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Post by reTrEaD on Feb 14, 2018 11:39:12 GMT -5
I'm rather curious how the Gibson Sidewinders might look under the microscope, so to speak. Either the classic 'mudbucker' found in neck position of the EB series basses or the later six-string version found in their Futura guitars. I'd love to. I'm a couple weeks out from doing another pickup analysis, aside from Jaguar pickup specs I haven't posted yet. If a pickup is under $50 new or used, I don't mind ordering it just to look at it, but if it's more than that I'd probably not want to pay out of pocket. I'm kind of curious about Zexcoil pickups also, but I don't want to spend the cash if I'm not also planning to install them in a guitar. Alright then, I'll use the bottom of this post to maintain a list of suggestions. Other members should note these are just suggestions and no promise is made or implied that any of them will be tested and evaluated.
1 - Any sidewinder style pickup such as those used in the Gibson EB series basses or the Cycfi ER pickups. However both are over $50 per, new, so it's unlikely these will be tested unless someone has some they're willing to send in for testing.
2 - Dimarzio Fast Track 1, Chopper Fast Track 2.
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Post by antigua on Feb 14, 2018 14:56:22 GMT -5
I'm rather curious how the Gibson Sidewinders might look under the microscope, so to speak. Either the classic 'mudbucker' found in neck position of the EB series basses or the later six-string version found in their Futura guitars. I'd love to. I'm a couple weeks out from doing another pickup analysis, aside from Jaguar pickup specs I haven't posted yet. If a pickup is under $50 new or used, I don't mind ordering it just to look at it, but if it's more than that I'd probably not want to pay out of pocket. I'm kind of curious about Zexcoil pickups also, but I don't want to spend the cash if I'm not also planning to install them in a guitar. I haven't see Stratotarts on here in a couple weeks, but he might be willing to analyze a pickup also, and he gathers the same data I would.
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Post by reTrEaD on Feb 14, 2018 15:36:01 GMT -5
The reason I asked about the Sidewinder style pickup is because of the highly unusual construction. I reckon new Gibson pickups would be quite pricey. If you happen to run across used, they might be worth an analysis. Or perhaps Donlis has something with that kind of construction? idk. I haven't see Stratotarts on here in a couple weeks, but he might be willing to analyze a pickup also, and he gathers the same data I would. stratotarts is rather infrequent in his visits but he makes some quality contributions. ms is a good read, as well. When you, JohnH , Charlie Honkmeister , and those two start throwing ideas about, it makes my head spin. But in a good way. I wonder if stratotarts has some analyses of other pickups already on file which he might add to the mix here? I'm tempted to PM him and ask him directly but that might be a bit forward on my part. Maybe he'll see this and weigh in.
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yanyan
Meter Reader 1st Class
Posts: 52
Likes: 2
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Post by yanyan on Aug 2, 2018 11:19:22 GMT -5
Same here. I'd really like to know more about the pickups i've been using for 22 years now. Dimarzio Fast Track 1, Chopper, and Fast Track 2.
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pj
Apprentice Shielder
Posts: 48
Likes: 5
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Post by pj on Aug 2, 2018 15:30:54 GMT -5
The old single blade single coil sized Lawrence L220/250 pickups are a sidewinder design. I think it was Bill that brought that into the Gibson fold with the latter large eb3 pickup and the bicentenary firebirds.
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Post by stratotarts on Aug 2, 2018 21:02:10 GMT -5
It is a simple matter of outlay for me. If I buy pickups for my own guitars, it's covered. My days of ordering pickups just to test them are over. I did some of that for a while to support a kind of campaign to get people to see how good some of the new Chinese stuff is. Antigua kind of polished that up with the Donlis analyses. I am curious enough to be willing to spend the time testing just about any pickup, but I definitely don't have funds to purchase any. Hypothetically, as I have never had any direct requests, someone could send me pickups in the mail and I could test and return them. That is quite easy in North America, anyway... I'm in Canada. Another way with some margin of loss would be to purchase, test and resell. If a person could demonstrate a level of integrity and skill, I would even be willing to loan out an integrator for a while so they could do the tests if the pickups they had were interesting or numerous enough. On the condition that all the results be published in the public domain.
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pj
Apprentice Shielder
Posts: 48
Likes: 5
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Post by pj on Aug 3, 2018 3:59:14 GMT -5
I need to get my act together and buy a USB scope. I have been meaning to since my old bench one died, and although my use is limited these days it would spur me on to do some analysis. I've got alot of redundant pickups sat round like the earlier mentioned Lawrence's, L500, Gibson P90s, Lace sensors and more. They need clearing out and I could probably let them go once I'd revealed their dna.
What's involved in building the integrator or is it a purchase from Ken?
I'm in North Wales UK so it makes trafficing pickups somewhat awkward I suppose lol
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Post by stratotarts on Aug 3, 2018 8:48:10 GMT -5
I need to get my act together and buy a USB scope. I have been meaning to since my old bench one died, and although my use is limited these days it would spur me on to do some analysis. I've got alot of redundant pickups sat round like the earlier mentioned Lawrence's, L500, Gibson P90s, Lace sensors and more. They need clearing out and I could probably let them go once I'd revealed their dna. What's involved in building the integrator or is it a purchase from Ken? I'm in North Wales UK so it makes trafficing pickups somewhat awkward I suppose lol The more the merrier, I say.
I also am due for a USB scope, I plan to order one soon. The PC audio interface does work for me, though. This PDF documents the integrator: You can purchase an assembled and tested one from me or build it. I have PCB's left at 2/US$5. You need some electronics skill to build it, but it is a medium complexity project (comparable to a stompbox but you should have neat wiring). You need components, unless you arrange to get them from me. Also there is a plan in the works to update the board and put the entire project including PCB files on Github, so you can make your own boards if you like. I have found that the shipping costs for the PCBs are trivial even for international.
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Post by antigua on Aug 11, 2018 15:45:30 GMT -5
The integrator is sort of a high hurdle for some hobbyists, it's a specialized piece of equipment, so if someone wants to just get the integrator and follow this rather simple procedure guitarnuts2.proboards.com/thread/7775/pickups-resonant-peak-usb-oscilliscope%C2%A0 , which requires little more than two resistors and one or two capacitors, and what comes with the oscilloscope, to create a "raw" impedance plot, it still reveals the resonant peak of the pickup, and possibly the inductance and self capacitance (though it's much easier to acquire the inductance with an LCR meter, such as the DE-5000). The primary benefit of the integrator has been to reveal the Q factor of the pickup, which is also valuable and necessary to do metallurgical analysis, but the fact of the matter is that many/most pickups on the market have identical layouts, and use steel or AlNiCo grades that perform rather homogeneously. We can make certain assumptions about the Q factor, but we can't make assumptions about the inductance or the capacitance, because those values more more directly a result of the coil itself, for which there exists a broad range of possibility, and so being able to measure and share that info is of high value to anyone looking for a pickup with specific values, and who takes to time to understand how those values relate to the heard sound.
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dirocyn
Rookie Solder Flinger
Posts: 4
Likes: 1
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Post by dirocyn on Nov 3, 2018 20:05:38 GMT -5
I want to suggest the entire line of GFS pickups. Most especially their cheapest strat pickups, the Strat Vintage Alnico Stagger Pickups. They currently cost $16.94 each. Mostly I'd like to see how these compare with the (much) more expensive pickups on the market. Are these even in the same ballpark as any of the Fender "vintage" pickups?
I'd also like to suggest Squier Affinity ceramic pickups. I have a set (out of a 2001 Chinese HSS Affinity Strat) I'd be happy to mail to someone who can test them, just message me a mailing address and I'll send them--no need to ever send them back, I just want to see the analysis. Judging by ear, I'm guessing that these pickups peak at a very high frequency. I think it would be very useful to see how these pickups compare. I suspect these pickups are among the most frequently replaced pickups; knowing how another pickup compares with the one you're replacing would be really nice.
I will also have a Squier SE SSS set I'd like tested, I think it's a 2012 guitar (based on a "12" under the neck plate and on the neck heel). But I won't be ready to put those in the mail for maybe a couple of weeks.
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Post by stratotarts on Nov 5, 2018 10:45:28 GMT -5
The integrator is sort of a high hurdle for some hobbyists, it's a specialized piece of equipment, so if someone wants to just get the integrator and follow this rather simple procedure guitarnuts2.proboards.com/thread/7775/pickups-resonant-peak-usb-oscilliscope%C2%A0 , which requires little more than two resistors and one or two capacitors, and what comes with the oscilloscope, to create a "raw" impedance plot, it still reveals the resonant peak of the pickup, and possibly the inductance and self capacitance (though it's much easier to acquire the inductance with an LCR meter, such as the DE-5000). The primary benefit of the integrator has been to reveal the Q factor of the pickup, which is also valuable and necessary to do metallurgical analysis, but the fact of the matter is that many/most pickups on the market have identical layouts, and use steel or AlNiCo grades that perform rather homogeneously. We can make certain assumptions about the Q factor, but we can't make assumptions about the inductance or the capacitance, because those values more more directly a result of the coil itself, for which there exists a broad range of possibility, and so being able to measure and share that info is of high value to anyone looking for a pickup with specific values, and who takes to time to understand how those values relate to the heard sound. It offers a very good cost/benefit ratio when the user is capable of building it themselves, and when used with the PC sound interface instead of a software oscilloscope. It's a "one step" process to producing plots of arbitrary pickups (i.e. connect the test clips and run, save results...). I found that when I purchased a Velleman scope, the probes were not included. Since the front end of the integrator duplicates a 10x probe circuit, the complete test hardware cost can be in the US$20-30 range with careful parts sourcing, compared with over $100 for the scope. Some people might find that helpful. The processing of the integration in software has been proven, but hasn't been worked out as part of a complete system yet as far as I know. A lot of experimenters (including myself) are looking towards pure impedance measurements, which can be processed to yield simulations of a loaded plot and so on. But nobody has put it all in a comprehensive package yet. The integrator is "here now".
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yanyan
Meter Reader 1st Class
Posts: 52
Likes: 2
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Post by yanyan on Dec 1, 2019 4:39:03 GMT -5
I would like to humbly make a new suggestion for pickup analysis: the Dimarzio HS-3. Yngwie is a large part of my personal guitar pantheon, and for me his tones right up to and including "Facing the Animal" are simply unbelievable. I'd be interested to know everything about this pickup.
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Post by antigua on Dec 1, 2019 4:58:45 GMT -5
I would like to humbly make a new suggestion for pickup analysis: the Dimarzio HS-3. Yngwie is a large part of my personal guitar pantheon, and for me his tones right up to and including "Facing the Animal" are simply unbelievable. I'd be interested to know everything about this pickup. I've heard bad things about that particular stacked humbucker, that it has the unfortunate qualities of being both low output and dark. But a stacked set I have had my eye on are the DiMarzio areas, simply because so many people have given them rave reviews. I think that, it's coming along in 1980, is one of the earliest mass produced stacked humbuckers for Strats, and that through trial and error they've managed to configure the stack to sound more "single coil".
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yanyan
Meter Reader 1st Class
Posts: 52
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Post by yanyan on Dec 6, 2019 3:42:19 GMT -5
I've heard bad things about that particular stacked humbucker, that it has the unfortunate qualities of being both low output and dark. But a stacked set I have had my eye on are the DiMarzio areas, simply because so many people have given them rave reviews. I think that, it's coming along in 1980, is one of the earliest mass produced stacked humbuckers for Strats, and that through trial and error they've managed to configure the stack to sound more "single coil". That is unfortunate, because all the recordings i've heard of that pickup (from Yngwie and Joe Stump) sound phenomenal. Undoubtedly the rest of the signal chain would have a more profound effect on the tonal end result, not to mention the player's hands. Still i'm hoping you could find spare time to do an analysis on the HS-3 after you do the Areas. That way we could also see the evolution of the stacked single concept.
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