vitalstar
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Post by vitalstar on Sept 22, 2007 5:03:58 GMT -5
Hello everyone,
I know very little about wiring. I recently had my strat worked on, and I lost my favorite setup.
I have single coil in neck and middle position, and I put a seymour duncun 59 humbucker in the bridge.
Then I put a 3 position, on, on, on switch wired to the duncan.
What I liked before I had the guitar worked on was, the mini toggle could have the Duncan as a full humbucker, a single coil, and something totally out of phase and scratchy sounding( a very noisy and weak signal )....trust me, I LOVED that out-of-phase tone in certain areas.
I think what I need to know, is, how do I wire up the mini toggle to accomplish this again?
Sorry, I don't have any more technical knowledge than this.
Thanks.
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Post by ChrisK on Sept 22, 2007 13:37:20 GMT -5
Hi and welcome a'board. (Well, did you write down how you'd done it before? ) You have a neck and middle single coil. You changed the bridge to a '59 (I presume that it's 4 wire plus shield). You added in an ON-ON-ON switch with ?6 terminals. You realized something totally out of phase and scratchy sounding (a very noisy and weak signal). Was this sound realized with only the bridge pickup selected (out-of-phase internally) or was it realized in combination with another selected pickup (out-of-phase externally)? Both of these can be easily done with several variations. And, what work did you have done? Can you get your money back? ;D
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vitalstar
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Post by vitalstar on Sept 23, 2007 14:23:42 GMT -5
Hi Chris, Thanks for your help. I HATE this stuff. Just tell me what to wire and I'll follow your commands...lol. I *think* the original toggle was put in by a music store 14 years ago, so, it wasn't me who did the wiring( getting old)...then, a friend cleaned up my battered guitar( it really was a mess from gigs and stuff). So, to anwser your question. The out of phase, would be 'internal'. The jb 59 was the only pickup affected by the 6 terminal mini toggle. Again, out of that I got a humbucker, a single coil, an out-of-phase horror show that sounded amazing for some things. Then the Strat 5 position is supposed to act as it normally does. So, whatever sound is set by the mini toggle for the 59, would combine with the middle pickup if I placed the Strats switcher in the 2nd position ( I think thats it, middle combined with bridge ). WARNING: The following pictures are very disturbing. So, this is what's going on now. And yes, the humbucker is typical 4 wire, plus a shield.
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Post by ChrisK on Sept 23, 2007 22:28:33 GMT -5
These two statements correlate. However, the way that it is now, your top/first pic shown what appears to be the red and white from the '59 tied together and the black and green going to a phase reversal switch. From what I can see and discern, the blue toggle switch is only a phase reverser for the entire '59 hardwired in an internal series mode only, and the middle toggle position would be the bridge off and shorted. If you really want internal out-of-phase, as in my top wiring diagram, go for it. 1. The switch layout is exactly how you wire it looking at the back of the switch. 2. Whichever coil that you want to be active in the single coil mode, wire in the "BC" position. 3. The bottom blue wire goes to common, directly from the "BC" coil (it's not really blue). 4. The top right blue wire (well, white with orange stripe) goes to the 5-way selector switch for the bridge position. guitarnuts2.proboards45.com/index.cgi?board=reference&action=display&thread=11831696925. When you connect in the "BC" coil, use the two appropriate colored wires, don't worry about which one goes to the common and which one goes to the toggle switch. 6. When you connect in the "TC" coil, use the other two appropriate colored wires, don't worry about which one is which, just wire them to the toggle switch. If the bridge single coil selection is out-of-phase with the other pickups selected by the 5-way selector switch (and you don't like it), swap the connections from the two wires coming from the "BC" coil. Now (he cleverly sez), if'n the series and anti-series positions are reversed on the toggle from where you want them, just mechanically rotate the switch 180 degrees (or 90, or 134, or...) in place and tighten (leave enough wire length). It's a good thing that we're working on the mini-toggle,'cuz the solder joints look cold (that's a bad thing). The solution does not involve an afghan or sweater. Dang, symmetry (and done) is.
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Post by sumgai on Sept 24, 2007 0:50:02 GMT -5
vitalstar, Hi, and welcome to the NutzHouse! ;D As far as what Chris sez......... .................. just mechanically rotate the switch 180 degrees (or 90, or 134, or...) in place and tighten (leave enough wire length). You'll have to forgive him, he plays his guitar at some odd angles, and then thinks that everyone else does too! ;D HTH sumgai
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vitalstar
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Post by vitalstar on Sept 24, 2007 9:29:01 GMT -5
Well, I'm going bald, so I play guitar upside down using gravity boots. Research has shown good bloodflow to the head can slow the process.
I'll let you know if this all works out. Knowing my technical skills, I wouldn't be surprised if I switched the mini-toggle and the toilet flushed.
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Post by sumgai on Sept 24, 2007 16:33:42 GMT -5
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Post by gumbo on Sept 27, 2007 6:27:43 GMT -5
Yeah, well I tried that and now my toilet is out-of-phase....
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Post by jkemmery on Sept 27, 2007 11:33:12 GMT -5
So now your toilet flushes counter-clockwise like those of us here in the Northern Hemisphere? (Or is it "anti-clockwise"?) ;D
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Post by gumbo on Sept 29, 2007 4:17:27 GMT -5
Yeah, you got it exactly...but I double-checked it and it only happens at night with the mini-toggle in the 'centre-off' position...I guess I can live with that if I have to.....don't want to re-wire it again in case it starts to affect the shower as well...
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vitalstar
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Post by vitalstar on Sept 29, 2007 12:09:11 GMT -5
All this toilet humor has me uncomfortable using the term, "Bottom Coil". *Ahem* anyways...I picked up a mini toggle, and drawn a Looooovely graph for y'all so I can wire this thing up without flushing anyones toilet. I have 4 wires coming out of the Seymour Duncan Humbucker, red, green, black and white. I've numbered the wires on the graph I've drawn. If you could tell me what color corresponds with what number, that would be very helpful. Also, does #5 and #6 mean to wire the 2 terminals together? and, what is 7? thx.
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Post by ChrisK on Sept 29, 2007 21:04:53 GMT -5
While it's a nice sketch, it's exactly the same as my posted drawing. I don't get the point? Yes, you do! Indeed! However, the question; entices one to view this this link from my post; guitarnuts2.proboards45.com/index.cgi?board=reference&action=display&thread=1183169692which indicates the pairs of wires that come from each coil (screw or slug), which will help you in determining which pair of wires that you want to go to the "BC" connections (the coil that you want to be active in the single coil mode). So, What do you want? And, don't worry about polarity/phase yet. And, connect the other pair of wires. Because, This corrects INTER-PICKUP phase issues. Heh, heh; This corrects INTRA-PICKUP phase issues. Since the middle position of the mini toggle is the unique position (single coil) and either side thereof is a series combination, rotation cures things local (INTRA-PICKUP) because Now, while, this may be true, it would be truer if'n you told me which coil it is that you want to be active in the single coil position. Uh, no. Pursuant to; guitarnuts2.proboards45.com/index.cgi?board=schem&action=display&thread=1158705194your #5 and #6 are the internal mini toggle connections made when the switch is in the middle Center-ON position. And; ! Peel slowly and see, all info needed was in post! (The secondary goal of this forum is to hand out "fish".) (The primary goal is to teach one "to fish".)
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vitalstar
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Post by vitalstar on Sept 30, 2007 10:21:13 GMT -5
"While it's a nice sketch, it's EXACTLY the same as my posted drawing." No it's not. Mine has numbers on it. "I don't get the point? " Obviously. Could someone who DOES get the point, explain to me what to do. This is getting annoying. I'm in here for this, and only this. I don't need to read 5 hours of Chinese looking diagrams to wire up a *bleep*in' mini toggle. Come on someone, take a shot. I have a red, green, black, and white wire coming out of the humbucker. I've drawn a nice diagram with the wires NUMBERED, coming from the humbucker to wire to the mini toggle. How Much Easier Could It Get. i.e. 1 is red, 2 is black You know, that sort of thing. Duh. Speak to me in MY language, you can learn it in 2 seconds, and then I'm outta here. Thx.
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Post by JohnH on Sept 30, 2007 17:14:21 GMT -5
Let me take a stab - but I really do recommend following Chris' train of thought - we'd much prefer to impart understanding than just answers!
But try this:
The humbucker is a Seymour Duncan, so it has a particular colour coding scheme for the wires from each coil. SD pups have the slug coil black and white, and the adjustable coil red and green. For a conventional humbucker, without switching, black goes to hot, green to ground and red and white are connected together.
Using Chris' upper diagram (to include the out of phase switching), and your version with numbers, then:
1=black 2=white 3=red 4=green
With that, when you set to the middle position, youll get the adjustable (screw) coil as a single, with the normal and out-of phase options in the other positions.
The arrows 5 and 6 indicate the internal workings of the switch. In the three positions, they connect the middle lugs to either both top, one top one lower, or both lower lugs. You do not have to wire them.
7 is the combined output of all of that - it goes to the five-way switch on the strat. The lower straight wire coming from 4 goes to ground (eg back of volume pot).
That will probably work. If you get the right sounds with just the bridge pup, then you should check the bridge/middle combo. In both bridge Humbucker and single modes, you should get a full deep sound combined with the middle. With bridge single and middle, you should also get reduced hum compared to a single coil. If not please report back here since this can be fixed by moving wires around.
And let us know anyway if it works. That is the only price of all this good advice!
cheers
John
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vitalstar
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Post by vitalstar on Oct 1, 2007 2:32:32 GMT -5
Thanks John. Worked perfectly the first attempt!! I haven't used a soldering iron in 10 years. Anyways, you can hear the out of phase switch here on a tune called "Light Speed"...at :40 seconds I turn it on for the run, then between :48 and :49 seconds you can here me switch back to the humbucker for the next run. I just uploaded a better example, 'Internet Jam' ( I was jamming along to an internet radio station ) at :34 to 1:15, and 3:36, you can really hear it. Kind of like a Telecaster I guess, you can't get anywhere near a moniter, the buzz really is obnoxious. my space dot com / guitarosmosis So, that's it, Many thanks, Cheers, VS.
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