what would you suggest for a tele?

[thetragichero]

two single coil tele-style build...
i'm thinking at the very least the 4-way switch with one being series, one being parallel (other two positions single coils)
should i do this or get a 5 way super switch or what?
i'm open to what you dudes have thought up and never used, as long as the sounds are useful (no out-of-phase, because i don't need that in my life)!

[asmith]

You could install a super five-way switch with these positions:

5. Neck
4. Neck and Bridge in parallel
3. Neck and Bridge in series
2. Bridge
1. Bridge solo - full volume and tone.

That last one is a favourite of mine - you can be playing any settings you want, and then just rip the switch back to Pos. 1 in an instant for the cutting Bridge solo tone.

Here's a quick schematic:


You could also do a "Cap Switching" Mod by adding a push/pull switch to either control - here's an article that relates to the Stratocaster, but represents the principles pretty well.

Here's a schematic of what that would look like. And if you're using a push/pull switch, you've still got a pole and two throws left to play with (marked with the red X on the diagram) - you've got very limited options, but options all the same to play with that.

[flateric]

I built an ash tele for a friend, fitted it with a SD mini humbucker in the neck, it was the sweetest sound, you could add a coil tap to that as well as going for the 4-position blade switch for series/parallel - I fitted this to my mex tele and it gives a nice subtle difference to the rhythm sound.

[thetragichero]

i did the push-pull cap change pot on my buddy's pbass, and i think i'll probably do it with all of my guitars now

i like that 5-way switch with the bridge solo in position 1.... not too complicated a maneuver for me to execute while playing!

i've also seen mention of some teles having a switch position that adds a cap... would these be of any use to me?
i play mainly 90s-influenced rock/punk with just enough gain to get a dirty sound... i'm not a high gain player by far

[newey]

asmith:

If, instead of combining 2 caps using a SPST switch, you use a SPST "Center off" switch, you get the Free Woman Tone, one of the late ChrisK's ingenious mods.

Tragic-

The 5-way superswitch ideas above sound interesting. I like the idea of a solo setting on the 5-way.

The Tele wiring you refer to, using a cap, is the original Esquire wiring. It was an effort by Leo to interest Jazz guitarists in his solid body guitars, even though they were without the jazzy neck pickup sound.

Rock guitarists who play (or did play) Esquires usually removed the cap, or just never used that setting. It dropped the output a bit and, to most ears, just sounded muddy.

Jazz players kept right on buying hollow-body electrics.

Anyway, I wouldn't think that would be a real useful sound for your music.

Of course, the results Leo got were a function of the cap he used- I forget the value- but some experimentation might reveal hidden tone gold.

Chris used to advocate using an external cap substitution box to test various cap values.

[4real]

Dec 1, 2010 16:28:21 GMT -5 thetragichero said:

i did the push-pull cap change pot on my buddy's pbass, and i think i'll probably do it with all of my guitars now

i like that 5-way switch with the bridge solo in position 1.... not too complicated a maneuver for me to execute while playing!

i've also seen mention of some teles having a switch position that adds a cap... would these be of any use to me?
i play mainly 90s-influenced rock/punk with just enough gain to get a dirty sound... i'm not a high gain player by far

The original Esquire single pickup tele's had a cap position...

The Tele wiring you refer to, using a cap, is the original Esquire wiring. It was an effort by Leo to interest Jazz guitarists in his solid body guitars, even though they were without the jazzy neck pickup sound.

Rock guitarists who play (or did play) Esquires usually removed the cap, or just never used that setting. It dropped the output a bit and, to most ears, just sounded muddy.

Jazz players kept right on buying hollow-body electrics.

The idea was not so much for a "jazz sound" but that the guitars were often used to sub for the bass and to simulate that. Remember Leo had yet to invent the electric bass and this was the first real production guitar...not sure that there really was a jazz thing about it...Leo took most of his influences from country players back then.

I know you say you don't want that "Out of Phase" thing in your life but it is a common "low-fi" effect these days and in 90's rock and punk...often simulated in the studio and can be useful. Perhaps you might consider it if modded with a filter as Ozboomer has been exploring lately to get something more to your taste in that regard.

I have a p/p phase in my tele and the results can be useful as shown in the sound clips posted on it in the gallery.

The little tele neck pickup was designed for a "jazz time" and a good one sounds fantastic in that mode...warm but very clear...

[thetragichero]

Dec 1, 2010 18:16:04 GMT -5 newey said:

Chris used to advocate using an external cap substitution box to test various cap values.

i've got a piece of computer paper with caps of various makes/capacitance taped on there to see what works
sometimes those cheap, dirty caps sound better than the orange drops/mallories!

[lpf3]

I currently have a RWRP Strat middle pup in the neck position (uncovered) & a Lawrence Black Label at the bridge. (That's the "other" Lawrence pup). I tried both the series & parallel out of phase positions, but they weren't for me.
I had a push/push pot for the series switch at one time; with a .02 cap for the jumper, but prefer just a straight jumper, which for me puts control of the tone at the, well, the tone control.

I've replaced the push pot with the 4-way switch, (for series). 500K pots with a .047 cap. For me, it's the ultimate Tele, although of course YMMV.

While I'm at it- something that really, noticeably improved the performance of my Tele was to change to a bone nut & brass saddles........

-lpf3

[thetragichero]

i'm a tusq nut guy all the way, but i'm thinkin i'll get the callaham bridge with the brass saddles
alder body i got cheap on ebay, dude i know is making me a birdseye neck with ebony fretboard and an angled headstock (no string trees!), sd five two bridge with a benson overwound neck pickup (uncovered)
at some point i might make the body blonde with a black pickguard, but for now it's clearcoat and white pearloid pickguard

[4real]

You might want to check out the many tele wirings at DGB studios...

www.geocities.jp/dgb_studio/tlmod_e.htm

or go through there even bigger collection of SS mods for other guitars here...

www.geocities.jp/dgb_studio/index_e.htm

or adapt them to what you think would be useful...fortunately teles are not that hard to play around with thought the cavity is small, at least you don't have the problems of taking a strats entire plate off to do it and again to trouble shoot or change again...

[thetragichero]

Dec 1, 2010 13:48:56 GMT -5 asmith said:

You could install a super five-way switch with these positions:

5. Neck
4. Neck and Bridge in parallel
3. Neck and Bridge in series
2. Bridge
1. Bridge solo - full volume and tone.

i ordered a superswitch and will attempt to suss out a variation of this in diagram form (i feel like positions 3 and 4 would work better for me reversed)
i'll then post it and have ya'll correct me on it

[asmith]

Bitchin'. I'll do my own version, and then we'll 'compare notes.' Schoolgirl giggle.

[thetragichero]

trying to suss out the wiring....
since it's a 4P5T switch, am i correct in my assumption to have each of the 4 pickup wires go to the common lugs?
seems the easiest for my poor little brain to work it out like that, in order to make sure in the single coil positions that the other coil is shorted

once again, i appreciate all of the help!

EDIT: i only really need three poles of this, huh?

[JohnH]

Seems like asmith has already done the schematic at reply 1 - you just need to swap connections for those two positions you want to change, then follow that to make a wiring diagram, for which you need to relate the lugs on the actual switch to those on the schematic

[thetragichero]

i wanted to think through it myself
i think this will work?

[JohnH]

A good try, and its great to work these things out yourself. A few comments:
No need to short out a coil in this case, you can have a coil grounded at one end, or disconnected at both ends and its all fine
Super-switches have their poles at the far ends, as you show, but the 1-5 are all facing the same way, so you get 0 1 2 3 4 5 1 2 3 4 5 0 on each side
You are right that only 3 poles are needed for the main coil switching, but you should use the 4th pole for switching out the V and T in the solo position. Currently, your diagram implies the output of the volume pot is still loading the pickups, so you wont get the full blast.

asmiths schematic is the best way to do it. It would be a really good excercise to follow that schematic, and relate it directly to a wiring diagram, particularly if you are not used to schematics. then make the swap of lugs to get the order that you want.

BTW, I think this should be a really good scheme, and gets everything worth getting out of a Tele (ie, everything posible except phase). Also, based on the asmith schematic, there is the possibilty to do the type of enhanced tone control that I stick on my diagrams (see my schematic posted yesterday). All it would need, based on asmiths schematic, would be an extra wire from the unused tone pot lug, to the series link on the 5-way.

Id suggest a 500k tone pot for this scheme, and 250k volume pot. It will give you a better tonal range than both 250k

[thetragichero]

ooooh 4th pole is for output jack hot!
got it...
just trying to make sense of your enhanced tone control in regards to this build

[thetragichero]

this is what i have so far

[newey]

Looks good from here!

[JohnH]

The green link, for the series position, is in position 4 on the lower half (ie next to neck only, what you wanted), but 3 on the top half.

Another watch-it: you are heading towards having neck only at 5, and bridge only at 1 per the diagram, and thats all fine but remember that the actual knob will be at the other end of he switch to where the connected lugs are. Thats just an issue in relation to which way round you physically place the switch. So the neck pickup, while being connected to the top half on the diagram, is actually physically down the bottom, lower on the diagram than the bridge pup. Sorry if you already sussed that, but just checking.

My tone control suggestion: to make that work I usually have the neck to be the one permanently grounded rather then the bridge. But based on your diagram, you could do it like this:

tone cap from volume pot to tone pot centre lug
lower tone pot lug to ground
upper tone pot lug to the green series link.

cheers

John

[thetragichero]

i think i got it!

[asmith]

I think you got it too. I'd be interested to see what that enhanced tone control can get up to. And if you're not a high gain player, the settings ought to work together real nice. I'm excited to hear some kind of arrangement in which you might do most of your playing at about four to six on the volume control, on one of the single coils or in parallel mode, blast into the hotter series position for a heavy chorus, then rip into a more-gained solo on position one, activating 'limelight mode.'

Which means I require pics and sound samples once completed. Get some welly in your Tele. On the double!

[thetragichero]

the neck won't be ready until january/february.... ordered it from a builder (not warmoth this time), and saved a few hundred off the warmoth price. only problem is it's a one-man operation so it'll take longer for me to get

i owe you guys TONS of samples.... my 5e3 clone, the booster pedal with switchable diode clipping, as well as all of the guitars you guys have helped me with

finally have an easy recording setup, and i'm working on getting my marshall head back up and running... someday, i promise!

[sumgai]

TTH,

Who's doing your neck?

[thetragichero]

one of the techs on the marshallforum: www.lydian.ca/Home.html