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Post by sephiroth29 on May 12, 2008 22:15:53 GMT -5
Hey Everybody! Got an odd request for ya. Looking for a diagram for a SPST switch to a 4 conductor pickup (YJM Dimarzio Stacked Humbucker) to a vol. and tone knob, then out to the jack. I know this is an odd request, but it is all means to an end. I'm working on a compounding problem with a project guitar of mine. I'm very new to this, and any input would be most appreciated. Thanks in advance
Sephiroth29
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Post by ChrisK on May 12, 2008 22:43:51 GMT -5
Well, it might help if we knew what you wanted to do with the switch.
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Post by sephiroth29 on May 12, 2008 22:47:10 GMT -5
I just want to toggle it on/off. nothing complicated. Planning to use this as part of a 3 pickup system, where there are two humbuckers wired to their own 3way switch (Bridge-Both-Neck) and this one to an on/off, for the ability to mix and match. Trying to avoid 5way switches if possible.
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Post by sumgai on May 13, 2008 12:54:59 GMT -5
sephi, Hi, and welcome to the NutzHouse! ;D By your last comment, I see that you are right in Chris's camp, that of building things out of modules. Modularized designs are usually easier to comprehend, to assemble into more complicated units, to build, and to troubleshoot (when needed). That said, you still haven't given us the true story. For instance, the mere mention of a 4-wire pickup says "there's a lot of capability here", yet we all know that a SPST switch won't get you diddely squat beyond "pickup on/pickup off". In our collective, yet ever-so-humble opinion, that's like putting a Ferrari engine in a Volkswagen - you could do it, but everybody'd be forever asking you "WHY? ". The essence of wanting to avoid a 5-way switch is good, that's your perogative, but there are still so many details to clear up here. How about a total layout, have you given that any thought yet? EDIT:I see that other contributions have been made while I was making the following drawing.......... sephi, here's the exact answer to your question: (Do note that there are no wire color codes, this is a generic module.) If you are using separate volume and tone controls for this pup, then follow the diagram exactly. If you are going to use a Master Vol/Master Tone for everything, then chop this off right after the switch, and hook it up accordingly. Any questions, you now where (and how!) to ask 'em. HTH sumgai
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Post by ashcatlt on May 13, 2008 13:02:37 GMT -5
You can't come here asking us to just help with this one simple little thing! Come on, we want to get in there and poke around a bit.
The simple answer to your question, though: One of the lugs on the switch gets the hot output from the pickup. The other lug goes to the volume control. The - wire from the pickup goes to ground (wherever that is) and the two middle wires get soldered together and taped off.
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Post by cynical1 on May 13, 2008 13:48:15 GMT -5
Greetings - Seph is working off the drawing he posted hereThis is his schematic: If I understand the assignment here, all he wants to do is drop a SPDT switch in to give him an ON-OFF for a YJM pickup that's going in between the humbuckers detailed in the drawing. He's not doing anything special with the YJM as I understand it. (no splits, S/P or OOP ) I think his question hinges on exactly where to put the signal out of an SPDT switch in relation to the existing diagram to give him a MIDDLE ON selection. Correct me if I'm wrong on this Seph... Happy Trails Cynical1
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Post by sephiroth29 on May 13, 2008 14:10:14 GMT -5
Greetings - Seph is working off the drawing he posted hereThis is his schematic: If I understand the assignment here, all he wants to do is drop a SPDT switch in to give him an ON-OFF for a YJM pickup that's going in between the humbuckers detailed in the drawing. He's not doing anything special with the YJM as I understand it. (no splits, S/P or OOP ) I think his question hinges on exactly where to put the signal out of an SPDT switch in relation to the existing diagram to give him a MIDDLE ON selection. Correct me if I'm wrong on this Seph... Yep, this is correct Cynical, I know it sounds simplistic, but that's all i originally intended to do with it. I was considering making it coil-split with a different type of switch, instead of a spst, but was worried about too much noise in it, because i've heard that the yjm gets kind of noisy if coilsplit (or coilcut, as i understand) Sephiroth29
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Post by sephiroth29 on May 13, 2008 14:12:16 GMT -5
Also, If anyone knows how i CAN coilsplit the YJM without a ton of noise, I'm open to suggesions. Just have a limited space to work with inside the cavity. In fact I'm probably going to have to rout out some bodywork just to fit in the new vol & tone knobs. Sephiroth29
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Post by ChrisK on May 13, 2008 15:32:16 GMT -5
There's a way of semi-splitting if you will. JohnH refers to it often as one of his favorite things to do. I do it by wiring tone controls across specific pickups that are in series with each other (such as the MR wiring with phase).
Shunt one coil of the series humbucker with a cap in the range of 0.01 to 0.047 uF. This will attenuate the high frequencies from that coil while allowing the high frequencies from the other to bypass it.
It makes for a brighter sound while preserving some of the humbucking aspects of two coils RWRP with each other.
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Post by sephiroth29 on May 13, 2008 15:39:14 GMT -5
There's a way of semi-splitting if you will. JohnH refers to it often as one of his favorite things to do. I do it by wiring tone controls across specific pickups that are in series with each other (such as the MR wiring with phase). Shunt one coil of the series humbucker with a cap in the range of 0.01 to 0.047 uF. This will attenuate the high frequencies from that coil while allowing the high frequencies from the other to bypass it. It makes for a brighter sound while preserving some of the humbucking aspects of two coils RWRP with each other. Thanks ChrisK, That sounds like a cool idea. Any chance that JohnH has a diagram posted? (visual learner, sorry
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Post by sephiroth29 on May 13, 2008 15:40:30 GMT -5
Also, when i use the YJM when it's tied into the output at the jack, will that drop the vol or sound of the other humbuckers?
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Post by ChrisK on May 13, 2008 15:53:47 GMT -5
The YJM, if I recall, is a two-faced (not two-phased, well ok, it is) pickup. It's not really a humbucker with two string sensing coils. There is a string sensing coil, which picks up the string signal and interference, and the electrical out of phase interference only sensing coil. These are wired in series. If you don't use the interference only coil, you do indeed have a single coil pickup and sensing structure. You also have a louder/brighter output with noise. I have heard that some folk consider the sensing coil only use of the YJM to be a great single coil sound. It seems to me that the cap bypass might work out here. I just can't decide which coil I'd want to bypass. To get back to your original question, to switch in the middle pickup with its own tone and volume concentric pots, I'd switch the output of the volume pot to the output jack hot lead. This presumes a pickup to tone circuit/volume pot to switch signal chain. You might want to consider the "reverse LP" volume pot wiring where the pickup is connected to the wiper and the hot terminal of the volume pot goes to the output. Now, with a three position toggle switch one has three choices. You could do neck&bridge circuit only/both/middle circuit only. You could do middle circuit/middle circuit off/middle circuit with YJM cap-split (the neck&bridge circuit is always on). Or, you could do a volume/tone_blender ( The FREE Neck On Switch ) with the neck&bridge where the middle circuit is blended/switched in. With the Neck&bridge tone at "10", the middle tone would rule. Call it the Middle on for FREE switch. Hoiw much trouble do you want to get into?
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Post by ChrisK on May 13, 2008 16:02:14 GMT -5
No, if they're active, the sounds will "mingle". If they're off, who cares. ;D Read my comment about normal vs reverse volume pot wiring.
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Post by sephiroth29 on May 13, 2008 16:10:54 GMT -5
Now, with a three position toggle switch one has three choices. You could do middle circuit/middle circuit off/middle circuit with YJM cap-split (the neck&bridge circuit is always on). Hoiw much trouble do you want to get into? Now, with this three position switch, you are talking about replacing the aforementioned spst switch, right? I like the middle/off/cap split idea! That sounds pretty cool. I'm afraid i would have no idea how to do it, though. Any chance you can shoot a diagram of it my way? Thanks.
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Post by ChrisK on May 13, 2008 16:25:50 GMT -5
program review
1. You are using the aforeposted Ibanez neck&bridge wiring design.
2. the neck&bridge/volume/tone circuit is always on.
3. You want to add in a middle/volume/tone circuit that will be in parallel with "2" above.
4. The circuit in "3" will be switched in at the output jack by a three position toggle switch that will realize;
a. The middle circuit "3" in conjunction with the circuit in "2" b. The circuit in "2" only c. The middle circuit '3" cap-split in conjunction with the circuit in "2"
/program review
Is this correct?
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Post by sephiroth29 on May 13, 2008 16:29:57 GMT -5
Yes, that is correct . Sorry if i'm kinda talking in circles.
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Post by ChrisK on May 13, 2008 20:20:20 GMT -5
I have to ask a DAQ (Dumb A$$ Question). On the volume pot for the the existing pickups there is a push pull switch. It switches in half of the common treble anti-cut circuit. Do you use it? If so, in what predominate position? Could you live with it always in that position? If so, wire the cap in place for that position, and reuse the switch to switch the middle circuit in. All you need then is the new hole for the concentric pot for the middle volume/tone. Furthermore, the tone pot can be used to act as a low cut tone control or as a humbucker splitter/shunter. Scroll down to the Red Rhodes (Peavey) Tone_Coil Split Pot.As shown, it can even be made to effect the cap/shunt mode. The reason that I ask is that I wonder about the guitar and whether it's rear or front routed. If the top's thick, a mini-toggle may be hard to mount.
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Post by sephiroth29 on May 13, 2008 22:00:16 GMT -5
I have to ask a DAQ (Dumb A$$ Question). On the volume pot for the the existing pickups there is a push pull switch. It switches in half of the common treble anti-cut circuit. Do you use it? If so, in what predominate position? Could you live with it always in that position? The reason that I ask is that I wonder about the guitar and whether it's rear or front routed. If the top's thick, a mini-toggle may be hard to mount. Don't worry Chrisk, there are no DAQ's. ;D To answer your question, i don't have any of the pickups wired in at all yet. The previous owner installed an EMG-81 into the bridge position, and cut all the wiring and let it just hang there. So i decided to rewire the whole thing from scratch. And yes, it is rear routed, so i will need to rout out about 1/8 inch out of the body to mount the push/pull pots. Probably for the switches as well. Ibanez obviously didnt build this guitar with the tinkerer in mind. I really liked your idea of just having 2 3way switches, (one like the diagram & 1 like u mentioned with it being on/off/splitcoil) I would be interested in any wiring ideas pertaining to that. On a side note, i have a EMG-81 to give away if anyone's interested.
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Post by ChrisK on May 15, 2008 17:48:34 GMT -5
Well, I feel that I still need to ask some questions. When I asked about rear routing, I was concerned about the wood thickness. Since it is rear routed, you could use these push pull pots (oooh, look at the long bushing unit). To do the middle 3-way switch using an LP style of switch (like the one in your other/related thread), it will have to be in this order; 1. None 2. Single Coil 3. Both Coils in Series Also, the middle volume pot may have to be in the circuit, but without the middle pickup connected to it. This will sound as if the volume pot was 250K. Otherwise, the LP three pickup three-way toggle switch will need to be used. This is not a vertical switch. Here's the technical info on the three pickup toggle I still like the use of the Red Rhodes (Peavey) Tone_Coil Split Pot. on the tone portion of the concentric pot for the middle pickup, and the use of the volume push pull pot for switching in the middle circuit. If it were me, that's what I'd do (one new hole presuming that you have a volume, a tone, and the present 3-way). But, it's your project.
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Post by sephiroth29 on May 18, 2008 0:30:06 GMT -5
I would just like to say thank you to all the guys that posted on this thread, trying to lend me a hand. Unfortunately I'm going to be in the process of moving soon, so I won't be able to be working on this project for a short while. I really appreciate all the ideas put forth and hope that I will be back on shortly to tell u guys how the project came out. Thanks. Help like this makes forums worth while. I only wish more forums where as helpful. Sephiroth29
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