than a ticket to a Jimmy Buffet concert. And if you like the way it all turns out, you can always do it again with (or just transfer the stuff to) a nicer axe.... if you should happen to feel the need.



sumgai

[frobro808]

touche' good sir

idk if this question will have to be transfered to another section but what is an "effects loop out to a "Y" box" and where can i find one and/or how do i make one?

because if i do go through with this (buying a cheapie and modding the snap out of it), which i am so devastatingly tempted to, im assuming i need to get/make that as well for it to actually work am i right?
-frobro808

[newey]

"effects loop out to a "Y" box" and where can i find one and/or how do i make one?

This is all custom stuff, so you're on your own. Whether anyone has a schematic or not, I don't know. And the limited info given in the article I linked to doesn't tell us everything.

I assume you clicked through to the schematic of the guitar, which at least shows the internals, including the onboard preamp (although not the PC layout of that):




What I took from this was that the signal, post-preamp, went out the TRS jack via the tip and sleeve conductors (or any 2 thereof) of a 3-conductor TRS cable, to a "Y" splitter box, which routed the signal to a std TS jack for the "effects loop out".

Then through various pedals and back into the "Y", via a TS "FX loop in" jack, and then back up to the guitar along the ring and sleeve conductors.

Once the signal is back into the guitar, then it goes to the V & T controls. And then out through a regular TS jaxck to the amp.

Just like car stereo wiring, the negative conductor (usually the sleeve but doesn't have to be) is shared between both channels. Here, one channel is the "gozoutta" and the other is the "gozinta", but it's the same idea.

JohnH has a circuit for an onboard unity gain buffer, that would be a start for you. And there is a general diagram of a "Y" box from flateric in the Effects section- but not with the fancy TRS wiring however.

The 2 main advantages with this type of setup are, first, only one cord goes out of the guitar to the FX loop, so you don't have 3 cables running off the guitar (one for output, 2 for the loop). And the controls on the guitar allow you to adjust the effects level and tone without reaching down to the box(es).

[frobro808]

sry for the late response. i have no internet when it storms by my house...

but oh sweet jesus that is beautiful. i found lots of explanations but no diagrams like that!
thank you for your help good sir!