Post by UnklMickey on Oct 3, 2006 18:58:26 GMT -5
DISCLAIMER: THIS POST IS LONG!
IF YOU TIRE EASILY, QUIT NOW.
the 4th pole:
let's review what we know about the sounds we have available,
and their usefulness in a single HB design.
1 -- Series - In-Phase: strong and hum-canceling. +
2 -- Parallel - In-Phase: lighter, but still hum-canceling. +
3 -- Single Coil (farthest from bridge): moderate, less complex than either In-Phase HB, not hum-canceling. +
4 -- Single Coil (closest to bridge): a little more brittle than the other SC, but very similar in sound, not hum-canceling. ?
5 -- Series Out-of-Phase: since the sound of the 2 coils is similar, this will be quite thin and weak. series helps, but not much. considerably more hum than a SC! ?
6 -- Parallel Out-of-Phase: even weaker and thinner than SOoP. a little more hum than a SC! -
so 1 ~ 3 are definitely in.
4 isn't a bad choice, but might not sound different enough from 3 to make that much difference.
5 and 6 will sound different from the others, but will sound very weak, because the coils are so close to each other.
and the hum in 5 and 6 will be greater, along with a weak signal. -- hmmmm? sounds worse and worse all the time.
at this point, 4 is actually sounding like a more reasonable choice.
OR using a 3-way (without a kill position) or a 4-way.
we could even use a DPDT ON-ON-ON mini-toggle, for 1~3. that might even work without additional routing!
although the mini-toggle is a real possibility, let's imagine some other ways to get a different sound (different from 1,2,or 3) that will be desirable.
will a capacitor be a friend to us here?
Chris mentioned using a capacitor in series with ONE of the coils, in a POoP configuration on a Tele.
this reduces the low-frequency subtraction that occurs, and restricts this to the higher frequencies.
but since we have don't have all that much difference in the high-frequency content between these coils,
AND the temporal (phase) relationship is so similar, because they are so close together, this idea won't be as productive here.
still, let's continue to investigate what kinds of things we might be able to do, by inserting a cap via a 4th pole.
and if that 4th pole is even needed, to insert the cap.
i've arranged another skeleton to see what would be possible, if a cap was connected to coil -2 +, on one end, and to the 4th pole on the other.
we would be able to connect to nearly any point to the circuit if coil -2 was involved.
if we need to connect in series or parallel, with coil-1 being used as a single, we'll need a different approach.
so good, thus far. lots of options and possibilities.
now let's find out, which ones are better than others.
and, if any of them are actually good.
C-01 and C-02 are the POoP configurations, with the cap in series with one of the coils.
hum and low frequencies should be similar to a SC, subtractive effects on the treble only.
a reasonable candidate. +
C-04 and C-04 -- SOoP with a cap in parallel with one of the coils.
lots of hum, weak lows. single coil treble.
not good. -
C-05 and C-06 -- single coil with weak bass and less hum.
mediocre sound, very different from anything else we've discussed.
maybe, but i kinda doubt it. -
C-07 and C-08 -- single coil with a cap in parallel.
SC with reduced treble. we can do the same thing with the tone control.
forget this one! -
let's move on.
C-09 and C-10 -- Parallel with a cap in series with one coil.
SC hum and lows, with parallel HB treble.
interesting.... another possibility. +
C-11 and C-12 normal series HB with a cap in parallel with one coil.
SC -ish treble, stronger lows, and hum-canceling. +++
i think we've found our winner!
now let's see what needs to happen to get some of these sounds.
in the normal series HB (position1), we can only put a cap in parallel with coil-1. with the cap connected this way, and without the 4th pole.
but since coil - 1 will be a little more brittle, that's the one we want to affect anyway
some of the others are shown, but i'm ready to move on to implementing the 3 original, the partially bypassed HB and a tamed down POoP.
this would work to some extent with a single cap, but a big compromise would have to be made.
i'd like to see only about the first 2 octaves in coil -1 for the bypassed HB. probably about a 100nF cap.
i think about 2.5k would be a reasonable place for coil-2 in POoP. maybe 10nF?
so that mean 2 caps:
the cap values would need tweaking (season to taste).
but i think we have a recipe.
you'll notice i put the least important choice (IMHO) in position 4.
if i wired one up for myself, this is probably the way i'd arrange it.
if you want at kill switch in position 5, definitely move the bypassed HB to position 4.
verbose is.
unk
IF YOU TIRE EASILY, QUIT NOW.
the 4th pole:
let's review what we know about the sounds we have available,
and their usefulness in a single HB design.
1 -- Series - In-Phase: strong and hum-canceling. +
2 -- Parallel - In-Phase: lighter, but still hum-canceling. +
3 -- Single Coil (farthest from bridge): moderate, less complex than either In-Phase HB, not hum-canceling. +
4 -- Single Coil (closest to bridge): a little more brittle than the other SC, but very similar in sound, not hum-canceling. ?
5 -- Series Out-of-Phase: since the sound of the 2 coils is similar, this will be quite thin and weak. series helps, but not much. considerably more hum than a SC! ?
6 -- Parallel Out-of-Phase: even weaker and thinner than SOoP. a little more hum than a SC! -
so 1 ~ 3 are definitely in.
4 isn't a bad choice, but might not sound different enough from 3 to make that much difference.
5 and 6 will sound different from the others, but will sound very weak, because the coils are so close to each other.
and the hum in 5 and 6 will be greater, along with a weak signal. -- hmmmm? sounds worse and worse all the time.
at this point, 4 is actually sounding like a more reasonable choice.
OR using a 3-way (without a kill position) or a 4-way.
we could even use a DPDT ON-ON-ON mini-toggle, for 1~3. that might even work without additional routing!
although the mini-toggle is a real possibility, let's imagine some other ways to get a different sound (different from 1,2,or 3) that will be desirable.
will a capacitor be a friend to us here?
Chris mentioned using a capacitor in series with ONE of the coils, in a POoP configuration on a Tele.
this reduces the low-frequency subtraction that occurs, and restricts this to the higher frequencies.
but since we have don't have all that much difference in the high-frequency content between these coils,
AND the temporal (phase) relationship is so similar, because they are so close together, this idea won't be as productive here.
still, let's continue to investigate what kinds of things we might be able to do, by inserting a cap via a 4th pole.
and if that 4th pole is even needed, to insert the cap.
i've arranged another skeleton to see what would be possible, if a cap was connected to coil -2 +, on one end, and to the 4th pole on the other.
we would be able to connect to nearly any point to the circuit if coil -2 was involved.
if we need to connect in series or parallel, with coil-1 being used as a single, we'll need a different approach.
so good, thus far. lots of options and possibilities.
now let's find out, which ones are better than others.
and, if any of them are actually good.
C-01 and C-02 are the POoP configurations, with the cap in series with one of the coils.
hum and low frequencies should be similar to a SC, subtractive effects on the treble only.
a reasonable candidate. +
C-04 and C-04 -- SOoP with a cap in parallel with one of the coils.
lots of hum, weak lows. single coil treble.
not good. -
C-05 and C-06 -- single coil with weak bass and less hum.
mediocre sound, very different from anything else we've discussed.
maybe, but i kinda doubt it. -
C-07 and C-08 -- single coil with a cap in parallel.
SC with reduced treble. we can do the same thing with the tone control.
forget this one! -
let's move on.
C-09 and C-10 -- Parallel with a cap in series with one coil.
SC hum and lows, with parallel HB treble.
interesting.... another possibility. +
C-11 and C-12 normal series HB with a cap in parallel with one coil.
SC -ish treble, stronger lows, and hum-canceling. +++
i think we've found our winner!
now let's see what needs to happen to get some of these sounds.
in the normal series HB (position1), we can only put a cap in parallel with coil-1. with the cap connected this way, and without the 4th pole.
but since coil - 1 will be a little more brittle, that's the one we want to affect anyway
some of the others are shown, but i'm ready to move on to implementing the 3 original, the partially bypassed HB and a tamed down POoP.
this would work to some extent with a single cap, but a big compromise would have to be made.
i'd like to see only about the first 2 octaves in coil -1 for the bypassed HB. probably about a 100nF cap.
i think about 2.5k would be a reasonable place for coil-2 in POoP. maybe 10nF?
so that mean 2 caps:
the cap values would need tweaking (season to taste).
but i think we have a recipe.
you'll notice i put the least important choice (IMHO) in position 4.
if i wired one up for myself, this is probably the way i'd arrange it.
if you want at kill switch in position 5, definitely move the bypassed HB to position 4.
verbose is.
unk