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Post by sumgai on Jan 15, 2008 4:04:11 GMT -5
Nowhere else makes sense for posting this, but I feel an obligation to keep you all up-to-date. Some time ago I said (elsewhere on this forum) that I was internalizing an external Roland GK-2A pickup. The job is now finished, as you can see below. These are some quicky images, they're a bit fuzzy due to the pixel-size reduction and then the compression to make the files downloadable without growing a beard.   The final product, a more-or-less bird's eye view (with a beautiful, if expensive, genuine Fender tortoise-shell pickguard):  Inside, showing where the board sits. I held a blank pickguard over the paper, lined up the screwholes, and drew a line showing where the bridge pup would be. (The paper is the backing of the copper shielding (that would have been tossed out), it's thick enough to provide insulation between the board and the copper foil.)  A close up of the switches and LED. It's a bit tight both above board and underneath, but it's very user-friendly.  And here's the reason it took so long. That connector shell started out as a 5-pin DIN female socket. I drilled that out, removed the 13-pin socket from a standard in-line DIN connector, and hand-tuned everything to fit. I soldered the wires on the backside, applied some J-B weld to the edges (there isn't a lot of room for "nice" adhesives), and slipped her in to place.  There'll be more on my website shortly. I've discovered that some of the images I captured are a bit fuzzy, and I'll have to take it apart and re-shoot them. I'm doing a full article on how to make this conversion, but if you have questions now, don't wait for that to happen, fire away! ;D sumgai |
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Post by JohnH on Jan 15, 2008 14:51:05 GMT -5
Nice work. its great to see a project from the chief! Im not familiar with that system, so Id be interested to know more about what it does in your guitar.
cheers
John
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Post by newey on Jan 15, 2008 18:50:20 GMT -5
Sumgai-
Also please add a link(or just shoot the url out) for your website so we can read the details. I, too, am unfamiliar w/ this Roland piece. Looks like a nice job of routing the wires and fitting the components, however- A++ for neatness. And neatness does count in these endeavors.
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Post by sumgai on Jan 16, 2008 3:19:03 GMT -5
newey, You can be sure that I'll make the link public, when the pages are done. Part of the reason I did this was that normally, the board sits in a "wart" outside, stuck to the body. Said wart is not meant to be removed, thus a hardshell case either warps pretty badly, or else gives up the ghost. My idea was to simply take everything inside, under the covers. The big problem with that was mounting the 13-pin jack. I decided to make a "stealth" installation, and put it where you'd normally find the ¼" jack, instead of drilling/routing a big hole along the edge, as most builders do. This means, in the end, that everything is reversible - should I wish to sell the axe, sans the goodies, I can simply remove the board, put in another jack plate, put the old pickguard back on, and Presto!, no one's the wiser that I ever had a hex pickup on-board. ;D There's more to explain, of course, but I'll shut up for now. Still, any questions, I'm happy to oblige. And Chris knows exactly what I just did, you can hit him up for information too.  The impetus for all this is best explained at vg-8.com/wikiHTH sumgai |
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Post by ashcatlt on Jan 16, 2008 15:28:14 GMT -5
You are aware that Roland sells kits for this pickup which are meant to be installed internally? Do you know what it is that the wart is actually doing? As I understand there's not a whole lot of much processing going on there, that all happens on whatever box you plug it into. Are the individual pickups buffered or amplified in any way before they leave the guitar? Does it do anything at all (buffer, etc) to the signal coming from your other pickups? And what kind of signal is used to allow the switches and knobs to act as "remote controls" for your VG-8? For those who don't feel like following that link, the GK2A is a hex-pickup. 6 independent pickups that render the signal from each individual string. Pending the answers to the paragraph above, I'd say it doesn't really do much else. What you decide to do to each of these string signals is up to you. In Sumgai's case, with the VG-8, it applies algorithms to the signals which can model just about any guitar/pickup combination imaginable. A lot like the Variax, but far more powerful. Sure, you can choose between LP, 12 string acoustic, etc. It also does alternate tunings, so you can re-tune with the stomp of a pedal (is this what you're using for that "5ths tuning"?). It will also resynthesize your guitar into other instruments. You can play a cello or an oboe, a drum kit or a mini-moog. And, I think, you can mix in the signal coming from the traditional pickups on the guitar. It's also got amp modeling and effects. Roland (and others) produce several other boxes into which you could plug this thing. Most of those (like my GI-10) are guitar > midi converters, which track (sometimes not particularly well) the pitch and dynamic content coming from each string and spit out midi data which can be routed to your favorite synth device. You could just as easily terminate the 13-pin cable at a box on the floor with 6 x 1/4" jacks and route each string to a different effect chain/amplifier/track on your favorite recording object. I think this thread has made me decide that I need a working GK-2A before I get the short scale bass and guitar that I've been fantasizing about. Might be easier to get past the wife too. "Why do you need another guitar? You don't hardly play the 4 you've got!" Sumgai (or anybody else) have you ever tried any non-Roland divided pickups. There are a few companies that make these which are supposedly compatable. Sometimes they can be found cheaper than the "official" version. |
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Post by ChrisK on Jan 16, 2008 19:22:50 GMT -5
Yeah, there are other pickups (RMC rules!) and other guitars that do this. The VG Strat is just the Roland pickup and a mini DSP engine integrated under the pickguard ($1,700 merci) on an American (It's the U.S. dang it!, everybody on both continents in this hemisphere are Americans...) Series Strat. This is my current 13 pin guitar (I have the transparent red one). Inside, it looks like this I had the external Roland pickup on my Tele ToggleCaster driving my VG-88. I'd thought about integrating the pickup inside, but it looked like work or something......... Hmm, so do you think that the VG-8 might actually fit into the vibrato cavity?  |
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Post by Ripper on Jan 16, 2008 19:28:54 GMT -5
Thats a sweet Strat!...Id love to hear it?
Sumgai, ol buddy....how about a minute or so on Youtube?
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Post by sumgai on Jan 16, 2008 20:52:40 GMT -5
(Various replies ahead, I'm not gonna post-w  e. ) ash, Yes, of course. Just as you are equally aware that they sell for $175 to $200, depending..... Unopened ones that were never used can be found occasionally, if one wishes to wait on eBay, but I had this sitting around, it was cheap ($40!!), and it worked/still does work. As far as the wart's board goes, it doesn't process the individual signals so much as it just filters them. There's a hi-pass filter to cut off potential body resonance and cross-talk issues, and a lo-pass filter to prevent aliasing. They are roughly tuned, of course, the design parameters are a compromise because Roland has no idea where the pickup will end up being installed. As it happens the board needs ±7vDC because it has 4 ea. 4570 chips on board. And just for John, the magnetic pickup signal is buffered through a section of one those chips, to alleviate the potential loss of signal integrity, as it goes down the 24 ga. wiring. As for the rest of what you said, right arm! I have the VG-88 v2, and a GR-33, so I've got just about all the bases covered. (Not to mention a synth module or two, laying around somewheres....) Both devices will let me use alternate tunings, so this is, indeed, how I've been spending some of my time (going nutzo!), playing with tuning in 5ths instead of the usual 4ths. And finally, yes, I had a Graphtech Ghost setup on my previous Strat. This is the fourth or fifth installation I've done, but the first I've done with the stealth option. And for the record, RMC used to make a break-out box just as you described. They're starting to go up in value, when findable, they are mighty handy around a studio. I'm not married to the Roland version, but this time around (I had one a few years ago, for about 20 seconds), I'm gonna give it at least a couple of months before making up my mind. I may have to install another piezo system side-by-side with it, just for testing purposes, you understand. ;D ~!~!~!~!~ Chris, Yes indeed, Richard McLish knows what he's about, eh? He and I have corresponded many a time, even though I don't have his product. But since my main man left Graphtech, I just may jump ship. Time will tell. (Of course, you realize that this takes away from my Jazzmaster project. The stealth installation of that 13-pin jack was the main reason I want a JM body - I need the real estate to mount both that and a standard output jack on the front - no more side-of-the-body mounting for me. But never fear, the day is coming!) Hmmm, come to think of it the JM has a rather large hole out there beyond the bridge that's not doing anything important...... maybe a mini-VG-8 could be shoe-horned in there, ya think?  Or at least a Variax board of some kind......  ~!~!~!~!~ deep, Pardner, I hate to say this, but I have a real antipathy towards YouTube, for several reasons. And MySpace isn't any higher on my list either, now that I think about it. When I put up the page that chronicles my mod, I'll include some sound clips there. Does that get your squeal of approval? sumgai |
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Post by Ripper on Jan 16, 2008 22:20:05 GMT -5
WEEEEeeeeeEEEEEE! I wish I had a purty mouth! Yes, I approve mon ami! |
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Post by JFrankParnell on Feb 8, 2011 14:59:41 GMT -5
after seeing this guitar in person, I started googling and guitarnutsing about on the subject, till I came full circle back to this thread I resurect it now to ask, where is this alleged website and purported sound clips? |
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Post by sumgai on Feb 9, 2011 2:36:16 GMT -5
after seeing this guitar in person, I started googling and guitarnutsing about on the subject, till I came full circle back to this thread I resurect it now to ask, where is this alleged website and purported sound clips? Probably about the same location as your green wig! ;D It's a lost cause, me getting both the time and the inclination to finish this up. But as I've explained, the wife isn't buying my statement that I've quit playing, and that as far as I'm concerned, it can all go up for sale. But damned if I can figure out what she knows that I don't know...... Women. Ya can't live with 'em, and ya can't shoot 'em! sumgai |
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Post by cynical1 on Feb 9, 2011 6:35:21 GMT -5
Women. Ya can't live with 'em, and ya can't shoot 'em! Actually, you can shoot them...you just can't get away with it... |
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Post by ijustwannastrat on Feb 9, 2011 10:48:52 GMT -5
Women. Ya can't live with 'em, and ya can't shoot 'em! Actually, you can shoot them...you just can't get away with it... I see you've never heard of a little game called football. ;D ;D |
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Post by JFrankParnell on Feb 9, 2011 11:55:52 GMT -5
or, as they say in montana, "sheep dont cook"
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Post by sumgai on Feb 9, 2011 12:17:34 GMT -5
or, as they say in montana, "sheep dont cook" Sure they do! Mary had a little lamb,
Her father killed it dead.
Now she takes it with her to school,
Between two hunks of bread!All cooked up nice and neat, of course. ;D |
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Or at least a Variax board of some kind...... 
