Stratocaster Telecaster etc...

[heartThorSeries]

Um no one has ever told me the difference between the two. Anyone out there mind explaining the tone differences AND the physical differences...

[Trey]

Tele - www.fender.com/products/prod_images/guitars/0138500309_md.jpg

Strat - www.fender.com/products/prod_images/guitars/0117400706_md.jpg


They sound completly diffrent, neither is better than the other just very diffrent.

[GuyaGuy]

teles are known for their twang, making it a favorite of country musicians but also many blues musicians, frank black, bruce springsteen, steve cropper, et al.

strats have a bit of twang but are also known for their woody "acoustic" sound. and also chime. and sometimes "quack." which means i guess a strat is more versatile. it has 3 pickups so it was bound to happen. played by hendrix, clapton, rory gallagher, buddy holly, et al.

[damian]

frank black? beautiful not many people out there know that name. glad to hear it guyaguy. strats have alot of twang also I think teles have more bite. anyway thats my 2 cents.

[RandomHero]

To my ears, a Strat has always had a much more glassy quality to the sound, extremely trebly and airy sounding. Teles sound a bit more spanky.

[StratLover]

ALL are true, but lets remember that the TELE(tm) was the origional and the Strat(tm) was the new and improved. To me it would seem that it was just another sign of the times by those whom had the industry in the palm of their hand.

Having the luxury of owning both, I would say that both are suitable for almost ALL types of music, from semiclassical all the way to megametal.----

True there is more twang in a TELE(tm) and there is QUACK in a STRAT(tm), but a lot of the sounds achievable in each instrument is attainable from either or and the amplification used.

It comes down to the comfort and overall feel of the instrument. As "jd" stated in another thread, "it just needs to feel like you are holding that special WOMAN in your arms", and that I totally agree with.

Try them both and YOU decide on it. I have nothing outragously bad to say about either except for the fact that prices are starting to effect playability for ALL of us "NUTS"------

[Trey]

StratLover said:

I have nothing outragously bad to say about either except for the fact that prices are starting to effect playability for ALL of us "NUTS"------

I must disagree, while the price of guitars with famous names on the headstock are rising, and playability and QC deciling, the quality of low priced copies are rising exponetially. Today a beginner starts off with a guitar that is easily 100X better than the beginner guitars of yesteryear, and for a fraction of the price. As long as one is not obcessed with the marque of their guitar, they can get more bang for thier buck than has ever been possible before.

I say forget the big F and G, I can get a better guitar for less money by buying from a lesser known company...

[StratLover]

True about the Bang for the Buck.......but the prices of the F & G as you say, ARE rising faster than they ever have. In the last 5 years a good collectable US model made by F & G has doubled. Thats just supply and demand for these instruments, which does effect their playability.------

I agree with you completely about the starter guit's of today. When I first started playing I gave 4 months worth of paper route money, roughly $400.00 for my first and it was not even close to what is produced today.------

[Trey]

StratLover said:

True about the Bang for the Buck.......but the prices of the F & G as you say, ARE rising faster than they ever have. In the last 5 years a good collectable US model made by F & G has doubled. Thats just supply and demand for these instruments, which does effect their playability.------

That is true, and the sad part of it is the fact that it's the collecters, not the players, who are driving the prices up. It's getting so a real musican can't afford they guitar they really want because some 50 yr old, mid-life crisis having rich guy decides he MUST have the same guitar *insert famous 60's guitarist here* had. But eventually the bubble will burst and there will be a TON of inexpensive Gibbys and Strats to be had by all, I hope

[bam]

well, at least we nutsers here can learn a bit of DIY, or even for newbies like me, cheaper, better brands either relic or modern like the Spectrum, Aria Pro II, Cort, Ibanez, Godin, ..

[StratLover]

Oh so true.............I can only thank my eye, my wife, and my pocket at the time, or I would'nt have the guit's I have in my collection.--;D--

I play them all, and sometimes I play for such extended periods of time the ol fingers have a tendancy to bend in on themselves leaving me a VelocaRaptor for several hours afterward. It's a good feeling though!!!--;D--

Odly enough, most of those guit's we are speaking of are'nt in the US. They are being held in other countries behind closed vault doors with special ambient lighting and humidity control to preserve their integrity.------

Lets ALL hope that there will be a great boom in the low-end guit's that are far becoming the choice of many today, that sends the out-of-reach ones crashing to where they ought to be.------

[GuyaGuy]

well, i'm coming in late on the discussion, but i've got 2 cents that need putting in!

i'm in agreement that the G's and F's (but also rickys, ibanezes and others) are rising unfairly in price. and i also agree with Trey's observation that "the quality of low priced copies are rising exponetially. Today a beginner starts off with a guitar that is easily 100X better than the beginner guitars of yesteryear."
if you look at what was available in an affordable price range in the 60s, it's appalling. and TEISCOS are some of the better ones!

but i don't think it's neccessary to distinguish between brands. for example, there's one thing i like about FENDER.* they have a guitar for just about every price range, whether it's a $150 b-day present for a 13-yr old punker or a trophy for a collector in a mid-life crisis. part of that is obviously an attempt at dominating the market but it also means there's a lot of guitars to choose from.
the problem is sorting out which ones the good ones are, and price and country of origin aren't always an indication of quality! america has produced some crap guitars and good ones come from unexpected corners of the world. furthermore, brandnames are also no indication of quality. in the 60s and 70s FENDER had one factory and had one way of building a guitar. same goes for IBANEZ, YAMAHA, GIBSON, etc. but in a guitar market where a company is based in one country but outsources from 3 or makes their models in one country and assembles them in another, the only thing you can do is research and actually play the guitar.
FENDER is case in point, as they sell some great guitars and some embarassing ones under the same label. some expensive ones are great, some embarassing. and just to show that country of origin doesn't play such a large role, take GIBSON. they make some great guitars but sometimes you pick up a model and just wonder how they can charge so much for a sub-standard piece. or new GRETSCHES, which would be OK if they had an EPI-range pricetag, but $1700?!
from the beginning, i've always done like Trey--ignored F and G and found some really good and (comparatively) really cheap guitars. but i've always like oddball guitars.
but, to attempt at making this short even though i've failed doing that already ( ;D ), regardless of brandname, prices are higher and lower than ever.

*(believe me, there's a LOT i don't like about em. the last musiciansfriend catalog i opened up had about 8 pages of fender "gear": fender shoes, fender martini glasses and coasters, fender leather jackets...ugh )

[GuyaGuy]

p.s. wow, that was a long post!

[heartThorSeries]

true but i found this Strat in my local Guitar store that is ... lets just say it makes my Aria Pro II sound like a horn.

[GuyaGuy]

like a horn?

[damian]

and honestly here I dont think its too much to ask for 1000 bucks for a guitar. I have built a guitar and there is a ton of work that goes into it. And we are talking american labor compared to korean labor prices its a big difference. I think its definately possible to get foreign guitars that are just as good if not better at a lower price. I also beieve there is a pride factor knowing that you own a guitar that was built in the USA by an original not exploiting cheap labor( I know they dont pay the american employees much better!). So I guess Im saying there are many variables to consider when thinking about guitar prices. I think guitars these days are very reasonably priced even from the "big 3" or ten or whatever. There is just more competition. I say buy what you can afford and rock with no worries!Peace Damian

[wolf]

If nothing else (as others have stated), a beginning guitarist in 2005 with a limited budget can find a darned good guitar for as little as $100. As GuyaGuy mentioned, the chepaie guitars of the 1960's (Teisco, Fandell, Kent, etc) were horrible. They had action like ¼" at the nut !!! Also the necks were made so poorly, none of these pieces of crap could actually play every note on every fret. The majority of these alleged guitars (around the 7th or 8th fret) would start hitting the 15th fret and so frets from #8 throgh #14 were useless.

If nothing else, the inexpensive guitars of today are quite good.

[GuyaGuy]

damian said:

and honestly here I dont think its too much to ask for 1000 bucks for a guitar. I have built a guitar and there is a ton of work that goes into it.

i'll give you that. but often you have to ask what yr paying for.
many at the FENDER custom shop are independent luthiers who are contracted by F. they receive pre-cut bodies and necks which are shaved down by a fraction of millimeter. you have maybe 2-3 choices of fingerboard woods, 2-3 of body woods. and that's sold as a "custom" guitar. and because it has a F logo it sells for more than that luthier's other models.

when PEAVEY introduced computerized body and neck cutting in the 70s with their "T" series, they revolutionized guitar making, for better or worse. i happen to love it cuz it means you can knock out guitars like they're going out of style and charge a lot less. that combined with more wide-spread knowledge about how to make a good guitar equals lotsa good cheap guitars out there.

for those who think they have no "mojo," let me quote the owner of guild bemoaning the loss of crafstmanship when FENDER started making the BROADCASTER, the 1st marketed solidbody: "now everyone with a router will be able to make a guitar!" well, now everyone w/ a computerized cutter can make one. and me likey!

[bam]

wolf:

a beginning guitarist in 2005 with a limited budget can find a darned good guitar for as little as $100.

that's it.

[mike]

Check out Tradition Guitars.

[ChrisK]

Why do men have mid life crisis',....because we can!

A Tele is twangy. The metal hardtail bridge plate, the relatively solid mass of wood, and the covered neck PU all contribute. Also, there are significant differences between the PU's characteristics.

A Strat is quacky and mellow and glassy. It doesn't hurt having that internal reverb system (the vibrato/springs) and big internal cavities. Sort of a semi-acoustic guitar w/ the cavities on the outside (well, under plastic). The 3 Pu's all have fairly similar characteristics.


I agree w/ the comments about F and G (especially G). While I've seen a number of terrible ones from F, I've rarely seen a good one from G. The entry price for a good G is about a grand higher than F (and what does that digital guitar thing actually do?). I have two Am Dlx Strats (one is the 2004 50th which is extraordinary in every way) and a MIM Nshville Power Tele (first guitar that I bought this time around [ie this "crisis]). I have none from Gib$on. All of the rest are off-broadway because I bought what I liked, not what was broadly liked.


I've bought crazy ones like a Parker P-38, a SLM MPC Electra, PRS Soapbar SE (best P-90 deal on the planet), Godin xt LG, Variax 500, Epi Studio dot ($210, I HAD to), Ric Laguna, Ibanez Ghostrider. When I go into GC they say "what are you doing here, you already have one of everything." (I'm being true to my current crisis'.)

I helped a guy in his 30's in a GC a few years ago select a guitar. He was a new player but wanted one that was flexible. A P-38 was on clearance for $300 (normally $600 street) and a MIM Stat was also $300 (which anyone can negotiate [what!, you can negotiate?]). He loved the Parker. It was exactly what he could play the best, and the variety of sounds really impressed him. Unfortunately, he bought the MIM Strat only because people would "believe him" more if he had a name brand, normal, guitar (peer pressure, he admitted as much).


I would rather build the high dollar spends, for the cost of one (~$1,000+) you can build one helleva (and often two helleva) guitar(s). AND get exactly what you (thought that you) wanted (at the time).


While I see that vintage guitars have gone thru the roof in ?value? (er, what folks are willing to pay), I don't see another "slug" of 'boomers coming to sustain such trends. Back in the 60's, there were guitars that I gave away because they were crud. I see similar ones on the wall for a few thousand dollars now. They're still cruddy.

(And, when you figure in inflation.....)

However, I'm keeping all of the toys that I bought for the kids......

[GuyaGuy]

chrisk said:

I agree w/ the comments about F and G (especially G). While I've seen a number of terrible ones from F, I've rarely seen a good one from G. The entry price for a good G is about a grand higher than F (and what does that digital guitar thing actually do?).

I would rather build the high dollar spends, for the cost of one (~$1,000+) you can build one helleva (and often two helleva) guitar(s). AND get exactly what you (thought that you) wanted (at the time)..

yeah, i've always wondered why people who want to spend over a grand on a guitar don't go to a REAL custom shop where you can choose EVERYTHING--wood, PUs, screw sizes, EVERYTHING! people love brand names, i guess.

i'm not totally anti-G or F. both offer good'uns, imo, but, as you say, the entry price for a G is a grand more. now, in the olden days that was because Fs were mass-produced and Gs were "old world craftsmanship." now that EVERYTHING is CNC you gotta ask yrself why the difference in price, esp if that LP's flamed maple veneer is hiding laminated wood.

as for the PRS Soapbar SE being the "best P-90 deal on the planet," i'll have to say that the AGILES are AT LEAST as good and probably better at $250!
as for yr electra, i was a devoted electra-ite (or electrician? ) until i recently switched to single coils. they're some of the best guitars you can get, imho. my outlaw MPC was the best-made guitar i've ever had.

[ChrisK]

Yeah,

The Electra's are interesting guitars. The plug-in module ones were really hi-tech back in the 70's (God, I hate that phrase almost as much as solid-state). I have the 340, an LP copy made out of Jotobo (or something) mahogany. There was a site called "....herons..." or something that had an Electra museum, but it's been down (or moved) for a while. I had fortunately downloaded most of it for my reference. Not only does it do the LP PU modes, it also does both in series and both in out-of-phase series.

I bot mine for $200 used, to make into a PU test bed. Got three modules w/ it as well. Someone had over-filed the nut slots and it was unplayable w/o a capo. Also, it had apparently spent time in a garage (corrosion) and the neck was twisted and was similar to the Lace necks that had a designed twist for better access on the high frets. The twist is uniform and quite playable. It has better tone than any Gib$on LP that I've ever tried. Well, it never became a test bed! These guitars were as expensive as Gibsons back then.


For the $2,000 for a proper entry Gib$on LP, Suhr makes some mighty fine guitars (and you can get just about any reasonable variation in body or neck width/thickness that you want).


Speaking of guitars that sound like horns, I have a Hamar all bubinga fretless bass w/ flat wound strings. When the strings are lightly "fingered" (not fretted!), it sounds just like a muted trombone or trumpet.

[GuyaGuy]

chrisk said:

Yeah,

The Electra's are interesting guitars. The plug-in module ones were really hi-tech back in the 70's (God, I hate that phrase almost as much as solid-state).

which phrase is that--"hi-tech" or "back in the 70's"? ;D

mike heron's ELECTRA site has moved here:
www.therathole.org/guitars/electra/

the rathole.org/guitars is the site for guitars made at the MATSUMOKU factory (ARIA PRO II, WASHBURN, WESTONE, ELECTRA, etc.)

i got my OUTLAW from a guitar shop--professionally set up and with 4 effect modules and case for $375! it had series/parallel wiring, phase reverse, etc. i wouldn't know a single thing about wiring if it wasn't for ELECTRA. i just got it and tried to figure out what the sounds were, what the terms meant, etc.
i also had an ELECTRA PHOENIX X-150 which was really nice. also had plenty of switches!
then there was the ARIA TS-500 and the RS, the EPI ET...yes, i went MATSUMOKU crazy there for a while!
definitely great guitars and most can be had for $350 or under!!

[ChrisK]

Thanks for the link to Herons.

[jamie]

One would have to imagine that the lower priced Squir quitars of today would have to be of better quality than the originals made by Fender in the 60s.

Fender has Sqier, a lower priced version of Fenders.
Gibson has allowed Epiphone to make replicas of its major styles. I also seen some lower priced versions of the usually high priced ESP guitars(you can get one of their Viper guitars with EMGs for under $1000).

I would just like to add that the Yamaha guitars that i have seen are far better value for money than the big brands. In fact the big brands should hang thier heads in shame. But only when Yamaha realises how much they should be charging for thier guitars, will the guitars be more sought after.

[Runewalker]

Well for a thread about the diff between Tele's and Stats this has drifted, but I had to weigh in on the drift.

When I first started playing the cheap guitars were awful to play, discouraging many a budding Hendrix. Todays cheap guitars, with proper setup are shockingly good. The cheap pups you probably have to switch out but bodies and necks are really a surprise.

When my Gibby started getting long in the tooth and short in the fret height, I had to get another 'player' and had a heart attack at the price on new Les Pauls. So I started dabbling in Ebay buying cheapos and upgrading. Bought a kid's Squire for $50 bucks he could not wait to get rid of because it play cRA___. Did a 30 min setup and expect little and was shocked at how good it played.

At that point I crossed over to 'get a well executed asian base of body and neck' upgrade pups and bridge and tuners if needed, and get a S850-$1500 level guitar that plays well and sounds great.

This collector stuff I can appreciate because guitars are beautiful.. But I chaff at them sitting in cases or on display never to be played. ITS JUST WRONG.

I have a collectible or 2 now that I am afraid to play because they are worth too much, and it just does not sit right.

So it is great to have a haren of superior players, built for $150-250 that I can whack on and not worry about hurting the value.


Oh -- Teles and Strats. Would someone please mention Roy Bucanan and the IceMan Albert Collins if you are going to talk about definitive Tele Players. The big difference seems to be the geographic spread between Tele's pups and the lack of a comensurate pup spread in the Strat (no bridge/neck combo, unless you crossed over into the GuitarNutz mod zone).

What's up with that strange Tele headstock shape. What was Leo thinking?

[soldercaster]

The beauty of it all is that you find what you like and you either buy it or build it (or buy it then build it). You can also choose from 10,000,000 types, styles, colors... It's like everything else - we have designer guitars now!
And I believe we play what we love eventually. I started playing on my grandmother's Silvertone hollowbody. My Dad put me into my first electric - a 1969 Ventura ES335 copy ($100.00)which I still have( still worth $100.00,LOL). I fell in love with the Stratocaster and bought a 73 in 78. It was a Stratocaster - no MIM,MIJ,MIK,MIA,MIC key mouse, ad nauseum. It was like cars back then - You were either Chevy or Ford, Les Paul or Strat. I know, it sounds like I'm lamenting a "walked to school, uphill, both ways" kinda thing... I'm just saying, we've come a long way from tying a rope to a mop handle attached to a washtub, some for better, some worse...

Someone earlier made reference to how a guitar should feel when you hold it - and that's the deal. When you play that emotionally filled melody, or your particular favorite powerchord progression and the guitar feels right, sounds right and you get that feeling only a guitar player knows, it doesn't matter whether you paid 1,000 bucks w/ 47 effects pedals or found it in your uncle's attic, it's the RIGHT one. It becomes part of you. I still play Strats, cuz that's what does it for me - A Strat and a Marshall (Tubes, thank you very much)with just enough overdrive on the preamp to rattle your fillings!

I'm sure some of us "older" guys (I'm 25, trapped in a 45 year old's body) are having mid- life crises (YEAH, because we can !!), but some of us are still rockin in the free world every weekend (where'd all the roadies go?) even though my rig costs 5 times as much as it did in the 80's and the clubs aren't paying much better than they were. I'd like to hold another 70 something strat, wish I hadn't sold my 73 before it became worth the down payment on a house.....

Sorry for the long post - What were we talkin' about, anyway??? LOL

[d34th4uall]

Don't let the global marketing thing deter you from exploiting the classic styles "donated" to us by the strat and tele.I believe the strat is the most copied guitar of all time.its like Harley. they used to be for certain types. now every 40+ office exec. is a weekend warrior.the same is happening to fender.hence the shoes and such.but the truth behind the legend is, they make the best guitars.Not even so much right off the shelf, but their basically large hollow body leaves ample room for mods.a beaten and abused strat is probably the easiest and chaepest guitar to repair and restore.last but not least, the better you mod, the better it sounds.so dont put it off just cause of over mass marketing ploys.lets face it , that is the american way.