3 separate on off switches wiring?

[carlbrunstril]

Hello my name is Carl Emil, from Sweden

I am wiring a strat that i am building. I have bought a p90 for the bridge, lipstick pickup for the middle and humbucker for the neck. And i have three dpdt on/on switches.

I read that you guys want me to read up on tha already available information before i post a question and i am sure that i would figure it out but my brain is tired of thinking so here i am asking anyways. sorry for the inconvenience.

i want 1 master volume and 1 master tone. And i want the switches to act as on/off for each pickup. So i can have them all on or all off or whatever. how in the hell would i wire that?

I think you wire the dpdt on/on switch to act as a on/off like this:





is that correct? 

And i dont really know if i should use 500k or 250k pots...

thanks in advance guys goodbye!

[ashcatlt]

That’ll definitely do it, though you could also just put “to output” on A or “to pickup” on B and it would work exactly the same.

Turn down a 500K T pot to half its resistance (not necessarily halfway down) will sound the same as a 250K T pot, but there’s no way to get a 250K T pot to sound like a 500K.

[JohnH]

Given that as ashcatlt has pointed out, you only need one half of each switch using lugs A and C, you can use the other side for a nice refinement.

A feature of such on-off wiring is that there's an all-off position. Not used often but, it can create some nteresting staccato effects, or mute the guitar if needed on stage. But disconnecting all pickups can allow some noise to enter.

So the optional refinement is to string all the 'off' positions of the three switches in series, so that only when all three are off, the output is shunted to ground for totally noise-free muting.

If you wire the left side per Ash's suggestion, then you do another wire ground to D on 1st switch, F 1st switch to D on 2nd switch, F on 2nd switch to D on 3rd switch, and F on 3rd switch to guitar hot output.

If that's interesting but not clear, can do a diagram.

[reTrEaD]

Feb 21, 2024 20:44:06 GMT -5 carlbrunstril said:

three dpdt on/on switches.

Details matter. In addition to the good information provided by ashcatlt and JohnH , we need to consider the type of switch. Toggle switches work differently than slide switches.

Feb 21, 2024 20:44:06 GMT -5 carlbrunstril said:

Toggle switch:
When the toggle is flipped so it's pointing toward the top of the page, the BLUE lines indicate the lugs that are connected together.
When the toggle is flipped so it's pointing toward the bottom of the page, the RED lines indicate the lugs that are connected together.

Slide switch:
When you slide the actuator toward the top of the page, the RED lines indicate the lugs that are connected together.
When you slide the actuator toward the bottom of the page, the BLUE lines indicate the lugs that are connected together.

[stevewf]

I like JohnH's idea for silence when all three pickups are turned off. Will there be a pop as the third switch gets turned off? If so, ideas to mitigate it?

[sumgai]

Feb 22, 2024 7:47:23 GMT -5 JohnH said:

....

If you wire the left side per Ash's suggestion, then you do another wire ground to D on 1st switch, F 1st switch to D on 2nd switch, F on 2nd switch to D on 3rd switch, and F on 3rd switch to guitar hot output.

John, "D" on the first switch (or on any of them) is the output line - grounding that line is shunting all of the signal to ground forever. Nearly the same for grounding "F", once the pickup is switched off, the output line goes to ground, and the remaining pups are out of commission - all three pickups must be on for anything to sound out.

There is an obvious way to do of this, but I wanna let you cogitate on possible solutions first.

HTH



BTW, carlbrunstril - Hi, and to The NutzHouse!!





sumgai

[JohnH]

My suggestion as I described, is based on configuring the switches as ashcatlt suggested in the previous post. The D lugs are then free for this extra job since outputs come from the A lugs.

I wouldn't expect any significant pops from this because the guitar never goes fully open-circuit , even at the instant of switching. The volume pot is always there and never switched.

I think this will work fine with any two-pole switch with lugs laid out 2x3. It would probably affect which way is 'on' and which is 'off'. Slide switches connect the middle lugs to the outer lugs in the direction of pushing the switch. Most toggle switches, including the mini-toggles that would probably be used for this, connect the other way. ie flick the lever up and the middle lugs connect down. But either way, the diagram would be essentially the same. You have to decide whether you prefer 'up' or 'down' to = 'on'. American and British people will disagree about this, based on our different life experiences of how other switches work.

And on toggles, I had previously expected that 'flick up connects down' was always true. I think it is true of most, but I have some larger toggles built into my attenuator that work the opposite way.

[reTrEaD]

Feb 22, 2024 13:52:35 GMT -5 sumgai said:

Feb 22, 2024 7:47:23 GMT -5 JohnH said:

....

If you wire the left side per Ash's suggestion, then you do another wire ground to D on 1st switch, F 1st switch to D on 2nd switch, F on 2nd switch to D on 3rd switch, and F on 3rd switch to guitar hot output.

John, "D" on the first switch (or on any of them) is the output line - grounding that line is shunting all of the signal to ground forever. Nearly the same for grounding "F", once the pickup is switched off, the output line goes to ground, and the remaining pups are out of commission - all three pickups must be on for anything to sound out.

There is an obvious way to do of this, but I wanna let you cogitate on possible solutions first.

No.  You're forgetting the opening line of his post.

Feb 22, 2024 7:47:23 GMT -5 JohnH said:

Given that as ashcatlt has pointed out, you only need one half of each switch using lugs A and C, you can use the other side for a nice refinement.

Capiche?


EDIT: Ninja'd by John

[carlbrunstril]

Oh okay yes this sounds very good to use the rest of the lugs to cancel hum in the all off position. 

Yes JohnH i would be very grateful for a diagram of this wiring you are talking about, i have never wired a guitar before, my friend Albin always does it for me. But i want to try now.  If you bother doing a diagram i would LOVE IT. 

Okay then i will use 500k pots. I play punk music i like ear piercing bright tone. 

Thank you for the welcoming. you guys are good guys. 

Med vänliga hälsningar, Carl Emil.

[JohnH]

Ok great, I'll put it on the to-do list.

So questions for you:
Do you prefer slide switches or mini-toggles?
Would you prefer/expect 'on' for each switch to be 'up' or 'down', in terms of which way you push it?

[carlbrunstril]

I have already bought three mini toggles so i will prefer that!

Ideal situation would be for 2 of the switches to be off while pointing down (neck and middle pickup) and 1 to be on while pointing down (bridge pickup) since i always hit the guitar like a madman so i guess at some point i will hit the toggles by accident so they all are pointing down, and in that situation i would want only the bridge pickup to be on since thats what i use 90% of the time. at least live and thats when i hut the guitar in the more barbaric manner. 

would you like me to draw where i am going to have the knobs and toggles in the pickguard? i guess it doesnt matter, the wiring will be the same regarding where everything is but maybe it would make the diagram easier to understand?

MVH Carl Emil

[JohnH]

Yes that'd help. If you draw looking from the back of the pick guard as you wire it up, and approximately place the controls where you want them, indicating which direction is 'on'.

[JohnH]

Yes that'd help. If you draw looking from the back of the pick guard as you wire it up, and approximately place the controls where you want them, indicating which direction is 'on'.

[carlbrunstril]

This is my vision.

I realize now though, maybe it will be hard to have the volume pot there? I have the volume pot there in my only other guitar. but thats a single pickup with only a volume. So only two wires from the pot, so me and my friend albin only had to scrape out a small canal for the wires to run in from the pot to the original electronics cavity. Ill of course have to route for the pot but thats not a problem. 

But will there be a lot of wires running to the volume pot now since there is a tone pot and switches involved? is it correct that you ground everything on the volume pot?

If so, tell me and i will draw a new little drawing witch the volume in another more convenient place.

but if its only a few more wires than ill make it work. Ill just scrape out a bigger canal for the wires. and i will call it the wire-Nile.

as im writing this i realize i really want to have the volume pot there, but let me know if you guys think it will be irritating to get it to work.

MVH Carl-Emil

[carlbrunstril]

let me know if you don't understand my fantastic drawing. I drew it from the back as you said

[JohnH]

Hi Carl, that looks fine if its what you want . You'll need to rout a space for the volume pot. But just 3 wires will go from volume back you the main cavity. It could be a single 2-core wire with a ground shield, like a piece of microphone cable. You'll need to rout a channel for that. The main wiring can be mostly between the switches and the tone pot.

[carlbrunstril]

Okay than i will do it that way! thanks for the help i appreciate the diagram !!! its no big rush!

[ssstonelover]

There is no real problem moving controls around if you do your homework and use longer wires.
The first image was the planning phase, the second one shows the cutting, the 3rd the wiring layout. Your needs are far simpler, but the steps are analogous.

[JohnH]

Hi carlbrunstril Here is a wiring diagram, which took a bit longer to get to, but it should be ok I think:




I think it respects your design in terms of which control is where, and which direction the switches work.

I added a treble bleed to the volume, which is optional. If you want this and are using 500k pots, then I suggest this should be 1000pF(=1nF) in parallel with 150k.

Not shown: a wire to ground the bridge and strings.

If somebody had a quick check of this diagram it'd be a good idea.

cheers
John

[stevewf]

JohnH's drawing looks good to me. Each of the switches turn on/off its corresponding pickup, and when all three are off (and only when all three are off), the whole signal is shorted to ground for silence.

[reTrEaD]

Mar 2, 2024 16:19:51 GMT -5 JohnH said:

If somebody had a quick check of this diagram it'd be a good idea.

It appears to work as-advertised.

One mostly insignificant footnote: Since the Neck switch is at the 'top' of the all-pickups-off shunting chain, only half of the switch would be needed. You could have the hot going to a common, the pickup connected to the lug directly below it, and the beginning of the shunting chain connected to the lug above that common. However, since it seems unlikely the other side of that switch would be of an use, I wouldn't suggest making that change.

[carlbrunstril]

HELLO guys, thank you john that diagram looks fantastic! i will add a treble bleed i think it would feel good. thanks for the big help.

A little follow up question: What is that capacitor (?) on the tone knob? is it a capacitor and if so what value?

And do i ground the bridge with a wire from the tone knob where all the grounds are, to the tremolo spring claw? will that work? and do i also need to ground the "strings" or is that included when you ground to the spring claw? the strings indirectly touch the tremolo spring claw so i guess that you only need one ground wire i am just a little confused so im asking anyway.


MVH Carl Emil

Thanks again you are helping me out big time

[JohnH]

Thanks Carl
A wire from the ground (eg back of tone pot) to the Bridge or trem is normal, and will ground the strings by contact.

Yes the yellow rectangle at the tone pot is the tone cap. It can be whatever you prefer, its not really specific to this design but a good starting value, very common, would be 22nF = 0.022uF. It doesn't matter what style/type of cap it is (although some may have opinions!)

[themfruit]

Hey!
I'm working on a similar project but with only two pickups and therefore only two switches, how should I wire it up for the same functionality where all sound goes to ground only when both pickups are off?

Many thanks in advance!

[reTrEaD]

Mar 5, 2024 2:04:17 GMT -5 themfruit said:

Hey!
I'm working on a similar project but with only two pickups and therefore only two switches, how should I wire it up for the same functionality where all sound goes to ground only when both pickups are off?

Many thanks in advance!

Hello themfruit .

The first step in resolving your issue is for you to create your own thread.
Be sure to include as much detail regarding your situation as possible. The more detail you provide, the sooner the conversation is likely to result in information that is useful to you.