torren61
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Post by torren61 on Oct 22, 2017 11:35:43 GMT -5
I just found this site today. I'm looking forward to reading a lot. I have a couple of questions and I'll thank you in advance for any help. The first one MAY be a bit complicated but here goes. I have two Sheptone humbuckers and an old NOS Bill Lawrence single coil. The Bill Lawrence is a Keystone K-200 MS. Here is the wiring diagram for it: And instructions: If I was just wiring in that single pup, it'd be a piece of cake but I want to put it in between the two humbuckers. The wiring color codes for the Sheptones are: I intend to put these into a Strat body. I'll be using three pots and a 5 way blade switch. How would you wire this? The Keystone needs to have it's own tone pot. The second may be easier. I have a Gibson T-top humbucker and two '60s Fender Mustang single coils. Those will go into this: Do I need to use a 500k pot and a 250k pot? So two volumes and one tone? It'll have a 5 way blade switch but I can use three pots or less. How would YOU wire it? Any help would be greatly appreciated.
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torren61
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Post by torren61 on Oct 22, 2017 11:46:04 GMT -5
I found John Hewitt's two volume HSS thread. Looks like that solves my second question. Thanks John!
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Post by newey on Oct 24, 2017 5:55:38 GMT -5
torren61-
Hello and Welcome to G-Nutz2!
No one answered your first question:
So, let me take a stab at that . . .
First, if all you want is the standard Strat-style wiring and you're not doing any coil cutting of the HBs, it's really pretty simple. The white and green wires from each HB are soldered together (tape the connection off to avoid it making contact with something in the cavity). The red and black wires are then wired just like the two wires from a single coil pickup, so you can use any stock Strat wiring diagram. (Red goes to the switch, black to ground)
The tone pots can then be wired as per std Strat wiring as well. This will give you neck and middle tone pots, so the middle SC will have its own pot- except at position 4 on the 5-way switch (N + M pickups), where both pots will be active. This is not a new issue, every Strat has that, it's inherent in the design. It shouldn't be any more of an issue with your Keystone than any other middle pickup.
On the other hand, if you want to do coil cutting with the HBs, that will get more involved, so report back.
Also, since you will be using two different brands of pickups, it is a good idea to test for phasing between the middle pickup and the HBs. There is a post in the reference section showing how to do this- the "screwdriver pull-off test". If you don't test in advance, you have a 50-50 chance of getting it right, but if you lose that bet, it means destringing and removing the pickguard to swap the wiring around on the middle pickup. On an LP type guitar, where you can just open an access plate to get at the wiring, no big deal, but on a Strat type guitar it's best to check it first.
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torren61
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Post by torren61 on Oct 24, 2017 20:47:31 GMT -5
Hey Newey! Thanks for the reply. I think I'm going to keep it relatively simple. I searched through the site and found John's thread about one volume and two tones. The Keystone needs its own tone pot. So that problem got solved the first day! Woot! The second one is where I'd ask about using a 500k pot or a 250k pot. Considering I'm going to use two single coils and one hb, do I need two volumes and one tone (one volume for the single coils and one for the hb)? Can I use a lower value pot, say a 330k and use it for all three pups? Would I need to use a 250k and add a 250k resistor in line with the hb so it sees a 500k pot? I build power lines for a living and I assemble guitars for fun but I've actually never mixed humbuckers and single coils in an assembly before. (I say "assembly" because I don't build the necks or bodies, I only do the finishing, wiring, assembly and set ups.) You look cold in your avatar. Btw, the snow, is that "nationwide"? See what I did there?
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Post by newey on Oct 24, 2017 21:33:35 GMT -5
Not so much a question of what you need- what do you want? The two volumes will help adjust the HB down a bit if it swamps the SCs. But Fender makes SSH Strats with a single volume and folks seem to like them just fine. Of course, if the HB is of a "hotter" overwound style, then the separate V controls may be more useful. Follow JohnH's advice and use a dual-gang pot for the tone control so as to minimize interaction of the controls. Yes, or you can use 250K pots all around. Or 500K. I doubt you could tell an audible difference between 330K and 250K pots. You probably could between 250K and 500K, though. Also bear in mind that most pots used in guitars have a manufacturer's tolerance of plus/minus 10%, meaning your 250K pots could be anywhere from 225K to 275K in actuality; 330K ones can thus vary from 297K to 366K. So if you had a 250K and the high end of variance, and a 330K at the low end, the difference is only 23K- not enough to worry about under any circumstances. You can also go 500K for the HB, and 250K for the SCs on the volumes. Assume the dual-gang tone pot is 250K on both gangs (I don't think you can get those with, say, a 250K/500K combo). This will be roughly the same as using 330K for both. Remember that, for the purposes of calculating the parallel resistances, you only have 2 pots in the circuit, except at position #4, where all three are in circuit. But with the HB at the bridge, there will only be 2 pots in circuit in positions 1 and 2, where the HB is active. There are people that do so. I've never seen the point. If your concern is that the 250K pots will dark the HB too much, my preference would be to use a no-load pot for the volume. If that makes the SCs too bright (it probably won't), the tone controls could be dialed back just a bit (Assuming std. Strat arrangement where you have tones on the N and M pups). It's been said hereabouts before, but it bears repeating: If you have 500K pots and you want to know what your guitar would sound like with 250K pots, just turn the tone knobs down to about an "8". And, no, I wasn't cold in my avatar pic. There was liquor involved. BTW, many players don't realize that Fender's stock SSH Strats use the 5-way switch to split the HB at position 2, so that you get M + Split-coil HB. Position 5 then gives the full HB. This is easily done. Also, you might consider giving the HB its own tone control. It has always made sense to me to do so, even without the two volumes.
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Post by Yogi B on Oct 25, 2017 7:09:09 GMT -5
The Keystone needs its own tone pot. So that problem got solved the first day! Repeating what Newey said, there is no "need" to do anything in one particular way, sure you can do what the Keystone wiring guide recommends, you could tweak it to better suit what you want, or do something else entirely. Also speaking of the Keystone "tone" control, it isn't really a tone control: it is essentially a "spin-a-split" control, or more specifically in this case a "spin-a-tap" control with the addition of a capacitor and resistor to retain some warmth when rolling the control all the way down. Now I know you said: but you did say relatively -- plus you also did originally ask: So here's my two penn'orth: My first thought is that the series link of the humbuckers could also be attached to the same control, going via half of the 5-way switch. Then the other two controls being assigned to master volume and master tone. That would leave the question of adjusting the placement/values of the cap and resistor combo to suit. Another idea would be keeping the Keystone's spin-a-tap separate, but using a switched pot (push-pull or similar) to swap between a regular tone pot and the spin-a-tap functionality. Another version might be possible be using a TBX style pot wired so it gives you treble cut in one direction and the coil tap in the other, but off hand I'm not sure about the resistance taper of a TBX, so it might not be suitable. This could then leave the other pots to be wired as master volume and a tone control for one or both humbuckers. Potential food for thought is that you could also copy of whatever you used on the Keystone's "tone" control and also apply it to the humbuckers' tone control.
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torren61
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Post by torren61 on Oct 25, 2017 7:52:55 GMT -5
I'm loving the input! I wouldn't know how to wire it without a drawing. I'm certainly not afraid to coil tap and the Sheptones are already wired for it. Great ideas so far. This set is going in a spalted maple over alder Strat style body. It was CNC'd from a Fender "The Strat" body. I've had an Eric Johnson loaded pick guard in there but it's time for something completely different.
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