Strat SSM2 - HSS with 15 sounds and one dpdt

[JohnH]

Here’s a further development of the SSM design. I’ve built this into my Strat and its working very well.



(Edit 14/9/13) This system is designed to use standard single coils, with a humbucker, rather than noiseless singles. Although it will work with noiselss pickups, the pot values and the ways that coils are combined are optimised for normal pickups, to cancel hum between coils wherever possible. With noiseless singles, combinations involving a bridge coil and N or M will hum, to a small extent. I have built this with two Texas Specials of 6.2k, and a humbucker of 8.4k, on my American Special Strat. To make the noise cancelling work, the relative magnetic polarity of the coils is important, and this is indicated by the shading colours of the pickups in the diagrams.

The main change from the base design is to include the dpdt switch noted above, which swaps a bridge coil with the M pup, and delivers a new set of 5 different sounds on the 5-way. I also found that I wanted to put a tone control back, so there is now a master tone pot, and one series/single pot which acts at positions 5, 4 and 2. I wanted the Bridge humbucker in position 1 to be unaffected by the series pot, since it is the main go-to sound, and bridge single is now available as its own setting.

With the series blend pot and new dpdt, there are now 15 different sounds, with tone control. I think that is not too bad a collection for just one extra dpdt switch.

All the sounds are good. There is a single coil sound for B, M and N, and all pairs of humcancelling coils are available in series or parallel (and no humming pairs), plus four three-coil series/parallel settings.

The bridge parallel sound is a nice surprise, very clear and bright but a bit weightier and smoother than a pure single. Putting the M into the series combinations instead of a bridge coil adds extra girth, as a contrast to the bridge humbucker, and Neck x Bridge sound.

In use, the default 5 sounds for an HSS (Bhb, B+M, M, M+N, N) are all there with S2 down and series pot at min.

The use of the no-load tone pot seems important (or use 500k pots). In the thick series settings such as NxM, the tone starts to change as soon as the pot gets off its no-load setting.

I tried with a few cap values, but settled on a standard 22nF. With a wide range of series and parallel options, there is a factor of about 5 in pickup inductance, from parallel bridge coils to NxM series, and the resonant sound at minimum tone varies widely. With parallel bridge coils, its a very usable honky kind of tone.

The dpdt could be of any type. For this build, I am trying a sub-miniature toggle, which fits through a 5mm hole instead of the usual 6.5mm. It’s less clunky looking than a normal mini and I have it set between the two ‘tone’ pots.



I will try this with the band next week...

cheers
John

(Edit: 27/10/13)

Humbucker to single blending

This further version adds blender control to position 1, to allow it to transition from humbucker to single coil. It will behave like a 'spin-a-split' control. When it does this, it gives the opposite bridge single to that available in mode 2 position 3. It is also likely to give a good effect controlling the amount of M in series with the B single, in mode 2. The only differences to the version above is one link removed on the main switch, and one blend-pot wire moved.

[0wnyourtone]

John, rookie question here: do you have a description for your terminology in your diagram, as far as your pickup combinations? I get Bs and Bn are Bridge South and North, but is x series and + parallel? When you say "to" are you saying in series to? Cool diagram, looking forward to hearing how it holds with the band.

[JohnH]

Hi OwnYourTone, and welcome to GN2!

(to others: OYT is a generous and inventive contributor on StratTalk, so I'm glad he's here)

I added a note about the blending, which is what I describe as, for example, NxM to N, being the series blender changing the sound in position 5, from neck and middle in series, to neck only. BTW, this control is a lot of fun, and there is a big difference between NxM and NxBs, both useful and different to N.

yes, around here, we use x for series and + for parallel combos.

Band night tomorrow. This is about the 4th incremental partial rewiring of this lucky Strat since December, so it should work out fine. This last iteration does more than I need, but, I just like it for its range and simplicity and how the basic tones are no harder to find than normal.

cheers
John

[0wnyourtone]

Thank you for the kind introduction, it's good to be here! I can see there is a lot to be learned and I look forward to it.

[JohnH]

I’ve been playing this build for a few days now, at home and loudly with the band during the week.

It’s quite a lot of fun. The toggle switch basically creates two Strat guitars, both covering a full range of tones from bright to dark, but different. Each bank has 8 sounds, overlapping only on Neck single-coil.

Mode 1 – switch down
Switch down, covers the basic expected tones for an HSS Strat, with 2, 4 and 5 affected by the blender. This is offering two versions of Bridge/middle quack, being with humbucker or single bridge coil in parallel with M. Standard HSS wirings usually have one or the other, but they are interestingly different. N is series with a bridge coil is a clear bright series sound and a good build upon the Neck single. With the tone control now back in, there are plenty of dark options in mode 1. I found this first mode remains the most useful so, I think this would be a valid reduced design on its own without the toggle switch, since it only lacks the ultimate bridge single spank from mode 2, but with some very bright sounds from M and M+B available.

Mode 2 – switch up
Mode 2, toggle switch up (swapping middle with one bridge coil), thickens and darkens the series options at 1 and 5, and brightens the middle three 2, 3 and 4. Bridge coils in parallel and b+n single are valuable tones here. The B parallel is the best single-ish coil sound. Between positions 3, 4 and 5, with blender at minimum, the guitar behaves as virtual ‘Tele’, with Bsingle, B+N singles and Nsingle.

Sound samples soon.
J

[rpelton]

Hi to all,

New to the forum and especially new to guitar wiring. I am just finishing a build of a Jazzmaster style body with SSS strat electronics (CRL 5 way, CTS 250k pots, treble bleed kit and a choice of Mallory .01uF or .047Mfd Orange Drop cap) and looking for something different in the wiring, I found a post at Strat-talk that intrigued me. Which led me to track down JohnDH who seemed to know exactly what he was talking about in this post. Which in turn led me here to JohnH and after reading a number of diagrams and posts I think I would like to try this scheme. 

My sole problem (I think) is being a newbie to all this, I have no idea how to wire the single coil in the bridge position instead of the humbucker in John's diagram.

Also a question, are the no-load pots absolutely necessary or will the CTS that I already have suffice. I've already put too much into this as it is but if necessary a few more Euros won't kill me!

Thanks in advance!

Ron

[newey]

Ron-

Hello and Welcome to G-Nutz2!

While JohnH's scheme here could probably be modified for a SSS guitar, the HB wiring is a major part of this scheme. The S2 switch is there solely because of the HB, and one of the tone pots is used to split the HB. So, once you take out the HB, there's not much left of this scheme!

There are a number of ways to do series wiring if that's what you want.

You can convert your existing pots to be no-load pots. JohnH has instructions for that around here as well, I'll see if I can dig them up. Worst case scenario, if you butcher the pots, then you'll need to buy new ones. But pots are fairly cheap.

I think you would be better served, rather than to try to "shoehorn" your guitar into a particular scheme would be to focus on the tones you want to achieve, and we can help from there, either by pointing you towards an existing design or customizing one for you.

What switching do you have available? How are the tone caps being switched now?

[rpelton]

Hi Newey, 

and thanks for the welcome. 

I was originally attracted to the diagram that I linked to on the Strat-talk forum because it allegedly offered normal Strat sounds, Tele-like sounds and LP humbucker like sounds. JohnH seemed impressed by what it offered. What I didn't like was the lack of a tone control. What John proposed on that forum sounded good to me so I searched for it here. Since I am new to all of this, perhaps I haven't found the right diagram that John was speaking of, or perhaps he never posted it. 

I am basically an amateur luthier and a real amateur guitarist and completely new to electrics but have been restoring, rebuilding etc. acoustics for some years. Recently a friend gifted me with a custom boutique tube amp that I am sure most guys would kill for. So I thought I should build a suitable guitar for it. This is all in way of saying that I am not really sure what sounds I am looking for other than it seemed like a good idea to have Strat, Tele and LP sounds in the same package! 

"What switching do you have available?"

What I currently have is a 5 way CRL switch. 

"How are the tone caps being switched now?"

Well, they aren't, cause its an entirely new build. Nothings wired yet nor has it ever been. The caps that I mentioned are just what I have available to use, thought it might help somebody in the event that they wanted to make a recommendation.

Hope some of this helps.

[JohnH]

Hi Ron,

Thanks for your interest in such schemes. This one does indeed need a humbucker at the bridge, or else it doesnt make so much sense. But I think I see what happened, when you linked to this post of mine:

www.strat-talk.com/forum/1305087-post18.html

I was commenting on another scheme by another chap, which is for SSS and how I would extend it. Id be happy to help, but lets get off of this thread, which is specifically about my HSS scheme. If you start another new one under general guitar wiring, we can talk further there if you like.

John

[genmce]

I think I am going to try this is the danoblaster 12string.
Will at 250k standard - not "no-load" pot work for the series blender?

I was going to use a 250k push pull pot so I can grab switch and twist at the same time, will that work?

I also want to add another humbucker in the neck position (it's already there) with dpdt on on on switch to series-parallel/split on the neck pickup.

Should I change to 500k tone because of the hsh?

[JohnH]

Sept 8, 2013 10:38:26 GMT -5 genmce said:

I think I am going to try this is the danoblaster 12string.
Will at 250k standard - not "no-load" pot work for the series blender?

I was going to use a 250k push pull pot so I can grab switch and twist at the same time, will that work?

I also want to add another humbucker in the neck position (it's already there) with dpdt on on on switch to series-parallel/split on the neck pickup.

Should I change to 500k tone because of the hsh?

Great!

Id say tes, youll be oK with the standard 250k pot for the blender, so long as it is log taper. I find on mine, that theres negligible change in tone as it goes from 250k to open circuit.

The tone pot, I think is well worth having as no load, and 250k is fine in that case, unless you changed to 500k for both volume and tone. The max brightness of two 250k pots, with the tone pot being no load, is the same as two 500k standard pots.

One neat option might be to lose the extra ononon switch, and have your neck humbucker just with two options on a push pull, have the another pot as push pull to do the mode selection, and have 250k series blend, 500k volume and tone. If you do a 500k volume pot, then change the 120k treble bleed resistor to 150k.

Good luck! and plaese post your results (thats the only price for using these designs!)
cheers
John

[genmce]

Sept 8, 2013 15:21:53 GMT -5 JohnH said:

Sept 8, 2013 10:38:26 GMT -5 genmce said:

I think I am going to try this is the danoblaster 12string.
Will at 250k standard - not "no-load" pot work for the series blender?

I was going to use a 250k push pull pot so I can grab switch and twist at the same time, will that work?

I also want to add another humbucker in the neck position (it's already there) with dpdt on on on switch to series-parallel/split on the neck pickup.

Should I change to 500k tone because of the hsh?

Great!

Id say tes, youll be oK with the standard 250k pot for the blender, so long as it is log taper. I find on mine, that theres negligible change in tone as it goes from 250k to open circuit.

The tone pot, I think is well worth having as no load, and 250k is fine in that case, unless you changed to 500k for both volume and tone. The max brightness of two 250k pots, with the tone pot being no load, is the same as two 500k standard pots.

One neat option might be to lose the extra ononon switch, and have your neck humbucker just with two options on a push pull, have the another pot as push pull to do the mode selection, and have 250k series blend, 500k volume and tone. If you do a 500k volume pot, then change the 120k treble bleed resistor to 150k.
snip -
John

Ok - so I can use a 500k push- pull (I like the bright sounds) if it is NOT a no load for tone?
I don't have any 250k no-load pots - is there a link on how to make them from a stock pot?

I like the push pull idea - I was thinking of using it for phase on the neck humbucker - the danelectro 12 string has a 5 switch holes and 4 knob holes - so I have plenty of room for switches - I don't want to derail the thread.

[JohnH]

Ok.with the addition of phase snd a neck hb, its drifting a bit away from this thread, which is about a specific hss design. So how about you start a new thread in the main wiring section. We can talk there.

[genmce]

Hey - ok I am trying this diagram stock on a different guitar.
I have an SD rails humbucker pickup in the bridge.
Fender hot noiseless neck, fender hot noisless middle rw.

When I test the neck and middle are in phase, however the
bridge is out of phase.

I am not sure which wires to switch on humbucker to get correct phase.

I looked at this chart to convert
www.seymourduncan.com/support/schematics/schematics.php?schematic=color_codes
However - It looks like Fender and dimarzio are different...

I currently have: based on Dimarzio
black to s1 in place of your red.
red to s2 in place of your white.
white to s1 in place of your black
green to ground on volume pot as you have it.

Which wires from sd humbucker do I need to switch?
The black and the green?

I am going to try convert from fender.
EDIT:

Conversion to fender - now in phase however, I don't think I have the sd rails wired in properly.

Fender conversion to SD ?
green ns = black ns
white nf = white nf
black sf = red sf
red ss = green ss

Results - s2 down series pot 0 = B and M are very noisy together I suspect I have wrong coils on humbucker acting together with middle.
Lots of noisy combinations all over - I have something wrong - please advise.
I 500k volume push/pull, 250k series blender, 500k master tone.

[JohnH]

Thanks for trying this. We will make it work.

The humcancelling all drops into place and works so nicely when its right, that when its not right its all wrong.

But i also see you are using noiseless pickups. So when one of these gets combined with another coil, noise must become unbalanced. It shouldnt be too bad though, less thsn s standard single coil.

Im not sure about Fender/diMarzio converdions, because my Fender hb seemed to match dimarzio, while data from web suggested not.

To check:
In each position, are the intended coils active - Tap test- list them
Do the different magnetic polarities match the diagram. Ie is M the same as the nearest B coil?
Which wire colours connect to which coil ( test them)
In mode 2, setting 3 changes from M to one of the B coils. Which one?
Are any sounds now out of phase?
Is the noise worse than a normal single coil?
Test with a meter, meassuring resistance across the jack, vol and tone at max, both modes, all positions, sweeping the blender (thsts 5x2x2=20 values)
Cheers
J

[genmce]

Resistance measurements - before I tear it open.
Volume knob on 10 tone on 10
switch off - 5 way lever positions
series knob 0 (taptest) | sknob 10 (taptest)
5 10.30 (N)quiet | 15.35 (NB)hums - brider inside rail louder
4 5.18 (NM) quiet| 6.21 (NMB)hums less - brigde inside rail louder
3 10.22 (M) quiet| 10.23 (M)quiet
2 3.55 (MB)Hums - bride outside rail louder | 5.24 (MB) no hum - bridge both rails loud
1 10.67 (B)bride both rails loud | 10.67 (B) bridge both rails loud

switch on
series knob 0 and 10
5 15.40 (N)quiet | 15.40 (NM)quiet
4 2.70 (NB)hums bridge inside rail louder | 4.00 (NMB)hums more - bridge inside rail louder
3 5.40 (B)hums much - inside rail louder | 5.40 (B) hums much - inside rail louder
2 3.56 (B)quiet - both rails loud | 4.27 (MB)hums a little both rails loud
1 10.30(MB)hums much - outside rail louder | 19.73 (MB)hums much - outside rail louder

That's all I can do this morning - have to go to work now.

When I tested phase relationships last night all positions were in phase.
I will confirm that this evening.

[JohnH]

Sept 10, 2013 7:26:31 GMT -5 genmce said:

Resistance measurements - before I tear it open.
Volume knob on 10 tone on 10
switch off - 5 way lever positions
series knob 0 (taptest) | sknob 10 (taptest)
5 10.30 (N)quiet | 15.35 (NB)hums - brider inside rail louder
4 5.18 (NM) quiet| 6.21 (NMB)hums less - brigde inside rail louder
3 10.22 (M) quiet| 10.23 (M)quiet
2 3.55 (MB)Hums - bride outside rail louder | 5.24 (MB) no hum - bridge both rails loud
1 10.67 (B)bride both rails loud | 10.67 (B) bridge both rails loud

switch on
series knob 0 and 10
5 15.40 (N)quiet | 15.40 (NM)quiet
4 2.70 (NB)hums bridge inside rail louder | 4.00 (NMB)hums more - bridge inside rail louder
3 5.40 (B)hums much - inside rail louder | 5.40 (B) hums much - inside rail louder
2 3.56 (B)quiet - both rails loud | 4.27 (MB)hums a little both rails loud
1 10.30(MB)hums much - outside rail louder | 19.73 (MB)hums much - outside rail louder


That's all I can do this morning - have to go to work now.

When I tested phase relationships last night all positions were in phase.
I will confirm that this evening.

Those are good tests. The first set all check out, assuming all pickups are around 10 to 11 k, you can see the bridge coil of about half that adding in, and the resulting paralel resistances in position 2 and 4


but the second set are out of wack in some way. The first, with blender at min, is just neck on its own, and should be the same as set 1, and increasing as a bridge coil is added.

position 1 is not affected by the blender and should not change

[genmce]

Thanks John,

I will open it up tonight and point by point confirm the wiring matches the diagram.
Especially at the series switch -
I will document which wires connect where from the humbucker.

Do the different magnetic polarities match the diagram. Ie is M the same as the nearest B coil?
Which wire colours connect to which coil ( test them)
In mode 2, setting 3 changes from M to one of the B coils. Which one? JohnH

How do I tell if the magnetic polarities match the diagram?
All the noisless pickups have 2 output wires only - there is a solder blob to connect the other two however
I have not done that.
How do I tell which coil of B is active? taptest? Will the result be significant meaning no sound on one coil/rail or lower sound on one coil - like I observed in my tests?

[JohnH]

On magnetic polarities, just to work out which arethe same. maybe you have a compass or another pickup and see which ones its attracted to on the guitar.

As to which coil is active, tap tests as you have done, and on an Hb, there is some cross over so its a matter of which coil is louder.

The second set of readings make a bit more sense if the order 1 to 5 was reversed (eg, bridge setting is not affected by blender), but not entirely, since neck on its own, being a noisecancelling pickup, shold be quiet in both modes.

So I think just check them.

Also, Id have to say that the use of noise cancelling pickups with a design like this brings its issues. With standard single coils, we accept and embrace the fact that they have a bit of hum, and are also bright and sparky because pf their low impedance and simplicity. Putting them into this design is then all good news because the hum gets reduced in most modes. But with noiseless (which have extra noise cancelling coils), you have started with an expectation of perfectly low noise, and when an extra coil is mixed in which is not itself cancelled, theres noise! Not worse than a single coil, but its there. Also, I have never tried noiseless pickups, so I dont know how they go in a series combo in terms of added impedance, since at 10k plus, they already have quite a lot of it. But Fender use them in their Am Delux. But they also use 1M pots, and that brings its own raft of issues.

So on this, lets get to the point of being confident that at least it is wired up as it should be, so that you can then decide about what you think of it.

John

[genmce]

Ok - you are right it's not stock.
I will pull the noiseless hot fenders, and put in single coils in the middle and bridge.
I don't have another rw middle pickup tho... will that make a difference too?

Yeah I may be confusing the numbering scheme.
I always think of Neck being 1 - left to right.

[4real]

I really like noiseless pickups and have a variation of the MR scheme on my strat that looks completely 'stock' by use of push pulls and superswitch and a 'select-spin' HB control...results in more than 30 combinations...

The noiseless means you don't need to worry too much about the combinations as all but the HB bridge pup split are nopiseless, and because that is also variable, most of those are mostly 'noiseless' also.

True, there might well be differences in the impedance aspects, but the results are similar, just without noise...so if you like the sound of the pups then there is no advantages to changing them...

For me, I don't like 'noise' and we live in an increasingly 'noisy environment' with fluro lights and computers and such...I don't like the high end masked by 'hiss' either and that sound can also play havoc with effects too...'noiseless pickups' have undergone a bit of a revolution in recent times too, they generally are not just 'simple stacks' that had significant problems. They are not 'the same' though pups like Kinmans are astonishingly good, even hank marvin plays them. When the guitar is not playing, I want my guitars to be 'silent' personally and dont like noise reduction as a rule and that will not remove it when the guitar is sounded anyway...

The fender "noiseless" neck pup in my tele sounds better than any conventional noisy pup of that type that I've come across which can be pretty hit and miss and very much the 'single coil tone' that people like...

Some things to consider...but basically your 'trick wiring' with noiseless pickups do much as you might expect from any pups, just without the noise...my strat has the older fender noiseless 'hot' pups as used in the Jeff Beck strat and a bridge seymour duncan JB HB which splits really well. By including a variable control, turning on coil down a bit gives some noise cancellation and a good single coil-ish sound with body, I prefer the neck most coil of the bridge HB with a touch of the bridge side mixed in as a rule so the sound is not too 'brittle'.

Perhaps the series sounds are a bit 'darker', I've not heard the true single coil versions, but they are still good and usable if you want those kinds of things, or with mine, canb e brightened up in various ways, such as with the phase switch in the tone control or more HB split or selecting the bridge side HB coil...

The thing that is most improved on mine was the ability to get a nice balance between the bridge HB and the 'singles' both in volume and 'strat-ish' tone, generally been a compromise with HSS strats...

[genmce]

Ok so I test polarity on the pickups.
M and Bridge nearest coil are not the same polarity.
If I use single coil pickups - I do not have the reverse wound middle.
But if the polarities are different won't they still hum cancel?

If I go back to my Fender Hot noiseless the middle is reverse wound and the polarities between nearest bridge coil and middle are not the same polarity -
won't that bring back the hum?
Hmmm - I should post this in the hum canceling section - right?

I check my wiring and it matches the drawing - Not sure how to handle my Seymour duncen rails pickup on this scheme. It appears correct to me.

I currently have
black to ground on volume pot
green to s1 first (furthest from me bridge pick up closest to me) lug on left side
red to lug 2 on right side
white to middle terminal on S2

Not sure what to try next.

EDIT:
I have the single coils in Neck and Middle.
Quite a duck in there on 2 - plenty of hum in plenty of places.
position 1 is quiet.
Not sure what else to do. Thanks for all the help.

[newey]

But if the polarities are different won't they still hum cancel?

Well, only if we make the further assumption (likely true, but still an assumption) that the opposite polarity implies opposite winding direction as well. It's the winding direction that matters to hum cancelling- the noise is induced in the windings, acting like a long antenna, not in the magnets. But given that all pickups are from the same manufacturer, it's reasonable to assume that the reverse polarity coil is also reverse wound as well. Your HB has one of each, and so one of the two will be opposite (RWRP) from the middle.

If the magnets were opposite and the windings were not reversed, then the two coils would also be OOP- which you'd notice.

[JohnH]

Its a bit hard to tell whats going on, but Your seymour duncan wiring seems reasonable, and you are sure that everything is in phase? See screwdriver pulloff test in reference section.

Theres a couple of things may be blurring the issue. One is the list of readings and being sure of the order, which coils are on and if they hum. Your set up will have hum, but is it more than it needs to be? It is not an ideal design to preserve the qualities of noiseless pickups - its more about getting good options with standard pickups, but it should work. And there are some settings with what you have, that should be very quiet, and it seems they are not. Any single pickup, N, M or full humbucker, and mode 2 position 2 (bridge coils in parallel) with blend at minimum, also position 4 mode 1 belnd at minimum (N+M)

I think its worth trying to be sure it is working as it should. Can you tell if you ever get more than a normal single coil amount of hum? because it should be less.

btw My diagrams follow Fender standard convention for position numbering, which is from B = 1 to N = 5

J

[genmce]

Sept 11, 2013 15:36:52 GMT -5 JohnH said:

Its a bit hard to tell whats going on, but Your seymour duncan wiring seems reasonable, and you are sure that everything is in phase? See screwdriver pulloff test in reference section.

Theres a couple of things may be blurring the issue. One is the list of readings and being sure of the order, which coils are on and if they hum. Your set up will have hum, but is it more than it needs to be? It is not an ideal design to preserve the qualities of noiseless pickups - its more about getting good options with standard pickups, but it should work. And there are some settings with what you have, that should be very quiet, and it seems they are not. Any single pickup, N, M or full humbucker, and mode 2 position 2 (bridge coils in parallel) with blend at minimum, also position 4 mode 1 belnd at minimum (N+M)

I think its worth trying to be sure it is working as it should. Can you tell if you ever get more than a normal single coil amount of hum? because it should be less.

btw My diagrams follow Fender standard convention for position numbering, which is from B = 1 to N = 5

J

[genmce]

Hum may have been do to poor testing conditions - including proximity to noisy computer as well as plugged in cheapo soldering iron. Also a hi compressor setting on my fender cybertwin SE

Current state standard single coils (NOT noiseless) in Neck and Middle (not rwrp in M - I think it's just another neck pickup)

Pickup (pull off) phase tests = all in phase.
Pickup tap tests = match SSM2 diagram
Bs corresponds to my HB inner rail
Bn corresponds to my Hb outer rail
Polarity (compass test) - Neck and Middle match - Hb inner coil NOT same polarity as Neck and M pickup - outer coil does match polarity of N M.

Should Bs and M have same polarity? or opposite? In my current state they are opposite.

I am almost certain I have it wired correctly now.
Hum and noise - my frame of reference is skewed - am listening too closely.
I think position 4 hums too much - perhaps I need to swap hb coils to be same polarity as M?
I think not having rw middle may be giving me noise as well?

If I could find a minute to actually play it now...
Hopefully later tonight.

[genmce]

Sept 10, 2013 18:24:37 GMT -5 4real said:

I really like noiseless pickups and have a variation of the MR scheme on my strat that looks completely 'stock' by use of push pulls and superswitch and a 'select-spin' HB control...results in more than 30 combinations...

Yup - have gone thru the hb spin select with you already on another guitar and love it. I will reply there about the noiseless pickups. I don't want to derail the SSM2 thread.

[JohnH]

The magnetic polarities intended for the SSM2 are shown by the red and blue shading of pickups. N and M should be different, and its important that the M pickup is the same polarity as the B coil which is wired as the one nearest to M. These two get swapped when the mode is changed.

[genmce]

Sept 12, 2013 7:10:54 GMT -5 JohnH said:

The magnetic polarities intended for the SSM2 are shown by the red and blue shading of pickups. N and M should be different, and its important that the M pickup is the same polarity as the B coil which is wired as the one nearest to M. These two get swapped when the mode is changed.

I did not know the colors were polarity - duh... makes sense now.
$.02 suggestion note that on the diagrams.

I have my work cut out for me.

1. Finding neck and middle pickup combos that have different polarity.
2. Somehow changing hb inner coil (coil nearest M pickup) to match polarity of the M pickup.
- not sure how to manage that - besides using a different M pickup - might have to try the noiseless again or use a very cheapo rwrp from an strat copy ... which might solve 1 and 2
3. Making sure hb coil nearest M pick is the active coil when split. Which wires to switch...
4. Rewire the $&*(@&!($) thing again...
5. Have a cold beverage and jam with some friends.

[JohnH]

Maybe you should do in reverse order, cold beer, then jam, and see if you like the basic way it operates and makes the sounds. Then if you think you like it, work on the noise. Most SSS and HSS pickup sets would have an rwrp middle. On the bridge pickup, if you wire it so the coil with similar polarity to M is the one with a wire to the dpdt switch (as shown), it does matter electrically if the hb is physically the other way round (per the diagram, blue coil would be to the bridge). But it sounds better as drawn.

Thanks for your suggestion too.