bpf8hz
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Post by bpf8hz on Mar 28, 2024 2:40:55 GMT -5
hello world
I'm having trouble finding a replacement ON-ON-ON mini toggle switch that would fit where I want it to fit, so I wonder: is it possible to use a DPDT ON-OFF-ON 3-position switch as a pickup switch where order doesn't matter? The use case is controlling the middle pickup on a strat-type guitar. Neck and bridge pickups are controlled by a regular 3-way, which is then wired to an ON-ON-ON mini toggle switch; middle pickup is wired to that toggle switch as well. And so the latter acts the following way: - Middle pickup only
- Middle pickup in parallel with signal from 3-way
- Signal from 3-way only
Essentially, the toggle switch acts as a regular 3-way pickup selector in a regular 2-pickup guitar, getting two inputs and passing its output to the volume pot. Once again, the question is: is it possible to get the same functions (while not caring about their order) from a 3-position DPDT ON-OFF-ON switch?
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Post by JohnH on Mar 28, 2024 14:07:36 GMT -5
hi bpf8hz, thanks for posting. I'm going to say not, even though it's a good intent and worth discussing. The show-stopper for this use is the middle switch setting, in which with a dpdt on-off-on with 6 lugs, nothing is connected to anything. That leads to either the middle, or the 3-way output needing to be hard-wired on. It doesn't matter which order the options are placed, always there's some form of this problem in some position. The easiest (temporary?) workaround is to consider losing the middle-only option, and just use a 2-position switch either to connect the middle to the 3-way, or switch it off to just have the 3-way output. I think many players don't use M, except as part of a combo. (this message will self-destruct when Yogi shows us how to actually do this even though I've said it's Mission Impossible)  |
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Post by Yogi B on Mar 28, 2024 17:21:30 GMT -5
I'm having trouble finding a replacement ON- ON-ON mini toggle switch that would fit where I want it to fit Even an SPDT ON/ON/ON? The easiest (temporary?) workaround is to consider losing the middle-only option, and just use a 2-position switch either to connect the middle to the 3-way, or switch it off to just have the 3-way output. Another option would be relaxing the requirement that the middle pickup is combined in parallel, to just "combined" — then do the series combination instead, using (half) the DPDT ON/OFF/ON to shunt either: the middle pickup; nothing; or whatever is selected by the 3-way. is it possible to use a DPDT ON-OFF-ON 3-position switch as a pickup switch where order doesn't matter?The use case is controlling the middle pickup on a strat-type guitar. Neck and bridge pickups are controlled by a regular 3-way, which is then wired to an ON-ON-ON mini toggle switch; middle pickup is wired to that toggle switch as well. Is the only important thing access to all of the seven parallel-only combinations of three or fewer coils, in other words is the ordering flexible across both switches? If so, then you could do this: |
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bpf8hz
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Post by bpf8hz on Mar 29, 2024 0:38:12 GMT -5
hi bpf8hz, thanks for posting. I'm going to say not, even though it's a good intent and worth discussing. The show-stopper for this use is the middle switch setting, in which with a dpdt on-off-on with 6 lugs, nothing is connected to anything. That leads to either the middle, or the 3-way output needing to be hard-wired on. It doesn't matter which order the options are placed, always there's some form of this problem in some position. The easiest (temporary?) workaround is to consider losing the middle-only option, and just use a 2-position switch either to connect the middle to the 3-way, or switch it off to just have the 3-way output. Yeah, that's the conclusion I've come to as well. Though I think it could be possible to hardwire something and then short/ground it to get those 3 desired positions, albeit in some random avant-garde order. I really like how my hotter-than-usual (and actually designed for a bridge position) middle noiseless SC sounds in contrast to P90s on the outside (P94 actually, or whatever the humbucker-sized version is called). I think that a Strat middle pickup is, in general, a very versatile tool that's really worth using, although one particular Mr. Blackmore would probably disagree Hmm, I don't think I've seen any of those in the mini-toggle-switch format. A Gibson-type switch essentially, right? Three poles, A / A+B / B positions? The "only important thing" is, in my case, having a LP/Tele control mode (where it's just a three-way controlling the outer pickups) with an option to add the middle pickup to the mix/switch completely to the middle pickup. That means wiring the main three-way with "regular" positions (that allow for B, B+N, N, respectively) in fixed order, so the schematic you've posted wouldn't fit, unfortunately. Gives a lot of food for thought, though!
Regarding the series mode - I can't quite imagine that. What positions would that that theoretically allow for? I really need some right, proper intracardiac caffeine injections to get my head working this morning.
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Post by JohnH on Mar 29, 2024 14:47:55 GMT -5
Yogi's circuit is very clever and gives you the tone settings. It doesn't operate the same as the design intent though and that could be an issue for how you want to use it.
It looks to me that you'll really need to get that on-on-on to get what you seek. I had in mind that this switch would be a 3-position mini-toggle? Actually, just personally I find such switches are too annoyingly fiddly for me to use while playing (ok for presetting an option though)
But another and very viable option is that the extra switch is either another tele switch, or, a Gibson-style toggle (with care to make sure it fits, maybe an SG type). Then you can have exactly what you need with two robust guitar-optimized switches. You could probably put a Gibson toggle to replace one of the three Strat pots.
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Post by Yogi B on Mar 31, 2024 22:33:18 GMT -5
Hmm, I don't think I've seen any of those in the mini-toggle-switch format. Hmph, I should've checked before making that suggestion. I didn't think they were super common, but I did think they we're at least available, but it seems that's not the case. What exactly is the issue you're facing with finding a DPDT ON/ON/ON, where is it that you're wanting it to fit? What is wrong with this, for instance?
See below: |
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bpf8hz
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Post by bpf8hz on Apr 1, 2024 6:30:06 GMT -5
But another and very viable option is that the extra switch is either another tele switch, or, a Gibson-style toggle (with care to make sure it fits, maybe an SG type). Then you can have exactly what you need with two robust guitar-optimized switches. You could probably put a Gibson toggle to replace one of the three Strat pots. Those wouldn't fit, unfortunately. The axe has a dedicated control cavity and no pickguard (so no replacement possible in case of bad drilling, etc). I made a mistake some time ago, enlarging the original coil-split-switch hole to fit a heavy-duty button to act as a killswitch and drilling another hole for the actual toggle switch. Now the killswtich hole is too large to fit a switch (that would also be too close to the tone knob), and the toggle switch hole puts the actual switch pretty close to the jack plug, so anything larger than a mini switch would mess with the plug. Lesson learned (the hard way); now I try to plan my modifications at least somewhat in advance. I've managed to find a couple of (bad) photos from some time ago. Things have changed quite a bit since then, but the general idea is the same. And I promise that PoC wiring doesn't look that terrible anymore!  What exactly is the issue you're facing with finding a DPDT ON/ON/ON, where is it that you're wanting it to fit? What is wrong with this, for instance? That's not an issue in a "Mission Impossible" way; what I meant by "I have trouble finding a replacement switch" was something more like "I know what I need and where to look for it but it's really hard to sort those mini ON-ON-ON switches from all the more common types" I've actually ordered a few already. The prospect of using a more widely available type of switch for the same purpose fascinates me, though.
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col
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Post by col on Apr 1, 2024 9:17:37 GMT -5
Is this the switch you seek? adpguitarparts.fr/fr/selecteurs/626-mini-togle-switch-dpdt-3-position-on-on-on-ep-4180-010-chrome.htmlI made a mistake some time ago, enlarging the original coil-split-switch hole to fit a heavy-duty button to act as a killswitch and drilling another hole for the actual toggle switch. Now the killswtich hole is too large to fit a switch (that would also be too close to the tone knob), and the toggle switch hole puts the actual switch pretty close to the jack plug, so anything larger than a mini switch would mess with the plug. Lesson learned (the hard way); now I try to plan my modifications at least somewhat in advance. I wonder if you might use a steel washer above and below the whole - with an additional plastic washer to protect the guitar surface - to allow you to fit an on-on-on (or on-off-on) mini-toggle? It might not look fantastic, but not too bad either. |
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col
format tables
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Post by col on Apr 1, 2024 9:31:47 GMT -5
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