Little HH 15

[aquino]

Hi folks!

This is an idea I've been thinking about for a while. The concept is to take two coils in series, and wire the series link to each pole of the main pickup selector, as a North / Series / South selector. Then, the coil pairs can be globally arranged in series, parallel, or you can select just one of them. The nutty aspect comes from the fact that each pole of the main selector has a north coil from one pickup and a south coil from the other.

This allows for the Series/Split/Parallel switch to work universally, both intra-pickup and inter-pickup. It also allows for an almost-universal phase switch: it is active on series and parallel modes, regardless of the main selector.

The phase switch also works a little different from usual: it not only reverses phase, but also changes which coil is selected. This is made in order to optimize hum-cancelling, and due to the belief that two humbucker coils out of phase with each other will cancel too much frequencies because of their proximity.

PROS:

- No superswitch needed

- You could use a big On-Off-On DPDT toggle switch the same size as a Gibson one for the main selector on your LP or SG or 335 (not sure the size is exactly the same...)

- Universal Series/Split/Parallel: works on every position of the main switch

- Almost universal phase switch: works on Series and Parallel modes, regardless of main switch

- All options with more than 1 coil cancel hum - including all the OoP options

CONS:

- You lose the conventional HH wiring (middle position with series humbuckers is all coils in series)

- The standard middle position (both series humbuckers in global parallel) doen't exist. The middle position in parallel mode is (Bn>Ns)+(Bs>Nn). It should do the job OK.

- It's harder to have separate tone controls for each pickup. I believe you'd need at least one extra pole (possibly two) on the main switch to do the trick.

If there's any problems on the schematic, or improvement suggestions, or whatever, I'd be glad to hear!

History:

A while ago I downloaded this wiring idea, but it did not have any credits (if anyone knows the author, let me know).

I wanted to give it more modes, and eventually separated the poles of the main switch, changed the order of the coils, and added the other switches. Later I found the "Big Fat Ten" in this forum, which is based in a similar concept. Because this one doesn't use a superswitch, I named it "Little".

Hope you guys like it!

Cheers!

[newey]

This is interesting, and I'd be interested to know how the center position sounds in comparison to a regular HH setup. Has this been built yet, to your knowledge?

Aquino, nice work that you provided a schematic. I expect that you will soon get a request to convert it to a wiring diagram. Few members here "speak schematic"!

[aquino]

Hi Newey! Thanks for your interest in this schematic!

This is interesting, and I'd be interested to know how the center position sounds in comparison to a regular HH setup. Has this been built yet, to your knowledge?

This one is currently untested. Unfortunatelly, I don't have access to a HH guitar right now to mess around and test it.

I'm (very slowly) building a HH film can guitar, and I'll try some of these unusual pickup combinations with alligator clips, but it should take a month or two. I expect this instrument to sound different from a regular guitar, but I plan to record the standard wiring sounds as well, to hear how big the difference is.

Meanwhile, here are some variations on the same idea:

1. Separating the poles of SW2 into two independent switches will give you the possibility of using push-pull pots, and also of selecting only the SW1_B side. The disadvantage is that the phase switch inverts the function of SW1_B. Some would probably prefer a conventional phase switch, or eliminating it altogether. Flip one of the pickups around and you can select between outer coils and inner coils.

2. The "Little HH 20". Since this wiring is based on series pairs of coils, it's easy to put a capacitor in parallel with one of them and get 5 more combinations.

Also: I'd be glad to make a wiring diagram if requested, I'm just not very good ad doing so... I'll search the forum on this.

Cheers!

[Yogi B]

Nov 4, 2018 14:06:02 GMT -5 aquino said:

A while ago I downloaded this wiring idea, but it did not have any credits (if anyone knows the author, let me know).

Well here's what I found:

SPOILER: Click to show

Reverse image searching didn't directly help, but resulted in finding this version of the image:

However they were all from infernal image aggregation sites, so still no link to back to the original source. I did, however, recognise the 3-way switch design from old (circa 2001) Seymour Duncan wiring diagrams, so I took a punt and guessed various things to search for on the SD forum.

Ultimately that lead me to the conclusion that this is ArtieToo's "Virtual 3rd Humbucker" wiring.

Firstly I found this post:

-Can the bridge screw coil and neck stud coil be used in this mod

Sure. Look at the diagram that Erik linked to in his first post. Note the top-left little diagram shows the bridge pup on top. Just place the neck on top instead. Remember, that diagram shows electrical connections only. You obviously place the pups physically where they belong.

Although the referenced image is missing, it does correlate to the alternate version included above.


Further proof comes from another post which exactly details the 5-way version:

This gives you the normal humbucker at the neck or bridge switch positions, but in the middle position, you get the screw coil of the neck in series with the stud coil of the bridge for a "virtual 3rd humbucker." I love it.

...

Btw: A 5-way will work. I just have to think for a sec to remember what the two extra positions give you.

Edit: I remember now: The #2 and #4 notch positions will give you the neck split to the screw coil, and the bridge split to the stud coil, respectively. Should be a nice option.

[Jaga]

That's pretty interesting. I wonder if anyone saved the schematic posted by aquino? Was able to find only small unreadable images by Google.

[reTrEaD]

Mar 18, 2019 19:40:56 GMT -5 Jaga said:

That's pretty interesting. I wonder if anyone saved the schematic posted by aquino? Was able to find only small unreadable images by Google.

It looks like imgbb.com (the image host) is down.
isitdownorjust.me/imgbb-com/

If that condition is temporary, the image will be available again. If not, we'll have a significant problem as many images have been posted on GN2 using that host.

[Jaga]

Now image host seems to be working. Please correct me if I'm wrong, but does this schematic have hanging coil issue?

To understand better how this should work, I redrew the schematic from the 1st post and tried to follow every combination (eliminating vol+tone pots and connecting all the grounds). Imagining that SW1 (main selector) is in center off position (all terminals of SW1A and SW1B not connected), I understood "All Series" and (Bn>Ns)>-(Nn>Bs) combinations. When I tried to play with SW1, I messed up. I switched SW1 to a different position and tried to follow signal path (it is RED on the image below). From what I see, in this case NECK pickup supposed to be enabled in series. But I can notice that BRIDGE_S coil hangs from hot, and I completetely don't understand what is going on with BRIDGE_N.

Probably, I have confused something while redrawing the schematics. Also, I'm not sure if I've indicated coils polarity properly. Would be grateful for any comments on that.

SPOILER: Click to show

[Jaga]

Sorry for asking silly question, but really would like to understand does this schematic has "hanging coils" issue Would be grateful for any comments on that

[Jaga]

Just curious if someone has any thoughts on the topic?

[sumgai]

jaga,



Sorry, but for some reason, I'm just now seeing your messages. Seems like the "NEW" icon was "unlit" for me... or sumpin', I dunno.


Anyway, the answer to your question is "Yes", there will be a hanging hot in any position that doesn't use the pickup that is directly connected to the output (or the controls inbetween the switch and the output). Designing to eliminate that can take one of two forms (either double-switch it, giving a True Bypass treatment; or simply shunt around the pup in question), but neither of them obeys the K.I.S.S principle. The decision is up to the modder, of course, but most people find that any noise attributed to this condition is too low a volume to bother with.  It takes a pretty noisy environment (electrical-wise) to elevate this kind of problem into something of a minor nuisance.

HTH



sumgai

[Jaga]

Jun 22, 2019 23:44:27 GMT -5 sumgai said:

Anyway, the answer to your question is "Yes", there will be a hanging hot in any position that doesn't use the pickup that is directly connected to the output (or the controls inbetween the switch and the output). Designing to eliminate that can take one of two forms (either double-switch it, giving a True Bypass treatment; or simply shunt around the pup in question), but neither of them obeys the K.I.S.S principle. The decision is up to the modder, of course, but most people find that any noise attributed to this condition is too low a volume to bother with.  It takes a pretty noisy environment (electrical-wise) to elevate this kind of problem into something of a minor nuisance.

HTH



sumgai

sumgai, thanks for the reply!

From what I know there are different opinions regarding hanging coils There were some discussion related to this in that thread: guitarnuts2.proboards.com/thread/8505/pickups-coils-series-parallel-switching

Currently I'm playing an SS bass and its wiring has hanging coil issue, and I don't like how some switch combinations sound. Once I will try "binary switch" wiring without that hanging coil stuff, I will tell about my impressions.

Basically, "Little HH 15" wiring won't fit to my needs because I'm looking for some versatile wiring for HSS. "Little HH 15" won't allow me to select singles.

[aquino]

Hello Jaga,

Thanks for your interest in this idea. I has been quite a while since I last logged in, I hope the following comments are still helpful. It is still unbuilt and untested...

I'm not sure if I've indicated coils polarity properly. Would be grateful for any comments on that.

Coil polarity is ok!

I redrew the schematic from the 1st post and tried to follow every combination (eliminating vol+tone pots and connecting all the grounds). Imagining that SW1 (main selector) is in center off position (all terminals of SW1A and SW1B not connected), I understood "All Series" and (Bn>Ns)>-(Nn>Bs) combinations. When I tried to play with SW1, I messed up. I switched SW1 to a different position and tried to follow signal path (it is RED on the image below). From what I see, in this case NECK pickup supposed to be enabled in series. But I can notice that BRIDGE_S coil hangs from hot, and I completetely don't understand what is going on with BRIDGE_N.

I made some simpler diagrams I believe will help you, eliminating series/parallel switch, phase switch and vol/tone controls:

When SW2 is in series position, this is what you get. If the main selector is in the middle position, all coils are in series. If it is on position 1, both neck coils are bypassed, and you get bridge pickup in series. If it is on position 3, both bridge coils are bypassed, and you get neck pickup in series.

SW2 in parallel position looks like this. Again, SW1 bypasses both neck or both bridge coils, and you get bridge pickup in parallel, neck pickup in parallel, or that weird middle position: (Bn>Ns)+(Bs>Nn).

As far as I know, the coil bypassing made by SW1 does not generate hanging from hot issues, as both ends are shortened. Hanging from hot would only occur if one end of a coil is in the signal chain and the other is disconnected. Also, SW2 is wired in a way so that, in split position, Bs and Nn hang from ground, which AFAIK would be OK. I would be glad to read any comments on that by the technical guys.

Finally, I have drawn a wiring diagram on MS Paint. It is not fancy, but I have checked and I believe it is correct. Any comments on that would also be great. Pickup wire color code: DiMarzio. Hope it's useful!