Hey everyone, Just after some of your useful knowledge again. I'm working on a Nuno Bettencourt project guitar and I need some help regarding the wiring I would like to do. Here's a diagram from Ibanez for their SZ range, with Ibanez selector switch (same as one in John Petrucci Signature series).
Now what I would like to achieve is the same pickup combinations, but with only 1 volume pot and selector switch. Thats it. I have acquired an Ibanez SZ switch and have a Dimarzio Custom taper 500k pot, Seymour Duncan custom "Eddie Van Halen" P/U for the bridge and a Seymour Duncan Alnico II Pro for the neck. Is this able to be done and if so how, I got a bit lost with what to do with the output wires from the switch. All ideas are muchly appreciated, but no more holes in the guitar, 1 volume, 1 selector switch..??
Thanks in advance everyone.
(edited by sumgai to make the images a little more usable.)
Last Edit: Nov 27, 2007 5:19:48 GMT -5 by greybagz
That'll be $1 Canadian (what, you think I don't know what they're worth)?
It took long enough, but all that Canadian money that I have left over from vacations is finally worth more than the U.S. equivalent, but a whole lot less than if I'd just exchanged it a long time ago and put it in a savings account. ;D
Hey guys, Completed wiring as per Modified diagram, but pickup configuration is a little out of sought. With switch in Neck position I have full N HB, so thats good , but in middle position I have no sound at all , and in bridge position I have only the slug poles of the B P/U not full HB . Just to confirm to see if I've got the wires correct, the 2 connected wires from each pickup up are red and white (as per seymour duncan), the single wire from each pickup going to the switch is black ("hot" as per seymour duncan), and the ground wires (single black in diagram) are the green and shield wires? Thanks for reading.
Well, you seem to fully understand the color code of the pickups.
I would first recheck the solder joints.
If these are correct, this makes me wonder about the switch.
You state that you have an Ibanez switch. I actually have no info on this, but from the switching diagram I assumed that it was a 12 terminal 4PDT ON-ON-ON switch which works this way:
As it is shown on your wiring diagram, looking at the terminal side;
1_2_3 4_5_6 7_8_9 A_B_C
1_2>3 Neck tap is unconnected. 4_5>6 Bridge tap is grounded but who cares. 7_8>9 Neck output to volume pot A_B>C Bridge output is unconnected
1<2_3 Neck tap is grounded but who cares. 4<5_6 Bridge tap is unconnected. 7<8_9 Neck output is unconnected. A<B_C Bridge output to volume pot.
1<2_3 Neck tap is grounded. 4_5>6 Bridge tap is grounded. 7<8_9 Neck output to volume pot. A_B>C Bridge output to volume pot.
HOWEVER, AFTER FURTHER INSPECTION, THIS IS INCORRECT FROM WHAT I KNOW OF THESE SWITCHES. (I had assumed that the original diagram was intrinsically correct.)
For this diagram to work, the switch HAS to work this way:
1<2_3 Neck tap is grounded. 4_5>6 Bridge tap is grounded. 7_8>9 Neck output to volume pot. A<B_C Bridge output to volume pot.
This is NOT how this switch works. Basically, in the "both" position, NO pickup is selected. (Now, if the wire to terminal "9" is moved to terminal "C", and the wire to terminal "A" is moved to terminal "7", there will be sound in the "both" position.
The bridge position issue is likely a wiring or soldering thing. I suspect a constant "tap" short.
However, either this switch (rotation orientation independent) or the Kent Armstrong special "Brian May" toggle switch (rotation orientation dependent, 180 degrees required) will work for this wiring if those two wires are moved on the switch.
From the switch back view, you should to measure the contact switching logic for each position to be sure (after all, I don't know where you got that switch, or where it's been ). Please post your results using any terminal nomenclature on the switch, in a format similar to what I used. If you can discern a manufacturer (not vendor) and part number, that would be ideal.
Knowing this we can determine if any wiring design errors are in play (I think that we already do, tho )
Chris, You're spot on the money. The change-over from 9 to C and A to 7 solved the problem. The Bridge tap issue was my bad, tiny off cut strand was shorting the bridge tap connection, wasn't looking hard enough before. I've included photo's of the switch for yourself and others (pre- A-7, 9-C swap). Its a Dimarzio switch, stock code #3SW1JPM3T.
*Note: these pics taken before A-7 9-C swap.
Now, I have only one more problem, and its quite disheartening as I take great pride in my soldering and wiring technique, but I have a BUZZ. From each of the Humbuckers, either in Neck pos, or Bridge position, but not in the Middle position (inner coils as per 1st post pic). Just so you know what I've done with regards to the pickup ground wires and shield wires, i bonded them ALL together to the MAIN ground from vol pot which i then connected to Ground side of switch. (u can see this in above pic, green and shield within heatshrink tube). So in short, each humbucker buzzes, quite a bit more with gain. But when middle position selected, hum disappears. I'll leave that one with you all. Thanks for reading, you can rest your eyes now. Graeme
Last Edit: Nov 24, 2007 0:32:42 GMT -5 by greybagz
My first supposition is that one of the coils is reversed in each of the humbuckers. To verify that, simply un-solder and reverse the leads of one of the coils for each pickup.
This would be simply another wiring diagram error, the color codes weren't written down correctly. (Unless your pickups were wired wrong in the first place, but you'd've said that the problem already existed, so I doubt that.) There could be other reasons, but I prefer to stick with the simple ones.
Rule #1: All Lives Are Final. Make sure that the life you have just been issued is appropriate for your needs, before departing the womb.
Rule #2: In case you don't like the life you have, see Rule #1.
You state that either the bridge or neck buzzes, but not both together. I checked your pickup color code usage from the Duncan site, it looks correct.
Are you certain that when either the bridge or neck is selected, both coils therein are selected? I doubt that this is an issue since you already stated the detection of the single coil error on the bridge. However, they may still be electrically out of phase (and real
You may be fortuitous in that the "both" position uses the coils from each pickup that happen to be out of phase. A clue would be if either the bridge or neck (two coils in series, signals add) is not noticeably louder than the both position (two coils in parallel, signals average). but again, you already stated the detection of the single coil error on the bridge.
However, I find it somewhat odd that the identical coils from each pickup are electrically out of phase. My experience with Duncan is that this may not traditionally be the case. While Duncan pickups CAN be ordered already configured for such, you may want to check this out. For instance, in the TB4 (JB Vib-bucker) and SH4 Jazz that I'm putting in a custom build, I have to reverse the magnet in one pickup to have the screw coils or slug coils be humbucking when selected together (they currently are not).
So, hmmm, maybe it's a grounding issue that gets resolved by the switch (which shouldn't happen).
i bonded them ALL together to the MAIN ground from vol pot which i then connected to Ground side of switch.
BTW, there isn't a "main ground" side of the switch, it's just the shunting point for splitting the pickups. I wouldn't use/count on it as THE ground point (especially since it's so far from the output jack. I'd still use the back shell on the vol pot as THE common ground point, and have just a single wire from the switch to said common ground point (now, one wouldn't have to shield this wire, eh? ). Maybe this is what you meant, I'm not sure.
I would recommend that you measure the ground resistance to everywhere from the ground side of the output jack. In other words, in all three switch positions, measure the resistance from the output jack ground to the strings, the internal shielding in the cavities (this may not show up as a low reading since it's conductive paint), the pickup pole pieces (the bare shield wire should ensure this), the pot shell, the pickup coil shunt nodes 9the red/white junctions), and everything else that you can get to.
Does the buzzing change when you touch anything?
Write it all down, clues are.
Maybe it's that Cosmic DeWobbulator plate on the back. ;D
I'm back, I'm back. Wow, thanks for the responses guys, I was away this weekend and Monday, so sorry about the delay in replying. I appreciate all the help and will get on the job right now and report my findings.
Deep Blue, I have a couple of pics for you. The neck is actually a bolt on, designed by Washburn for Nuno Bettencourts signature model guitar. You'll notice the heel of the neck extends out to one side, thus requiring the extra screws. I feel it gives better access to the bottom frets.
This is actually a joint project with a good friend of mine who is a huge fan of Nuno and stumbled across some factory seconds from an online store. He fit all the hardware and I'm almost there with the wiring. Chris, Thank-you for the clear up on the switch, I was told it was a Dimarzio, but I may have been confused at time of purchase. Thanks for your advice, I will let you know of the results I get. Sumgai, Thanks for the comments, I have started to take a liking to basic photography and would like to learn a bit more in the future, its just getting the time between work time and home time.
I will report back to you all soon. Thanks everyone. Graeme
Can someone please slap the hell outta me!!!!!!!!!!!!! I am apologizing in advance for the sidetracking episode from my post on the 24th Nov regarding humbucker buzz. You can all rest ur brains and try to forgive me for confusing you. Your replies and advice are so very much appreciated, but.... In my testing of the guitar episode I just happened to have the noise gate in my Line6 ON, this most certainly gave me some false assumptions. Now by turning the noise gate off, the buzz is definately louder, but.... occurs in all 3 switch positions at equal volumes and DISAPPEARS when strings touched (confirmed when plugged into a normal amp, not line6 floorboard, i don't know why it was so different when noise gate was on but it was). Sumgai, as you said...."Keep it simple". So somehow with the lack of sleep lately, and not using my ears, (or my brain), I got into a fuss, worried about the pickups, the switch etc,... when the whole time it has been a grounding issue. Who feels like they wasted everyones time... I do, sorry guys. Anyhow, on a positive note, I again thank you all for the excellent advice, I'm sure it will used in the future, if not by me, by someone else. My readings from the pickups are as follows Neck 7.5K ohms Bridge 8.9K ohms Neck and Bridge coil tap (middle pos) 4.07K ohms
So in regards to your advice Chris, heres a pic of the switch wiring.
What should I do with the ground and screen wires instead of bonding them to the switch ground. I've used single conductor shielded wire from the pot and attached the green and screen wires, plus a black wire from the switch to the shielding (enclosed in heatshrink). Oh, the conductive paint works fine, zero ohm reading from paint to jackplate, pot cover, strings... except for switch cavity, how do i make the switch cavity common to ground as well (ground wire to switch casing?) You guys have done an amazing job so far, again i apologize for the confusion, in future i will be a little more conscientious in my work. Hope i can get this rectified soon. Time for sleep. Graeme
Hi Sooty, Yes from an ebay store. Warpdrive Music Not promoting the store, but thought you might want a look. we bought the body and neck from there and all hardware local. Thanks for the comments. Graeme
Hey all, Grounding issue rectified, remade ground wires and shielded cavity covers. All hum now gone. I thank you all for your help with this issue, sorry for previous side tracks regarding pickups. Guitar sounds great!!!! Graeme