Variation on Wolf's Ultra Strat- HH/SSSS modes

[petros]

(This post is being edited as I get closer to a final design.)

Converting HH strat to switchable HH/SSSS mode. I'll explain.

Lace makes a pickup they call a "Dually," which looks like a humbucker but is actually two true single coils placed side by side (The bridge pickups are each rated at 13.2K for a total of 26.4K, and the neck pickups are each rated at a little over 6K for a total of 12.1K).

They're designed to be very low noise even as single coils. Using a set of these pickups you can create a guitar that switches from humbucker-humbucker (HH) mode to a true 3 (or even 4) single coil (SSSS) mode. The wonderful world of wiring and switching should be able to get you there, but I was having a little trouble finding a diagram. The closest I found was Wolf's "Wolf Wire Ultra Strat" design here www.1728.com/guitar2.htm


*Essentially, I'm looking to be able to have any combination of two single coils connected in either parallel (for the traditional single coil strat sound) or in series (for the hotter Les Paul humbucker sound). I need a parallel/ series switching option, and I need one volume and at least one tone control.


This is where I'm at in the design, which I don't claim to be mine at all because it's basically Wolf's, which I'm grateful for having seen (thanks to Wolf). The diagram below was just redrawn to show the push-pull pot, remove the phase switch, and add the 4th single coil pickup. Remember, I'm using a set of Lace Duallys not two humbuckers.


(Note: Numbers on switch 1 should be the other way. Also, the hot (+) wire from the push-pull switch to the volume pot is not shown.)

This would be perfect if I only had three single coils, but I have 4. Switches 1 - 4 are on/off SPST (single pole single throw). This design would allow me to use the pickups in any combination, including an all-on option (don't have a clue what that would sound like). The push-pull switch on the volume pot changes the connection of the pickups from parallel to series with one switch.

Q. What I'm most unsure about is how to connect switch 4 as a "bridge on" type switch. Connecting switch 4 to switch 3 in parallel would NOT work because switch 4 would only work when switch 3 is on.

[petros]

Note also that what I really like most about the design above is that you can switch all the pickups from parallel to series with just one switch. I like this function better than Wolf's "Funky Five" design available here www.1728.com/guitar5.htm . The only thing is I could easily add the bridge coil if I went with the Funky Five design, but it means having to throw two switches to change all the pickups from series to parallel mode.

This is frustrating but it's forcing me to learn more.

[sumgai]

petros,

Hi, and welcome to the NutzHouse! ;D

First, what you've done with wolf's circuit is a good start. However, your desire to add a fourth coil runs afoul of several tenets for one simple reason - you're in "wolf mode", which is to say, you're using series shunt switching to enable/disable your pickups. Certainly you can add a fourth coil to such a scheme, but as you've noted, it becomes cumbersome.

Instead, let me ask you, have you perused our Schematics sub-forum yet? Within that arena, you'll find many schematics and wiring diagrams that show how you can hook up two 4-wire humbuckers (your Lace Dually's qualify!), and get all the combinations you listed, plus many more to boot.

I'd advise that as you search, look especially for threads by JohnH or borsanova, both of those two members have some well thought-out materials, and their drawings and explanations are top notch - easy for the newcomer to understand. While borsanova hasn't come around for awhile, JohnH is certainly still active here, so if you have any questions, you'll get good answers, no doubt about that. ;D

In short, I think that if you move towards the more standard way of thinking about switching pickups (connect/disconnect the hot lead from the output, not shunt it to ground), you'll find that many possibilities make themselves more easily apparent to you. Not that wolf's ideas are bad or wrong, they simply are not as easily understood by most newcomers to The NutzHouse. Call them "for the intermediate GuitarNut", and not for the beginner, that's all I'm saying here.

HTH


sumgai

[wolf]

Welcome to the board petros
Well, if you want just about every switching possibility there's always the Super Seven Switching
Yes, it is a very tricky circuit to wire but the possibilities are incredible. It will allow you to have all 9 of those wiring possibilities you have listed plus a whole lot more.

[petros]

Wolf and sumgai: Thanks much for your replies.

I am leaning more 'n more toward Wolf's Funky Five design because it does just about everything I wanted as mentioned above except being able to switch to only one single coil. However, I'm not even sure if I need to be able to use one single coil at a time, which might sound a bit too thin for real usage, though I'm not sure if one of the single coils at the bridge pickup set (each single coil at the bridge has DC resistance rating of 13.2K) is going to sound "thin."

The only thing detracting me from the Funky Five design is that the switch design for the Ultra Strat (what I basically have drawn above) seems to me to be a more intuitive way to switch--one switch sends everything from parallel to series, and there's an on/off for each pickup (that's really brilliant Wolf). The 12 possible switch combinations for the Funky Five would need some getting adjusted to, but at least I wouldn't have to leave out the fourth pickup.

I'm gonna check the schematics sub-forum before I make a final.

[ChrisK]

Essentially, I'm looking to be able to have any combination of two single coils connected in either parallel (for the traditional single coil Strat sound)

An observation might be that two individual coils in parallel next to each other or two individual coils in parallel separated by the normal bridge/neck pickup distance won't give a traditional single coil Strat sound since neither spacing exists on a traditional Strat.

The two adjacent coils will sound like a Lace humbucker wired in parallel, and the two non-adjacent coils wired in parallel will sound like a Tele with Lace single coils in the bridge + neck combination.

I would further mention that, aside from possible hum canceling combinations, the closeness of the two coils in the neck position eliminates any meaningful harmonic differences by selecting one over the other. In essence, while there is variety between the two coils in a bridge humbucker, the meaningful combinations will occur with both bridge coils, both neck coils, or either bridge coil in conjunction with any neck coil.

Instead of having 6 possible series and 6 possible parallel combinations (of 4 items taken 2 at a time), there really are only 4 series and 4 parallel combinations of note.

1. Ba + Bb
2. Ba + N(a or b)
3. Bb + N(a or b)
4. Na + Nb

1. Ba * Bb
2. Ba * N(a or b)
3. Bb * N(a or b)
4. Na * Nb

[ChrisK]

If'n you really do have a thing for mini toggle switches, don't forget unk's Brian May "Trilogy".

[petros]

ChrisK: Thanks for your reply. You're pointing out the pairs of single coil combinations that will have a noticeable tonal difference, yes? Along with the all-on Nab and Bab positions (parallel and series), which I'm assuming will sound distinct, that would make 10 different tones.

And I think I can't comment about whether the guitar will sound more like a tele or a strat until I actually install the pickups (still waiting for parts). To tell you the truth, I'm hoping it sounds a bit unique.

[ChrisK]

You're pointing out the pairs of single coil combinations that will have a noticeable tonal difference, yes?

Yep.

Along with the all-on Nab and Bab positions (parallel and series),

That depends on what you mean by Nab and Bab positions (parallel and series).

1. There is Na*Nb + Ba*Bb (the traditional two internal series humbuckers in external parallel).

2. There is Na*Nb * Ba*Bb (the non-traditional brutally mellow two internal series humbuckers in external series).

3. There is Na+Nb * Ba+Bb (the non-traditional two internal parallel humbuckers in external series).

4. There is Na+Nb + Ba+Bb (the non-traditional brutally spanky two internal parallel humbuckers in external parallel).

1 & 3 should sound similar'ish.

Now, taken in the full context of ALL possible combinations of 4 coils sans OFF and PHASE, there are 97 variants.

For 3 coils sans OFF and PHASE, there are only 17 variants.

I'm glad that you just have the two remaining positions out of 10 to worry about!

[wolf]

ChrisK
Well, besides the 4 you listed (1-4), there are 4 more combinations that could be included (5-8):

Actually, if you wanted to include the individual pickup choices, that would mean four more sounds:
Neck Series; Neck Parallel; Bridge Series; Bridge Parallel
for a total of twelve.
Petros
If you wanted to have one switch to change both pickups from series to parallel, you could replace the 2 SPDT switches with 1 DPDT switch. The only thing you'd lose would be the individual pickup selections, but you are still left with 8 distinct sounds (16 sounds including the 8 out of phase positions).

[ChrisK]

Wolf,

Now, taken in the full context of ALL possible combinations of 4 coils sans OFF and PHASE, there are 97 variants.

97!

There are 49 combinations of 4 coils taken 4 at a time!

That's just a few more than what we've both touched on so far. I believe that this count is valid, but I only seem to work on it in the middle of the night.





Here's the combination count for 3 coils.

[petros]

This project is finished. ;D I posted the results including images and sound clips in The Gallery:

guitarnuts2.proboards45.com/v45index.cgi?action=display&board=music&thread=3238

Thanks again to all who could help!