NGD : chopper in strat's neck position.

[Deleted]

NGD : chopper in strat's neck position, FT1 moves to middle, FT2 stays in bridge

Hello, yesterday night, i installed the chopper in my Aria strat. That's my first guitar, dating back to 1984. The configuration before i installed the chopper used to be : Fast Track 1 (neck), Aria SC (middle ), Fast Track 2 (bridge). I also had push/pull (dimarzio) switch for choosing between in series and coil splitting for both FT1, and FT2.
Now, given it was dark yesterday night, and the artificial light didn't help much, and other restrictions, i thought of temporarily giving up the idea of using the existing push/pull pot + one additional that i bought planning to use them for controlling in series/parallel wiring for both the FT1/FT2. I was in a hurry to listen to the Chopper and could sacrifice some fancy wiring for the moment.
The configuration was just as dimrazio's site, and Luijo from dimarzioforum.com as well recommended : Chopper (neck), FT1 (middle), FT2 (bridge).
The result was really good : Chopper sounds really loud and articulate. Notes sound very clear. At certain EQ settings, power-wise, i'd say it can even sound louder than the FT2!! But generally it balances very good with FT2.
The FT1 in the middle sounds really good as well. Just a quality type of tone that i never had in any middle position combination i had.

I have a question tho. By reading dimarzio's site, my Kohm readings for FT2 are a little bit off. Here is what i get :

Pickup	Nominal Resistance (as per DM)	My readings unwired	My readings wired
Fast_Track1	5.78 KOhm	5.8 KOhm	5.5 KOhm
Chopper	9.16 KOhm	9 KOhm	8.6 KOhm
Fast_Track2	18.07 KOhm	17.3 KOhm	16.3 KOhm

I know that the manufacturer's reading are no longer valid after the pup is fully connected to the pots, i was just wandering if my readings for Fast Track 2 imply any kind of abnormal situation. The pup sounds good as it used to, nothing changed tone-wise, and i am not even sure about FT1's KOhm readings before i did this installation.

[Deleted]

After having played the guitar for some time in the morning and evening, i have to say, i really like the new setup. Neck pickup (chopper) sounds 100% balanced with bridge (FT2), while FT1 gives nice tones in the middle, smth i never got from other pickups.
Chopper sounds really great for shred type music, yngwie, but blues, jazz as well. Much much better, louder and *less* muddier than FT1 was in the neck. FT1 now in the middle has a new life on its own!
Also, i have to say, that the construction is of superb quality. Comparing with the FT2/FT1 which i bought some 15 years ago, this new chopper seems improved. Of course FT1/FT2 never had a single problem all those years, just noting what i observed from visual inspection.
Well done Dimarzio!! i really dig the new sounds!!

Just wandering if parallel switching would give smth more in the "quack" department. The "quack" i currently get in positions 2-4 (all pups in series), is more modern (80s+), than traditional (dire-straits) type of quack. With the old configuration (generic Aria SC middle + coil split FT2), in position 4 (middle/bridge) i got better (to my ears) quack.

And something more : in both the current and previous setup, when in full humbucking in series mode, and turning the tone to 1, both pups FT2/FT1 produced a kind of ugly sound. FT2, tho, in the previous setup, with coil splitting, and tone to 1 (i have connected bridge pup to middle tone pot, via an extra capacitor), produced this fantastic "shine on you crazy diamond" kind of tone. I really dug this tone. Could i get smth similar with parallel switching?

[Deleted]

And some photos :

[newey]

GD-

Your resistance readings are only roughly 5% off of DiMarzio's numbers. Every manufacturer of electronic equipment builds things to a certain tolerance; no two units are ever going to be absolutely identical. I don't know what DM's manufacturing tolerances are, but they're probably closer to 10% than to 5%, so your pickups are likely well within the tolerances.

The second thing is that the same concept of manufacturer's tolerances applies to your multimeter; it's a different meter than DM used. There may well be a 5% variance, plus or minus, with your readings as well. So, taking those things together, the pickups are probably right at factory specs, plus or minus the tolerances.

As far as the elusive "quack" is concerned, a split HB coil is never quite the same as a true SC pickup, so the fact that you've changed the middle pup probably accounts for that change. Whether parallel HBs would give you more "quack", I don't know, I've never used these pickups. But I have used parallel HB configurations on several guitars, I like it better than coil splitting as it is brighter than series wiring and retains the hum-cancelling. But I wouldn't call what you get "quack".

[Deleted]

Thanx newey, with parallel i think i will definitely get more quack (as in "sultans of swing") than in series. Next mod will be parallel/series wiring for the chopper/FT2.

[bluemurder]

Jan 5, 2014 4:41:38 GMT -5 @pyrros said:

I have a question tho. By reading dimarzio's site, my Kohm readings for FT2 are a little bit off. Here is what i get :

Pickup	Nominal Resistance (as per DM)	My readings unwired	My readings wired
Fast_Track1	5.78 KOhm	5.8 KOhm	5.5 KOhm
Chopper	9.16 KOhm	9 KOhm	8.6 KOhm
Fast_Track2	18.07 KOhm	17.3 KOhm	16.3 KOhm

I know that the manufacturer's reading are no longer valid after the pup is fully connected to the pots, i was just wandering if my readings for Fast Track 2 imply any kind of abnormal situation. The pup sounds good as it used to, nothing changed tone-wise, and i am not even sure about FT1's KOhm readings before i did this installation.

These numbers appear perfectly normal. Even room temperature affects the DC resistance so you may get slightly different readings on two given days.

Cheers Stephan

[Deleted]

Just came back from this, with the additional following mods :
- DIY no-load push/pull tone pot for neck
- parallel/series wiring for both the chopper and fast track 2. (neck/bridge).

All i can describe the result is just astonishing .... 9 beautiful hum-free tones covering a very wide range of tones.

After the tone pot mod, the chopper is liberated, lots of highs. In parallel i get almost SC shrill-ness.

I really think that the chopper *needs* a no-load tone pot, or 1M pot. Best combo for me is 500Kohm push/pull no-load pot (smth that does not exist in the market and needs a small mod). The chopper sings treble at whatever proportions i might wish.

Really nice tones in parallel. Parallel alone was worth all the 3 hours i put into planning/executing the mod... Chopper in parallel is phenomenal. Nothing like the non-existence of FT1 in split mode. Balances *really well* with FT2 in parallel. FT2 in parallel also was a very pleasant surprise. Absolute quack in position 4. I love this. And in case i forgot to say... I REALLY love the new setup!!

next mod?? add bridge in all positions with one additional push/pull dimarzio EP1201PP 500K pot, which i will also convert to no-load pot (covering bridge/middle).

After this last mode i think the guitar will be more than i will ever need ... ever.... ALL tones from 50s to thrash metal and from jazz to dire straits...

Also another note that i suspected and luckily i was right :

in parallel both FT2 and Chopper give fantastic tones with the tone knob dialed to 0. In bridge imagine smth like " crazy diamond".

In parallel with tone to 10 and distorted it gets into hard rock strat territories (yngwie, deep purple, etc...).

In series it gives the usual humbucking tones....

Big sounding guitar.... worth the burn i got on my thumb!! i hope it will be the last burn with this guitar.

To anyone wanting to perform those mods : dimarzio cables are really stiff, i had a hard time fitting the pickguard into place.

[Deleted]

Latest incarnation : add bridge to all positions :





From the 8 additional sounds, i find only 1 interesting : the one with neck in full in-series HB mode, in parallel with bridge also in full in-series HB mode. This is a sound i never had in any of guitars before, and it reminds me strongly of a tele-country type of sound. For some reason it does not sound like an LP in the middle position but rather as a tele!
Now, with all 3 pups in parallel, i didn't care for that sounds. With pups in parallel, it seems the weakest one dominates the result, and since FT1 is by far weaker than FT2/Chopper, the end result is rather poor. But for only the aforementioned B+N tone, the mod was worth trying.

The guitar has reached the 9+8 = 17 tones! i can't think of anything more that would be interesting, (out of phase is not my sound), so i guess this guitar has reached its final state, (until smth breaks

[JohnH]

You seem to do mods a similar way to me, just adding one or two things at a time until there's a bit more than you need, and then stop. I think its a good way and lets the tones in the particular guitar determine the direction that you go.

I see it a bit like getting into a perfectly well made bed, where there's only one place in the middle to lie, and you just want to push out and expand the range, and then when you are done, probably lie in the middle again.

[sumgai]

Feb 12, 2014 6:38:21 GMT -5 JohnH said:

..... a bit like getting into a perfectly well made bed, where there's only one place in the middle to lie, and you just want to push out and expand the range...

I like to "lie in the middle" too, but if the wife ever found out that I sometimes "expand the range", I'm sure that my days of doing such would quickly come to an abrupt and irreversible halt!

One of those "be careful what you wish for...." kind of things, ya know?

[ux4484]

GD...

Clean those knobs, will ya!

[Deleted]

Feb 12, 2014 15:53:10 GMT -5 ux4484 said:

GD...

Clean those knobs, will ya!

Man, ppl pay fortunes for relic instruments these days

[ux4484]

That's not relic, it looks like you rebuilt the transmission from your car and then played guitar!

[Deleted]

Or just that the knobs are 30 yrs old and countin'

[ux4484]

I'm just so OCD about that stuff. If my guitar knobs looked like that, I'd be washing my hands after playing it as well as before.
It goes back to high school, I was playing someone else's bass viol for orchestra who was out sick, I went to lunch without washing my hands first, and was puking my guts out the next morning.
A few minutes soaking in Dow bathroom cleaner and a quick swipe with a toothbrush will clean those right up.
Are the shafts too long, or are the knobs not fully seated?

[lunaalta]

I'm just so OCD about that stuff. If my guitar knobs looked like that, I'd be washing my hands after playing it as well as before.
It goes back to high school, I was playing someone else's bass viol for orchestra who was out sick, I went to lunch without washing my hands first, and was puking my guts out the next morning.
A few minutes soaking in Dow bathroom cleaner and a quick swipe with a toothbrush will clean those right up.
Are the shafts too long, or are the knobs not fully seated?

I was gonna post a pic of my 'old' knobs ('73 Strat) to show the yellowing, but, after looking at them, I decided not to.
They would probably send Ux off to the hospital, just looking at the pix......
Sorry..........
They are in a mild soap solution, soaking, right now. The tooth brush is at the ready...... mustn't remove the gold paint......

Man, ppl pay fortunes for relic instruments these days

Do you guys remember the rag that was for sale on Ebay, some years ago? It was found inside the case of a 60s LP, I believe.
The seller claimed it held 50+ years worth of kudos, or something..... yuck!

[Deleted]

Feb 13, 2014 4:22:51 GMT -5 ux4484 said:

A few minutes soaking in Dow bathroom cleaner and a quick swipe with a toothbrush will clean those right up.

Ux, thanx for the tips, i think i must clean them, however i doubt they carry more diseases than keys or money.

Feb 13, 2014 4:22:51 GMT -5 ux4484 said:

Are the shafts too long, or are the knobs not fully seated?

It's called push/pull pots

[ux4484]

Then that begs the question: Are they in the pulled position?

I went through a couple supposed "short" shafted p/p on my Cortez Tele project before getting the right one that would look stock height when pushed down.
Of course it was a drag waiting on one part to finish a mod when I had one that would work... But again with the OCD.

[Deleted]

Yes, they are in pulled position. When in pushed position they give just enough room for the two middle fingers to pull them up.

[Deleted]

Hi,

my son dropped the guitar. After that, the Kohm readings on the chopper in series (with the pup installed with the rest of the circuit) are very unstable. I get everything from 10Kohm -> 19 Kohm. Nominally this should be about 9 Kohm. The rest of the pups are pretty stable at their measurements. The guitar sounds good, all positions seem to work as expected.

What could cause the unstable KOhm readings on the chopper ?

[newey]

I would say a bad connection after the drop, but you say everything is working properly. How fresh are the batteries in your meter?

[Deleted]

the other pups measure stable. its only the chopper which goes crazy. I was experimenting a little bit with touching the push/pull pot which turns the chopper into parallel/series, and when i push this down real hard, for some reason, the reading returns to normal ~ 8.6-9 KOhm. Also, afterwards, in parallel it reads ~ 2.2 KOhm which again is the correct value. But it goes crazy again if i play with the pot many times.
I'll have to re-open this guitar, and its a shame since i spent many sleepless late nights making this.

anyways, thanx Newey and happy Easter to everybody.

[Deleted]

the thing i am suspecting is that the grounding of the pot is not perfect, creating some random additional kohms. the pup grouning was done wih the top clipper solderless trick, (it is almot imposible to solder on them anyway) , and the pot grounding is done via the chassis and the aluminum shield, which is connected to regular pot via its chassis, via the aluminum, and also via its soldered top to the bridge.
This guitar has originl aluminum back from 1984 and this is smth i guess has smth to do.