2 volumes help please!

[jimbop]

hi chaps,

looked everywhere for a schematic with no joy.

my setup is..

HSH, 2 volumes, no tone, 5 way import switch. no coil tapping but I still want the B,BM,M,NM,N switch combo.

if my switch is NMBCCBMN do I wire the pups on the 1st NMB then each volume on a different C?

are the hots from each volume kept separate? and then connect to the jack?

any help greatly appreciated!!

thanx,
jim.

[newey]

Jimbop-

Hello and Welcome to G-Nutz2!

if my switch is NMBCCBMN

First off, are you sure that's how it is? Every one I've seen has been NMBCCNMB (usually designated as "321CC321")

Offshore Lever Switches

Better check it with a meter to be sure, as everything else depends upon that being correctly described.

do I wire the pups on the 1st NMB

Yes.

then each volume on a different C?

That depends. What do you want these 2 volume controls to control?

Let's assume you wanted one volume for the bridge, and one for the N and M together, just for purposes of illustration. Your pickups go, as you indicated, to the one pole of the switch, and that pole's Common lug ("C") goes to the output jack.

The bridge volume control would then go to the "B" lug on the other switch pole, and the neck/middle V would go to the N (or M) lug, and then the N and M lugs would be jumpered together. That pole's C lug then goes to output (i.e., both C lugs are jumpered together)

Note that, if that is indeed what you plan, you'll have both Vol controls active when in the B + M setting (position 2, as usually designated) on the 5-way switch. The two pots will interact at that position.

[jimbop]

thanx for the quick response mate

yep! that's exactly what I want...volume for bridge and volume2 for neck and middle.

wired like this?'''''



______
[ [
NMBCCNMB
[_] [ [_] [
[ [
[_____ [

LOL! soz about the st diagram, its supposed to be both poles N&M linked then jumpers between both bridges and both neck or middles?

both volume pots active when BM selected sounds good
cheers,
jim.

edit: silly diagram gets corrupted when I post.

[col]

Apr 18, 2013 6:01:44 GMT -5 jimbop said:

thanx
______
[ [
NMBCCNMB
[_] [ [_] [
[ [
[_____ [

edit: silly diagram gets corrupted when I post.

Monospace is your friend.

I did something similar in my first post to Guitarnutz. You need to do two things. First, use monospace font so that all characters are the same width. Second, use a spacing character for blank spaces, as spaces greater than 2(?) characters are automatically removed. I used stops, but coloured the stops white so that they do not show against the white background.

Apr 17, 2012 22:24:09 GMT -5 col said:

..^
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How I did it:


[font=monospace][size=3]
[color=white]..[/color]^
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1[color=white]...[/color]2
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2[color=white]...[/color]4
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Hope that helps.

[b4nj0]

Maybe it's worth pointing out here that Proboards does offer options of colour scheme. I have used an image of a signature and set it as white writing on a black background so it blended into the dark scheme of the forum. Then I noticed that it looked daft on a white scheme. This is similar to webmasters having to take into account all the different ways that various browsers render their creations. It follows that your carefully created diagram may not display as you intended on all contributor's computers.
I haven't tried it, but perhaps <alt-shift-255> would work for spaces in all cases?

[jimbop]

thanx chaps,

I think it must be easier to upload a sketch [jpg] than play around with characters n fonts

hopefully 'Newey' might understand my feeble explanation and save me the trouble.

jim.

[newey]

I don't think you've quite got it.

And, neither did I, as for some reason I was thinking "tone pots" instead of volume pots. Chalk it up to the first cup of coffee this a.m. Ignore what I said before, let's start over.

A picture would be worth, as they say, a thousand words.

But, there's no need to reinvent the wheel- it just so happens we have such a picture. As is usual around this joint, JohnH to the rescue!

JohnH's Strat with 2 volumes

This diagram is easily adapted to what you want. Four notes:

• JohnH's scheme is for three SC Strat pickups (He also has HSS and HHH), you have a HSH set-up. But since you're not splitting the coils of the HB, you just treat each HB as a two-wire SC and use the SSS diagram.
  
  
• JohnH's diagram shows the switch as a regular USA Strat-style switch, not the import=style switch that you have. But you can use the link I gave you above to translate the switch lugs between the two types of switches. Essentially, they're the same. Both have 2 poles, 2 common lugs, and 3 lugs to each pole, for a total of eight.
  
  You should also note that, often, on these import-style switches, the two commons lugs are joined together at the factory by a tiny little wire jumper (This is done because, in a regular Strat scheme, the two are jumpered together). Look closely, the wire is easily missed as sometimes it is behind the lugs. This wire needs to be removed for JohnH's scheme to work, since he uses one pole of the switch for the N + M volume and pickups, while the bridge pickup is wired to the opposite pole of the switch.
  
  
• JohnH's diagram includes "treble bleed" circuitry, in the form of a cap and resistor across each volume pot. These are optional (but recommended by many, including me).
  
  
• One main feature of JohnH's design is a dual-gang tone control, the third pot in his scheme. Since you're not going with a tone control, you can simply eliminate this pot. Just trace all the connections JohnH has to the dual-gang tone pot and eliminate those wires in your scheme.
  

"Done is."

[jimbop]

jesus, this wiring lark can be baffling!

well ill give this a go on the weekend.

I understand pole 1, N and M and C output to neck/mid vol.

pole 2 I cant grasp, B pup goes straight to bridge vol not to the switch.
looks good though thanx again for all your help!

one last question.....

I see the jumper between lugs 1 +2 for N + M, if I added a jumper on 2+3 would that make the bridge pup 'on' all the time or allow mixing with bridge in all positions?
not really sure what im after here but its nice to know what permutations are there!

cheers,
jim.

[newey]

I understand pole 1, N and M and C output to neck/mid vol.

pole 2 I cant grasp, B pup goes straight to bridge vol not to the switch.

The way JohnH did this is really an elegant way of solving the problem. Sonce the bridge has its own volume, no need to use the switch to handle it, it can be just wired "across" the bridge pickup. The output of the bridge pickup/pot "module" then goes to the switch so that it can be appropriately selected.

You can think of JohnH's diagram this way. The pole of the switch that is towards the top of the diagram can be thought of as the "output buss". The common lug from that pole goes to the output, and the three lugs ("N,M and B" or "3,2 and 1") determine what module goes to output. It selects either the bridge pickup/pot module or the neck/mid pickups/pots module.

And, to answer your other question, if you were to jumper all three of these lugs together, yes, the bridge pickup would always be on in all 5 switch positions.

The other pole, the lower one as shown on the diagram, selects whether the N or M, or both, will output to the N/M Vol. pot. The N/M Vol. pot "module" is then output to the upper pole of the switch, as described above.

While one can certainly do wiring as a "paint-by-numbers" exercise, it's a lot better if one understands how the wiring works. This is particularly so when it comes to troubleshooting problems.

To facilitate this, and so that you have a wiring diagram of your exact scheme with which you can solder, I suggest you take JohnH's diagram and redraw it, substituting your switch and eliminating the tone control, and using your pickup's wire colors if they differ from the diagram. This will help your understanding, and will allow us to check your work before you dive into the soldering.

[jimbop]

To facilitate this, and so that you have a wiring diagram of your exact scheme with which you can solder, I suggest you take JohnH's diagram and redraw it, substituting your switch and eliminating the tone control, and using your pickup's wire colors if they differ from the diagram. This will help your understanding, and will allow us to check your work before you dive into the soldering.

thanx very much, ill take you up on that offer.

and regarding treble bleeds, yep, I use them. I usually don't use resistors though. I was gonna use a .068 on bridge and .1 on neck. if the .068 is a bit too 'shrill' would a 100k resistor tame the treble a bit?

cheers,
jim.

[newey]

Once again, JohnH has the answers you seek. He generally recommends, based upon his research, a 150K resistor and a 1nf cap. In the past, he was recommending 220K for the resistor, but he's changed that as a result of some further work on this.

JohnH's "A Better Treble Bleed Circuit

[jimbop]

hopefully this is correct!

cheers,
jim.

[newey]

That looks good, although it looks like you have a stray red wire from the bridge volume pot to the back of that pot. It's actually the wire for the treble bleed, I think, in which case you're good to go.

I assume this is just a consequence of the 2D drawing, but you don't want the center lug of that pot connected to ground, in case that was the intent.

You will also need to ground the backs of both Vol pots together, as you have all the pickup grounds going to the one, and the output jack grounded to the other. It may be that the shafts of both pots connect to shielding on the underside of the pickguard- but that's shielding, and should not be relied upon for carrying signal.

Otherwise, it looks good! But, it's always a good idea to get a second opinion hereabouts. Someone will be along shortly, I'm sure . . .

[jimbop]

thanx mate, yes I do run an earth from pot to pot and its only the end lugs that are earthed..other wires being the treble bleed.

now if I get some time tomorrow, ill have a bash at this. probably run a few temp wires to a breadboard to try some treb bleed combos.
thanx again for all your help.

cheers,
jim.