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Post by thedoc735 on Sept 3, 2020 15:27:54 GMT -5
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Post by sumgai on Sept 3, 2020 22:55:17 GMT -5
'doc,
What the others are on about is the fact that lead is no longer acceptable for solder usage. Sadly, that has degraded solder (by making it more expensive to build, 'cause lead was muy cheap) in my opinion, but then again, I bought a life-time's supply years ago, and the wife will probably have to call in the men in Haz-Mat suits to cart it all away when I'm gone. Nonetheless, the "new" solder is no less prone to WTF moments like yours, so while I may have implicated the wrong material (chemical), the process is the same - if it's not just right, then the GeFooey flag will be flying at full mast.
HTH
sumgai
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Post by reTrEaD on Sept 4, 2020 8:21:02 GMT -5
What the others are on about is the fact that lead is no longer acceptable for solder usage. Not me. What I was on about: Your premise that one of lead or tin is an 'ideal insulator' is very wrong. Both are good conductors.
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Post by thedoc735 on Sept 4, 2020 8:48:25 GMT -5
What the others are on about is the fact that lead is no longer acceptable for solder usage. Not me. What I was on about: Your premise that one of lead or tin is an 'ideal insulator' is very wrong. Both are good conductors.
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Post by thedoc735 on Sept 4, 2020 8:54:24 GMT -5
sumgaiwell, 'retread' suggests that you are wrong! I like being fed good info but if you are supplying misinformation, then it is a different story! Lead, tin, etc. insulator, conductor? Disagreement among the ranks? Expert Vs. Expect? Ummm?
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Post by sumgai on Sept 4, 2020 11:40:24 GMT -5
'doc, Lead can indeed pass current - given enough power to drive that current across a lead conductor. Lead is used in high-power situations such as automotive batteries because it can conduct the necessary amount of current to get the job done, but it does exact a high toll on the number of electrons that are attempting to cross the junction point. Additionally, lead (in this case) withstands a lot of abuse, with aplomb. Temperatures that would kill a human? Check. Power levels that can drive a couple hundred pounds of metal from a standing start into motion? Check. Ability to resist deterioration when not in use? Check. Actually aids in transmutation of chemical energy to electrical energy? Oh yeah, double check! But try passing a low-level signal across a piece of lead? Hmmm, how's that working out for you there, Sparky? tl;dr: Lead has electrical properties that can be harnessed in various ways, but it's not a perfect solution for everything. If it were, we wouldn't be using gold on those plated terminals to prevent oxidation, now would we.... Or even shorter: Everything has its place and time. Try to use the right thing in the right place. Yeah, it's sometimes difficult, but at least try. HTH sumgai p.s. If you spend some time with Bingle, you'll find some wildly varying opinions on lead's electrical properties. Keep looking, and eventually you'll find that more sources agree with my synopsis above. Which is to say, stop spending so much time on the internet and start experimenting for yourself!
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Post by reTrEaD on Sept 4, 2020 14:33:41 GMT -5
'doc, Lead can indeed pass current - given enough power to drive that current across a lead conductor. Lead is used in high-power situations such as automotive batteries because it can conduct the necessary amount of current to get the job done, but it does exact a high toll on the number of electrons that are attempting to cross the junction point. Additionally, lead (in this case) withstands a lot of abuse, with aplomb. Temperatures that would kill a human? Check. Power levels that can drive a couple hundred pounds of metal from a standing start into motion? Check. Ability to resist deterioration when not in use? Check. Actually aids in transmutation of chemical energy to electrical energy? Oh yeah, double check! But try passing a low-level signal across a piece of lead? Hmmm, how's that working out for you there, Sparky? tl;dr: Lead has electrical properties that can be harnessed in various ways, but it's not a perfect solution for everything. If it were, we wouldn't be using gold on those plated terminals to prevent oxidation, now would we.... Or even shorter: Everything has its place and time. Try to use the right thing in the right place. Yeah, it's sometimes difficult, but at least try. HTH sumgai p.s. If you spend some time with Bingle, you'll find some wildly varying opinions on lead's electrical properties. Keep looking, and eventually you'll find that more sources agree with my synopsis above. Which is to say, stop spending so much time on the internet and start experimenting for yourself! To quote a phrase from pop culture: "Amazing. Every word of what you just said.. was wrong."Aside from the misdirections and misconceptions such as why lead is used in automobile batteries and the imaginary problem with passing a low level signal through lead, I'd like to point back to your earlier claim about lead being an 'ideal insulator'. If lead is capable of conducting high current, is that not the polar opposite of an 'ideal insulator'?
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Post by thedoc735 on Sept 5, 2020 7:11:58 GMT -5
sumgaiyes, I get the lead car battery thing, makes sense! And lead not so useful in very low power applications?
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Post by thedoc735 on Sept 5, 2020 7:16:28 GMT -5
sumgai "BUT!" ....what about reTrEaD's comment 'above'? i.e. everything you said is wrong? ...can you explain that to retread and me?
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Post by sumgai on Sept 5, 2020 12:14:59 GMT -5
i.e. everything you said is wrong? In words of one syllable or less, YES, I'm wrong. As I have bent my knee to ashcatlt and his voltage-divider view of the world, I now bow down to reTrEaD and his knowledge of metallurgy, physics, chemistry and electronics. From this point forward, if he contradicts anything I might say in any thread, then I am automatically wrong, and his word is sacrosanct. Good enough? No, let me add to that. I get enough argument at home, I don't need to come on the internet and find other people with whom to argue. Until recently, I never thought I'd say these words, but I'm tired of it. I'm not done here here in The NutzHouse, but I am going to carefully consider my choice of words in future responses to questions. And let me add further to that. I'm going to leave the above in place, because it was and still is in my heart. But perking in the back of my mind is the fact that I've willfully disobeyed my own long-dormant dictum. Too many years ago I said that I now (back then) realized that I was starting to sound like a tin-horn despot, and that it was time to withdraw, to let others take some of the limelight. I said I would chip in only when and where I saw that someone was about to make an error that would be either unsafe, or likely to damage his/her wallet in a significant manner. It's high time I returned to that way of thinking. Now, even more so than back then, I am highly assured that this place is in good hands, both management-wise and knowledge-wise. sumgai
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Post by thedoc735 on Sept 5, 2020 14:50:52 GMT -5
sumgai...actually your response should have been primarily directed at reTrEaD because he was the one questioning you initially, NOT me! I was just confused between what you wrote and what reTrEaD wrote, as you appeared to contradict each other and found it a bit difficult to see them both as correct simultaneously! I can offer an apology to you, but I don't think I have done anything wrong? Instead of advising me to spend less time on the internet, why don't you address reTrEaD's comments directly rather than routing them through me? (as he is the questioner)? The threads topic was resolved a short while ago anyway. Thanks to all for guidance offered!
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Post by sumgai on Sept 5, 2020 15:49:08 GMT -5
'doc, i.e. everything you said is wrong? That question mark is the very definition of a question. But I take your meaning. ... directed at reTrEaD because he was the one questioning you initially, NOT me! As a matter of perspective, that's true. But you're the one who put the question mark to the question ("Is every thing you said wrong?"), so I think I properly addressed my response. ... I don't think I have done anything wrong You certainly haven't!! Your quest and thirst for knowledge is always to be commended, never fear. .... spend less time on the internet The idea was that you should break out the meter, soldering iron and other various tools, and a bunch of components... then get your own hands good and dirty. Listening at the knee of one's elders is a good thing, but IMO, it's pretty hard to beat first-hand experience. At this point, and for most of our discussions here in The NutzHouse, we're dealing with non-dangerous signal/voltage levels. The only thing you can harm is your wallet (excepting grabbing up your soldering iron by the wrong end!). Thanks to all for guidance offered! You're welcome! But reTrEaD is still correct. HTH sumgai
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Post by thedoc735 on Sept 5, 2020 18:33:16 GMT -5
sumgaiI am sorry for posting that question mark, perhaps not appropriate in the context. However, reTrEaD did also post a question mark at the end of his post #36. I think I maybe should have stayed quiet until you had answered (his post) #36, most sorry for interjecting prematurely, no offence intended. Keep riding!
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Post by sumgai on Sept 5, 2020 18:58:14 GMT -5
'doc, However, reTrEaD did also post a question mark at the end of his post #36. Yes, and you might also note, in your wanderings around this place, that I sometimes respond, and I sometimes ignore him. Politely, to be sure, but there (usually) comes a time to stop dragging it out when nothing is to be gained by anyone from trying to get in the last word. I think I maybe should have stayed quiet until you had answered (his post) #36, Perhaps, but hindsight is such a wonderful thing, ain't it though. None taken, and apologies are not necessary, at least not to me. Give and take is always the crux of how one learns, and you certainly haven't been rude to me. If anyone else thought so, then that's on them - you and I, we're square. HTH sumgai
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Post by thedoc735 on Sept 10, 2020 3:40:25 GMT -5
I have been on a journey through alchemy, chemistry, physics and maths that convinced me to re-solder the capacitor, and it worked! "BUT!" ~ to me, just as important is the Comradery, psychological crutch & moral support in this group!
I think I would have given up without your continued help!
Many thanks to ALL.
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darrenvox
Apprentice Shielder
Posts: 34
Likes: 5
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Post by darrenvox on Sept 10, 2020 5:40:49 GMT -5
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