andygprs
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Post by andygprs on Sept 11, 2013 18:16:30 GMT -5
Help!! So, I've wired everthing up apart from the kill switch.
I think I've wired it correctly but basically if the bridge tap is not engaged, I get virtually no sound from the guitar in any position on the five way....if I do engage it, it sounds fairly normal If the bridge coil tap is on, the neck and neck and middle and middle positions seem to work well, tapped and not. However, id I turn the (bridge) tone control then I lose the signal on the non-bridge pickup selections.
In general there is way more buzz coming from the amp than with any other guitar.
The pickup selection works, the coil tap on the neck and middle works (middle at least with how the guitar sounds now does appear to be a waste of time, much too weak).....but the problem seems to be with the bridge pickup area of the wiring.
I've checked and double checked and everything seems to be correct.
I've earthed everything but also the switch cavity is coated in conductive shielding paint so my continuity tester showed connection from the case of all the pots and switches before I had earthed them all together.
I know the likelihood is that I've done something stupid, but is everyone happy that the hardwire tone for the bridge is correct and not causing some of these strange effects.
Thanks, Andy
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Post by newey on Sept 11, 2013 22:35:31 GMT -5
Well, at this point "everyone" is just me. The fact that only my eyeballs have been on the diagram may be a problem in itself. So, you may want to wait for someone else to chime in before I potentially lead you further astray . . . But the tone control shouldn't be creating something that would vary depending on the position of the bridge coil-cut switch. What you are describing is all very bizarre. The most telling point is your statement that the guitar is noisy- that shouldn't be the case, and it suggests that something somewhere is touching something it shouldn't be touching. But I don't have a good explanation for what you're describing, so I'm kind of taking stabs in the dark here. First thing is to check that you haven't accidentally swapped the wires to the output jack around, that is, make sure the sleeve is wired to ground and tip to "hot". Having them backwards wouldn't really explain the behavior you're describing, but it's easy to do the wrong way, and just as easy to double check it to be sure. Lots of strange stuff can happen if they're swapped. Again, a stab in the dark here, but check it to be sure. Assuming that's OK, look again at those switch connections. You are looking for any tiny piece of wire, a stray strand which might be bridging two lugs. Take a toothpick or similar object and run it up, down and across each of the switches, around each of the lugs- you're trying to "sweep away" any extra strands. These are often very tiny and hard to see. Next, if you look at the bridge coil cut switch, and at the neck/mid switch, there is a grey wire I show running from the lower right-hand lug of the neck/mid switch to the lower right lug of the bridge switch, and from there to ground. Please disconnect this wire where it runs between the two switches. Connect the neck/mid switch lower right lug directly to the grounding point with a separate wire, and leave the existing ground wire running from the bridge lower right lug to ground. IOW, instead of daisy-chaining the two switches grounds together, I'm asking you to run separate ground wires from the neck and bridge switches. Both are off of the lower right-hand lug. Again, this is a stab in the dark here. If those suggestions don't help, then more involved testing and troubleshooting will need to be done. Several questions: Do you have a multimeter? Did you by any chance test the pots and or switches before wiring them? Did you by any chance measure the DC resistance of the pickups before you began wiring? (Not to worry if you didn't do those last two, it may just simplify things a bit if you did.)
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Post by JohnH on Sept 12, 2013 2:46:03 GMT -5
The diagram seems fine. A multimeter is needed.
When you said that it only works when the bridge is tapped, if instead it was the 'bridge on' that needed to be engaged, it might indicate a bad connection there. Also, to confirm which lugs on the 5 way ard the poles-normally as newey drew it.
With the multimeter, you should connect it across a cord plugged into the jack, and with knobs at max, measure resistance in every switch setting. Thats 5x2x2=20 readings. J
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andygprs
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Post by andygprs on Sept 12, 2013 8:02:11 GMT -5
To be honest, I was so depressed after a few hours of doing it that I made the bad decision to try a completely different wiring set up from the Dimarzio site as below. It was almost midnight in the UK at that point and wanted to get the guitar ready to record with the next day. The new design doesn't tap the middle humbucker but I went for it as I could see the middle humbucker was in fact very weedy when tapped from my first attempt. This wiring attempt was much quieter generally but still ran into issues. Do you think it could be a faulty component? I have a continuity tester and tested the earthing and the positions on the 5-way..... I couldn't see what cap value to use, and as it was on the tone wasn't sure it was doing so I took that lug straight to ground. Is that a problem? Initially the volume was off fully clockwise / on fully counterclockwise so I swapped the bottom and top lug connections on that pot. Everything appears to work in the coil tap and ‘add bridge’ positions. Without the tap or add bridge selected, there is something very strange going on – in the neck position with the tone fully open, it mutes…..as soon as the pot is turned, even a little, the sound returns. It doesn’t do this in the other 5 way switch positions. The tone also seems to work more like a volume/phase control than a tone control with the neck selected. I have tried swapping from the bottom to top lug on the tone pot but the issue is still there. Also, the loudest position appears to be neck and middle humbuckers together....which is surprising as the middle humbucker alone is quite quiet. I would have suspected a faulty tone pot, but in the other 5 way positions the tone operates normally turned to each extreme. Do you have any ideas as I am really stumped and stayed up till 4am testing and re-checking all of the connections were correct Thanks, Andy
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Post by newey on Sept 12, 2013 15:42:14 GMT -5
Do you mean that you took the cap out and just put a wire to ground in its place? If so, you don't have a tone control, you have a wonky second volume control which will not act consistently. It is wired with only 2 lugs, as a rheostat, instead of three lugs like a volume potentiometer.
This could explain some of your problems, but there's more going on here as well. The wonky tone control doesn't explain why the neck setting should be affected in the way that you describe.
A bad component is certainly a possibility. Since you're no longer using my scheme, for get what I said earlier. You need a multimeter to do any serious troubleshooting, a simple continuity tester won't cut it.
One other question. Since you are no longer splitting the middle pickup, how did you wire it up? Did you connect the white/black wires together again?
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andygprs
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Post by andygprs on Sept 12, 2013 16:59:14 GMT -5
Hi, Apart from extreme tiredness, I think I also caused the problems using too thick a gauge of wire....I thought it would carry the signals well, but it's way too big and therefore clumsy to use and difficult to solder clearly to lugs etc. Anyhow, I put a cap in where it should be on the tone and swapped the lugs the right way around on the volume. I had some noise which was a weird ground loop that I've now sorted. I did solder the white and black wires together. Everything is much better. However, the tone control doesn't work (tried two different identical capacitors) and the variation in pickup selections isn't exactly as I would expect. I think I'll re-do it from scratch with new thinner gauge wires when I get it. Then hopefully it'll work... Cheers, Andy PS - on the upside the band played with the parts and mixes for 2 of the songs for our imminent release and it's really raised my spirits PPS - also on the upside the guitar sounds really good so I think it'll be ideal once I do a proper job on the wiring!
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Post by newey on Sept 12, 2013 22:18:19 GMT -5
There is, perhaps, a lesson to be learned here. It's a "teachable moment", as those with M.Ed degrees are fond of saying. So, andygprs, I hope you'll pardon me for using you as an example here. And, others have said this before, as I have, here and elsewhere. I've had to learn these lessons the hard way myself. - The night before the gig, the night before the big recording session, or right before your tour manager tells the roadies to load out, are not ideal times to plan to modify your principal axe.
- Any guitar mods of even moderate complexity are not likely to work the first time, and some amount of troubleshooting is ordinarily required. Plan accordingly. Often, the troubleshooting will occupy more time that the wiring did.
- Never forget the "Six Ps" (Prior Planning Prevents Piss-Poor Performance). Make notes. Test components before wiring them up. Note the DC resistance of pickups before wiring them up. Take your time and plan out the various tasks ahead of time.
[/lecture]
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andygprs
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Post by andygprs on Sept 13, 2013 2:26:05 GMT -5
Hi, You are absolutely right and I am certainly not above learning. I should add that this was an aspiration to get my guitar ready to use to record, but it isn't currently that, I have a favourite Strat and a PRS CE-24 that currently fufil those roles. I was lent a multimeter and other kit last night so I shall find the time to try again with the wiring. Thanks for the continued help. Andy
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