ejsim
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Post by ejsim on May 19, 2015 15:07:06 GMT -5
Hello all, I'm new here and playing around with potential wiring schemes for a partscaster I'm building, so I figured I should start a thread.
Basically, I have an idea as to what I'd like the guitar to do, and I wanted to know how (im)possible it is. Standard SSS strat, one volume, two tones (although I'd like the second to be a TBX, so no push-pull there). Is there a way to have the volume push-pull be a "master series-parallel" and the first tone push-pull be a phase switcher for the neck pickup? As follows:
Volume pot down: Pos 1 - B Pos 2 - B and M in parallel Pos 3 - B and N in parallel Pos 4 - M and N in parallel Pos 5 - N
...and with the volume pot up, all the same but in series instead of parallel? Is this something that can be done (maybe with a super switch)?
Thanks for any input!
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Post by JFrankParnell on May 19, 2015 15:59:50 GMT -5
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Post by JohnH on May 19, 2015 20:51:12 GMT -5
Hello all, I'm new here and playing around with potential wiring schemes for a partscaster I'm building, so I figured I should start a thread. Basically, I have an idea as to what I'd like the guitar to do, and I wanted to know how (im)possible it is. Standard SSS strat, one volume, two tones (although I'd like the second to be a TBX, so no push-pull there). Is there a way to have the volume push-pull be a "master series-parallel" and the first tone push-pull be a phase switcher for the neck pickup? As follows: Volume pot down:Pos 1 - B Pos 2 - B and M in parallel Pos 3 - B and N in parallel Pos 4 - M and N in parallel Pos 5 - N ...and with the volume pot up, all the same but in series instead of parallel? Is this something that can be done (maybe with a super switch)? Thanks for any input! Yes indeed. This scheme is almost exactly that: guitarnuts2.proboards.com/thread/5380/strat-spWould just need to amend it for a two tone pots, or just have the masrer TBX, plus the series fader (see thread).
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ejsim
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Post by ejsim on May 19, 2015 21:38:09 GMT -5
Wow, that's convenient! Thanks for directing me towards that. I don't really need two separate tone knobs, so the master TBX should work like a charm.
Do you have any recommendations for the pot values? I saw you were thinking 500k volume and 250k fader, both audio. I'll be using Lace Sensors, if that makes any difference.
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Post by JohnH on May 19, 2015 22:46:42 GMT -5
The values shown should work well with the TBX and your pickups. That will give you max clarity in series mode if you want it, or use rhe TBX to trim the treble. You'll need to put the fade control with the phase switch, so the TBX can be the one with no pp switch. Just imagine the phase switch with its wires, dragged to the right and fixed to the fade control. The middle knob could be the TBX with its two parts and resistor/cap, ignoring the 47nF cap as currently shown. The TBX has a ground and a hot connection as normal.
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ejsim
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Post by ejsim on May 21, 2015 2:27:21 GMT -5
The values shown should work well with the TBX and your pickups. That will give you max clarity in series mode if you want it, or use rhe TBX to trim the treble. You'll need to put the fade control with the phase switch, so the TBX can be the one with no pp switch. Just imagine the phase switch with its wires, dragged to the right and fixed to the fade control. The middle knob could be the TBX with its two parts and resistor/cap, ignoring the 47nF cap as currently shown. The TBX has a ground and a hot connection as normal. Wow...that's a lot of information, thank you! So what you're saying is to use the 500k volume pot, the 250k fader pot, and switch the position of the tone and fader knobs? As well as removing the 47nF cap? I'm a little confused; in the original schematic, the tone is all the way on the right, correct?
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Post by JohnH on May 21, 2015 3:46:31 GMT -5
The fade knob is the one on the right. The tone knob is the middle. Currently, the tone pot has the phase switch mounted on the back (ie its a push pull pot). You cant have the tone pot as a push pull, if you want to want it to be a TBX. So the phase switch has to change to be part of the fade pot.
On a pp pot, the switch part and the pot have no inbuilt electrical connection. So you just imagine the phase switch mounted on the fade pot, but no wiring changes, same wiring diagram.
Now you can replace the middle pot with TBX.
If its not clear, then i guess it will need a new diagram. It would take me about a week to get to that though.
And wekcome to GN2!
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ejsim
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Post by ejsim on May 21, 2015 12:05:48 GMT -5
The fade knob is the one on the right. The tone knob is the middle. Currently, the tone pot has the phase switch mounted on the back (ie its a push pull pot). You cant have the tone pot as a push pull, if you want to want it to be a TBX. So the phase switch has to change to be part of the fade pot. On a pp pot, the switch part and the pot have no inbuilt electrical connection. So you just imagine the phase switch mounted on the fade pot, but no wiring changes, same wiring diagram. Now you can replace the middle pot with TBX. If its not clear, then i guess it will need a new diagram. It would take me about a week to get to that though. And wekcome to GN2! Okay, now that I know which pot is which, it makes much more sense. Did the 47nF cap do something to make it brighter? That would make sense if I don't need it with the TBX. I don't need you to go through the trouble of making a new diagram! I pretty much understand it now. I may come back with a question or two when I actually build it (still waiting for parts). Cheers!
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Post by JohnH on May 21, 2015 15:13:20 GMT -5
The fade knob is the one on the right. The tone knob is the middle. Currently, the tone pot has the phase switch mounted on the back (ie its a push pull pot). You cant have the tone pot as a push pull, if you want to want it to be a TBX. So the phase switch has to change to be part of the fade pot. On a pp pot, the switch part and the pot have no inbuilt electrical connection. So you just imagine the phase switch mounted on the fade pot, but no wiring changes, same wiring diagram. Now you can replace the middle pot with TBX. If its not clear, then i guess it will need a new diagram. It would take me about a week to get to that though. And wekcome to GN2! Okay, now that I know which pot is which, it makes much more sense. Did the 47nF cap do something to make it brighter? That would make sense if I don't need it with the TBX. I don't need you to go through the trouble of making a new diagram! I pretty much understand it now. I may come back with a question or two when I actually build it (still waiting for parts). Cheers! OK that's all fine. The 47nF does make it brighter, in series mode only. If you look at it as drawn, and just remove the 47nF, you should be able to see what would then be a conventional tone circuit from ground, to pot, to 22nf cap to volume hot outer lug. That will sub nicely for the TBX. What the 47nF does is, as you approach 10 on the pot, it starts to bypass one coil when in series mode. This lets the single coil highs get through from the other coil making it brighter, but keeping bass from both coils. In parallel mode it does nothing. But, not having this feature is not a big loss since the fade knob does something a bit similar but not via a cap. If you get this all together with your TBX and Lace pickups, I think it will be great.
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ejsim
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Post by ejsim on Jun 7, 2015 11:02:55 GMT -5
So I just finished building the circuit. I decided to ditch the TBX since the tone control on the original SP is more appealing to me after all. Unfortunately, my soldering skills are quite terrible and I have little confidence in the functionality of what I've done. Is there any way to test the circuit before installing it into the guitar to make sure it does what it's supposed to? I'd hate to put it in and string it up and it not work.
Thanks!
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Post by JohnH on Jun 7, 2015 15:40:00 GMT -5
Good idea to test it as much as you can, especially for a Strat where you cant tackle wiring issues without removing the pickguard. With a couple of alligator clips or similar, you can attach the hot and ground output wires to a guitar lead plugged into an amp. Now if you tap each pickup pole with a screwdriver tip, you should hear a thump when that pickup is active. You can also test the volume and tone controls this way. this doesn't tell you if series/parallel or phase is correct, but it is a start. Beyond that, you need a multimeter set to resistance, probably a 20k Ohms range. Connect that instead of the guitar lead/amp, and you can now measure each combination, checking that single, series and parallel settings are right. Eg, say your singles were all 6k, measured this way, a single pickup will read a little below this due to the volume pot in circuit, say about 5.9k. The parallel settings will be just under 3k and the series settings just under 12k. Using the fade control in series mode, you should see the resistance drop from a series to a single. Sweep the volume pot from max to min. It should start with a reading as above from the pickups selected, rise to a maximum at about 7 on the knob, then fall to zero at minimum. The max reading will be around 65 to 70k if you have the 500k pot with treble bleed as in the diagram, or 120 to 125k if without the treble bleed depending on your pot value. Those tests confirm most things apart from phase. You can check that too using this method: The Screwdriver pull-off testAll these tests take only a few minutes, and the meter to do them costs only a few dollars (eg, a cheap yellow digital one is fine). So I do them all as a matter of course on new builds. You can alos run them on a completed guitar without opening anything up.
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ejsim
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Post by ejsim on Jun 13, 2015 15:07:20 GMT -5
I finally got around to finishing the wiring for the guitar. I just tested it, and it's...pretty wrong.
First of all, the volume pot works backwards (no sound on 10, full on 1).
Also, the pickup selection is off. It's currently B, B, B, M, N (from 1 to 5).
Any ideas on why this might be? I can't really test the series/parallel or phase yet, since the pickups are wrong.
Thank you so much for all you've done to help on this project!
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ejsim
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Post by ejsim on Jun 13, 2015 15:10:50 GMT -5
I finally got around to finishing the wiring for the guitar. I just tested it, and it's...pretty wrong. First of all, the volume pot works backwards (no sound on 10, full on 1). Also, the pickup selection is off. It's currently B, B, B, M, N (from 1 to 5). Any ideas on why this might be? I can't really test the series/parallel or phase yet, since the pickups are wrong. Thank you so much for all you've done to help on this project! I just realized I forgot to ground the bottom right pole. Let's hope that changes something!
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ejsim
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Post by ejsim on Jun 13, 2015 15:32:44 GMT -5
I finally got around to finishing the wiring for the guitar. I just tested it, and it's...pretty wrong. First of all, the volume pot works backwards (no sound on 10, full on 1). Also, the pickup selection is off. It's currently B, B, B, M, N (from 1 to 5). Any ideas on why this might be? I can't really test the series/parallel or phase yet, since the pickups are wrong. Thank you so much for all you've done to help on this project! I just realized I forgot to ground the bottom right pole. Let's hope that changes something! Well that fixed the pickup problem--everything is now as it should be. The series/parallel toggle and the fader knob are both working perfectly. The volume knob is still backwards. I tried switching the hot and ground leads to the jack, but that didn't seem to do anything.
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Post by JohnH on Jun 13, 2015 18:52:53 GMT -5
Congrats on getting it almost going. The pots are drawn as if looking from the back, shaft on the other side. If all is well except volume is working backwards, swap all connections from left pot lug to right pot lug and vice-versa. Keep centre lug and switch lugs unchanged.
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ejsim
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Post by ejsim on Jun 14, 2015 19:39:51 GMT -5
Congrats on getting it almost going. The pots are drawn as if looking from the back, shaft on the other side. If all is well except volume is working backwards, swap all connections from left pot lug to right pot lug and vice-versa. Keep centre lug and switch lugs unchanged. Yes, I realized I soldered the ground jack connection to the lug on the left instead of the right. I fixed it, and the guitar plays wonderfully. I'll try to upload a picture. Thanks again! I couldn't have done this without your help.
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ejsim
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Post by ejsim on Jul 26, 2015 16:03:04 GMT -5
I've been playing my new guitar for over a month now and...I've barely touched my other electrics! It plays great, and the wiring is incredible for my wants and needs. So versatile.
I only have one issue, and that is that the guitar is really dark. I used a 500k pot for the tone, and I've increased the treble on my amp. But still, do you know if there's a way to make it a little brighter?
Thank you!
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Post by JohnH on Jul 26, 2015 16:20:33 GMT -5
If you have 500k pots for volume and tone, then theres not much else to do with the wiring. Series sounds tend yo be darker, but the singles and parallel sounds should be as bright as any (at least as bright as the same pickups in a standard strat with 250k pots), but depending on your pickups. What are you using? Also, the guitar cord is a major factor. If you are using 20', try a 10' one.
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