The Strat SP

[JohnH]

For those who get bored looking at the same old wiring diagrams, here’s a different one. It’s for a Strat, with no extra visible switches. It is based on a view of mine, that the best sounds come from just one or two coils, and so it is not essential to be able to pick all three at once. If that limitation that is accepted, then some neat control features are possible.

With two coils to be used at most, there are three basic combinations, which can be placed at positions 2, 3 and 4 of a 5-way switch.

In this design, the selected coil pair can be combined in series or parallel, in or out of phase. Positions 1 and 5 are reserved for access to the neck and bridge single-coil settings, irrespective of other switches.


www.jocidapark.com.au/circuits/GN2/StratSP101210a.gif

The 5-way selects one or two coils, and the coil nearest the bridge is always placed on the hot-side of a series-connected pair.

This allows some nice features to be provided:

Enhanced tone control

A feature I have used on several designs is to use the third leg of the tone pot to bypass one coil via a capacitor, when in series mode. This is best if it is the more bassy coil, and it lets the highs from the non- bypassed coil become more prominent, making the tone brighter, while keeping a full bass signal. On a Strat, this is tricky to configure for all combinations, since it may be the neck or the middle coil that is wanted to be bypassed. But here, it can work in all three series combinations. It works in a consistent way, because as you turn up treble, it just keeps getting brighter, all the way up to 10

Fade control

A good sound from a series wiring is to add just a small amount of a neck pickup to the full sound of the bridge or middle, and similarly, a combo of bridge with just a little middle in series. The ‘fade’ control allows the bassier member of the selected pair to be mixed in smoothly on all three combination settings.

Universal phase switch

Usually, only one pickup can be reversed by a normal phase switch, so the combos that do not use that pickup do not get phased. But in this case, all three combos can be reverse-phased, in series or parallel modes.

Normal parallel and single sounds

These are not affected by the fade control, and the tone pot acts as normal. The often-liked-but-usually-unavailable Tele sound of B+N replaces the middle only, at position 3. But if M alone is really needed, it is available by selecting NxM, and fading down N.

So there it is, hopefully it has easy access to all the most useful sounds, and a large amount of tweakability to play with too.

Minimal version

I think this design would also be valid in a more minimal configuration, just a volume and enhanced tone control, with the series/parallel switch but without the phase switch or fade knob.

Cheers

John

[newey]

JohnH-

Great ideas in this design! +1!

I had not previously seen a "universal" phase switch, and I'm still tracing my way through it (6 am and first cup of coffee here . . . ). But a neat idea.

Are you planning to implement this?

[JohnH]

Thanks newey. This one goes to the top of my list of designs I want to try, next time I get a Strat, but that may be a while.

cheers

John

[chase]

Brilliant stuff as always John. You've given me some ideas for new things to try, as well as another diagram to dissect and learn from!

[Runewalker]

JH: Intriguing....

SW1 = Superswitch?

RW

[JohnH]

Dec 13, 2010 23:58:01 GMT -5 Runewalker said:

JH: Intriguing....

SW1 = Superswitch?

RW

yes indeed. also, I forgot to note all the pot values. Im thinking 500k log volume and tone, and 250k log for the fade knob

[treguiers]

Just curious john....what would 250k push pulls sound like in this design. I have a few lying around and a cheap strat copy, sorely tempted to have a go at this one on the strength of the success of the hss version(sound report on the hss to follow very soon btw.)

[JohnH]

Definately worth a shot. I showed 500k, even on this single coil design to make the series settings brighter. But I think Fender uses 250k on its S1 switching which has series options. So with 250k's the single and parallel options will sound 'normal strat' and the series ones a tad mellower than with 500k.

John

[treguiers]

Hi
Going to attempt this design.....but with a slightly different agenda. As i am in essence a jazz player I'm really interested in making a strat-jazz guitar. Inspired by this clip.

It a fender bullitt with a paf pup on the neck......he tells me he uses it for loud gigs at volumes where an archtop would feed and generally be difficult to control(makes sense to me)

A friend of mine gave me a shadow atilla zoller(www.shadow-electronics.com/viewpro.html?lang_id=&id=76) pup many moons ago I found it recently and stuck it in a cheap strat copy. I love the tone it gives so its a keeper as far as I'm concerned.There is only a coax wire coming from it with an inner and outer.....no facility to coiltap. I've a feeling that may mess up things a bit. Coupled with that I have 250k push pulls instead of the 500k ones recommended. The 250k will give a darker tone according to John H (and who am I to argue with the man!)

The rest of the pups are pieces of crap, so the neck setting is the only show in town at the mo. I'm gonna stick some stock fender strat single coils in the mid and bridge this will give me some strat type options too. 4real mentions a jazz-strat on his page but not quite sure what he means by it.
Interested particularly in treble bleeds and tone control options to give a dark velvety crisp tone as opposed to a wolly lifeless one.
Again any words of wisdom would be warmly welcomed

[4real]

Interesting project, treguiers

A lot of great players use solid bodies, Ted Green for instance, but there is more to do with he technique to get that kind of sound than the 'look' of a 'jazz guitar'.

It is surprising how good a tele's neck pickup, if a good one. can sound and that is one of the thinnest types of fender pups around. You can hear some of that tone in my tele's sound clip (I believe just before the end of pt1).

And, this seems like a good scheme for this kind of thing, not sure about making things too dark (muddy) so pots to suit the HB and series modes might be a better bet than a 'make do'.

It does not feature though the all on in series which can create a lovely 'jazz' sound on a strat, very powerful and 'warm'...a bit of HOoP on mine gives it a bit of an edge. Very much like that 'Wes' sound though and a similar effect with my LP. BxN on this scheme and an HB in the neck position could give a nice sound like that, the warm body with a bit of an edge from the bridge pup.

...

"Jazz sounds" come in all kinds of flavours, but the 'classic' I guess is that hollowbody sound, it's often misunderstood to be kind of 'dark' which generally is true, but you need a bit of an edge to get the kind of definition to run about the fretboard.

There is no guitar really that could not be turned to jazz duties, but as I've found, there is some audience and fellow players who accept no substitutes. Play a hollowbody in any passable jazz way and the look seems to fulfil the expectation...I've certainly found that in recent times with the kind of music I attempt to play these days (of which there is a strong jazz influence), having the look helps 'seal the deal' LOL

...


Best of luck, You may well ahve yours done before I have mine!

[treguiers]

Hi Guys. Just generally shielding before I start into it. The Jazz pup is bolted on to the neck....so it cannot be turned around. With regard to the jazz pup the coil closest to the neck I shall call A and the one further away B.
Doing a face to face test the mid pup is attracted to A repels B. the bridge pup repels A attracts B. Mid and bridge attract.

I angled the bridge the opposite way...just curious to hear how that sounds.

Still have more prep work to do. will start soon.

[newey]

tre, earlier you noted that:

There is only a coax wire coming from it with an inner and outer.....no facility to coiltap. I've a feeling that may mess up things a bit.

What it means is that you're not splitting any coils, so for the neck PAF it doesn't really matter what attracts what, as you're not going to be able to pick one or the other coil anyway- unless you plan to do surgery on the pup to make it 4-conductor.

Your Mid and Bridge SCs attract, so they are opposite polarity and will be hum-cancelling in combination. With any combination of a SC with the neck HB, it's three coils (because you only have the full HB) so it won't be completely hum-cancelling in those combos.

[treguiers]

Thanks Newey, I can go ahead and build

[treguiers]

Ok ....built the above guitar...not strung up yet. The bridge pup has a louder hum than the rest. I expected that, but when i chose NxM and faded out the neck, mid was as quiet as a mouse..... Does this sound normal or do i have some earthing issue. It's also a tight squeeze to get the plate back in place, so I may be shorting something doing that. All combinations with the bridge are as quiet as a mouse and I've shielded the guitar.
I do seem to lose a signal when I'm on bridge only and pull the phase knob. I'll keep checking for shorts in the meantime.

[JohnH]

can you check each setting by tapping with a screwdriver? - see if the right pups are working in each setting? Id suggest checking phase too, see the screwdriver pulloff test in the reference section -

j

[treguiers]

Hi John, i will check those over the next few days...getting late here. better with a fresh head
thanks

[treguiers]

Checked all positions. All work as should....except the bridge pup is hot when in combination but very weak and noisy when bridge only is selected. It is almost non existent when I flick the phase knob in the bridge only position(yet the bridge pup sounds fine in oop combinations). When I select NxB or MxB and fade out N or M, the bridge o/p is fine.

I did the screwdriver phase test and everything seems fine. The neck pup is encased and waxed and stuff so i can't do the test on it. It simply doesn't respond. But it seems to be working fine. B and M are the same direction on audacity when in series/ parallel but different directions when I flick the phase button.

I will go at it again later with a fine tooth comb....but some wise words on where to start and what to look for would certainly help.
Thanks......

[treguiers]

Ye ha!(not a technical term...i grant you) I found the problem. One of the brushes on the suserswitch was raised and wasn't making contact with the moving rail. pushed it back down into place, All seems good.... stringing up time..... Thanks john again for all the patient encouragement...it must be tedious for you to drop your level of knowledge to a point where i can understand it. thanks....I'll keep you posted on results.

[JohnH]

Great stuff, and that makes sense. Often those very thin weak sounds come from a disconnection at the ground end of a pickup, and a bit of sound is created through the hot only. It had to be something at the switch since it was inly one setting affected. Onwards..!!

J

[treguiers]

Ok strung it up. General pup tones are amazing, the same quality as on the strat sp hss. A funny thing though, I compared the wiring on the strat sp and the strat sp hss. On the phase push pull on this one it's out of phase when the switch is in, yet I wired it to from the same lugs on the push pull to the same lugs on the superswitch as per the hss version. Are push pulls inconsistent or am I missing something? Shall I just move the wires to the bottom two lugs?

Secondly the tone control isn't happening. I used a 50nf(503) instead of a 47nf, and I used a 20nf(203) instead of a 22nf. I will check to see that all is well connection wise.....but as of now another incredible guitar.

30 mins later......checked the diagram and realised i hadn't earthed the centre lug of the tone pot ......so will now take a good look at the phase switch

[newey]

Shall I just move the wires to the bottom two lugs?

Well, that ought to solve it. But as far as I know P/Ps are all the same.

Is it possible that, on one of the two guitars, you wired the pickups OOP to begin with, thus pulling the switch puts them back in phase?

[treguiers]

Hi Newey
Thats exactly what I've been reflecting on. M is a stock strat sc pup with red and white wire, I treated the white as hot. Bridge is a suhr neck pup with a black and white wire, again treated the white as hot. The HB at the neck uses a coax, I used the inner as the hot.

Assuming that everything is wired to spec, will I mess anything up by swapping those two wires?

[JohnH]

I like it when tg builds these designs. There’s a post or two about going to build, then its built and it almost works, then one or two more and it’s done!

On the phase switch, remember this one is different to most, and it acts on a different pickup depending what selection you make. In that way it can make an oop combo with any pickup pair. So if you are finding that it is consistently in phase when pulled and out of phase when in, in all the three pickup pairs, then leave all the pup wiring as is and just swap the wires on the two centre lugs of the phase switch, to reverse its action. If however, some pairs are in phase when its pushed in and some are oop, then if you can identify which then we can work out what pup wires to swap.

John

[treguiers]

OK.... got the same results for series as parallel:
N+M is oop in
N+B is oop in
M+B is oop out

If I was to hazzard a guess I'd reckon the neck pup needs to be switched

[JohnH]

Dec 11, 2011 21:12:48 GMT -5 treguiers said:

OK.... got the same results for series as parallel:
N+M is oop in
N+B is oop in
M+B is oop out

That would suggest keep the switch wiring as it is, and swap the two wires from the neck pup to correct NM and NB combos.

J

[treguiers]

Thanks John .....will do.

[treguiers]

Another Monstrous Guitar.....................All is working. I'm afraid it will be next w'end before I get a chance to gig it. I shall keep you posted. At the risk of sounding like a stuck record....Thanks John

[pete12345]

I just found this via the HSS version. Looks like another well thought-out scheme that's now on my list to try.

Am I right in thinking that the enhanced tone control would do the same as my current setup of having a tone wired directly to the neck pickup? One of the settings I currently use is N*B, with the neck tone turned down. Most designs with a single tone control lose that ability, though this one looks like it would retain it. Great job!

[reTrEaD]

Aug 13, 2012 9:59:05 GMT -5 pete12345 said:

Am I right in thinking that the enhanced tone control would do the same as my current setup of having a tone wired directly to the neck pickup?

It does much more, but is slightly 'fussy'.

With the tone wired directly across the neck pickup, it functions as an overall tone control when in the parallel mode and as a "bypass" in the series mode. In both cases, 10 is out of circuit and 0 is full cut (or bypass).

The 'enhanced' tone control acts like an overall tone control in either series or parallel mode. However from the middle of the resistance (5 on a linear pot, 8 or so on a log pot) to 10, an additional function is available. The cap-bypass of one pickup.

In the series mode, the most "out of circuit" this control can be is at the middle of the pot's resistance. This causes a slight increase in loading compared to a normal tone control. But that isn't a serious problem.

Using a linear rather than a log taper makes the bypass function a little less position sensitive. Having a center detent on that linear pot might be a nice touch as well. However the circuit will still function reasonably well with a log taper.

In addition, the 'tone' cap and 'bypass' cap are separate. So you could use different values for each, if desired.

[JohnH]

pete12345 said:

One of the settings I currently use is N*B, with the neck tone turned down. Most designs with a single tone control lose that ability, though this one looks like it would retain it.

Yes, exactly that. You dont really have to worry about whether you are at 8 or 10, both are definately clear series type sounds, just with a different flavour where the 10 sound is a bit brighter - so just set it where it sound best.

If you do it with a 500k pot, with single coils, there is plenty of resistance to avoid significant loading issues in that upper range. Also, another observation on my version of it. i have a similar thing with a 500k linear pot (Strat dual sound design), and I find that there, it is between 8 and 10 that the audible brightening occurs. With a log pot, its even more sudden. ie, perceptably the changes happen quicker than you would estimate from theory.

A similar tone system on my LP, controlling two 4k coils on 8k humbuckers and 500k log pots, and the changes happen very quickly, its either bypassed on full HB between 10 and about 9.5.

John