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Post by David Mitchell on Apr 3, 2023 8:58:08 GMT -5
Another possibly silly idea as I keep musing over my options for my HH guitar (while I can't seem to find time to actually sit down and fully work out or wire anything):
Since I've been advised that an MN blender doesn't give good control over the near-middle positions which I might want to play with, what about a regular (?) pot used as a blend control, but rather than it only blending in one pickup, it reverses with the pickup selector? I.e., if I'm on the neck pickup, it's blending in the bridge pickup, and on the bridge pickup, it's blending in the neck pickup. I might be looking at it wrong, but it seems like a DP3T DPDT on-on-on switch for pickup selection would make it possible (I think regular toggle selectors are DP3T, but not all the terminals are exposed?). I realize that if I'm in the neck position and have, say, 20% bridge mixed in, then switch over to bridge position, it would have 20% neck mixed in, but at least until I try it, I don't feel it's a deal-breaker.
Also, are there additional complications if I want to include global series/parallel switching as well?
I'm probably reinventing the wheel with something that's already been done on Strats, but I did a lot of searching around here yesterday and didn't find anything directly applicable, at least for my level of understanding!
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tubejockey
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Post by tubejockey on Apr 30, 2023 1:40:27 GMT -5
You can find DPDT switches in most form factors these days, so I don't know why this wouldn't work. This uses a 2-position selector switch and blends in the opposite pickup.  |
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Post by gckelloch on Apr 30, 2023 3:39:30 GMT -5
Another possibly silly idea as I keep musing over my options for my HH guitar (while I can't seem to find time to actually sit down and fully work out or wire anything): Since I've been advised that an MN blender doesn't give good control over the near-middle positions which I might want to play with, what about a regular (?) pot used as a blend control, but rather than it only blending in one pickup, it reverses with the pickup selector? I.e., if I'm on the neck pickup, it's blending in the bridge pickup, and on the bridge pickup, it's blending in the neck pickup. I might be looking at it wrong, but it seems like a DP3T DPDT on-on-on switch for pickup selection would make it possible (I think regular toggle selectors are DP3T, but not all the terminals are exposed?). I realize that if I'm in the neck position and have, say, 20% bridge mixed in, then switch over to bridge position, it would have 20% neck mixed in, but at least until I try it, I don't feel it's a deal-breaker. Also, are there additional complications if I want to include global series/parallel switching as well? I'm probably reinventing the wheel with something that's already been done on Strats, but I did a lot of searching around here yesterday and didn't find anything directly applicable, at least for my level of understanding! I discovered the same issue with a Bourns MN blend pot. An audio taper pot is much more useful. I have wired such a pickup blend switch on a 3-pickup guitar with an A250k pot and a super switch, but you can do that with a standard Fender style 3-way toggle and a DPDP switch: -Just wire the + pickup leads directly to one set of the 1 & 3 lugs on the 3-way toggle, and ground the - leads as usual. -Run a wire from one of the center pos 3-way lugs to one of the center DPDT lugs. -Run the blend pot between that same 3-way center lug to the other DPDT center lug. -Run two diagonal wires across the outer DPDT lugs. -Connect one each of the 1 & 3 pos 3-way lugs to the top or bottom lugs of the DPDT. You are then free to wire tone knobs (or caps to one or more tone knobs), or whatever else to whichever of the other set of lugs for whichever pos's on the 3-way you want. Kaish makes a 3-way Super Switch to allow more possibilities. Series/parallel would require another DPDT or possibly a 4-way SS, but I wouldn't bother with that. A 1~3nF cap on a tone knob offers that type of sound with many more useful variations from below ~7 on the knob. I no longer use any typical high cap values on my tone knobs. Anyway, that's what I'll do when I rewire the two pickup guitar I just assembled. I'd also recommend adding a phase reverse switch to one of the pickups, as I have done on my blend wirings. It offers better blend clarity and OoP variations closer to full blend, but the pickup in question will require a separate chassis ground. You might also experiment with a low value cap across the outer blend pot lugs, as I did on my 3-pickup guitar. 1~3nF is generally good, depending on the pickup inductance. You can get subtle "sweetened" mid-dip variations with more or less control sensitivity depending on which outer lug you attach the input wire from the DPDT. |
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Post by reTrEaD on Apr 30, 2023 5:16:51 GMT -5
Kaish makes a 3-way Super Switch Ooooh, nice! I wasn't aware that a 4P3T lever switch even existed. After a google search finding this, I can see it's not a double wafer. It has all twelve terminals on a single wafer so there won't be any clearance issues inside a standard tele cavity. I'll tag newey as I'm sure he'll be interested in that switch. |
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Post by gckelloch on Apr 30, 2023 7:07:59 GMT -5
Kaish makes a 3-way Super Switch Ooooh, nice! I wasn't aware that a 4P3T lever switch even existed. After a google search finding this, I can see it's not a double wafer. It has all twelve terminals on a single wafer so there won't be any clearance issues inside a standard tele cavity. I'll tag newey as I'm sure he'll be interested in that switch. I have one coming within a few weeks. Looks like the same construction as a Fender/Oaks Grisby. My Fender 5-way SS is a little uncertain at 2 & 4, but a 3-way may not have that issue. The Kaish 3-way switch I have with the metal cover is a little tight, but very decisive. I guess the dual lugs for each pos can be cut/split to allow discrete tone knob options per pos. It's somewhat limited otherwise. I'll try that b4 swapping to the 3-way SS because I like feel of it. |
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Post by reTrEaD on Apr 30, 2023 8:48:35 GMT -5
Looks like the same construction as a Fender/Oaks Grisby. I agree. It looks like the same detent mechanism. Not a fan of that or the CRL. Much prefer the MegaSwitch. I wonder if the other Kaish switch you have is similar to that. |
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Post by stevewf on Apr 30, 2023 10:11:26 GMT -5
Kaish makes a 3-way Super Switch Ooooh, nice! I wasn't aware that a 4P3T lever switch even existed. After a google search finding this, I can see it's not a double wafer. It has all twelve terminals on a single wafer so there won't be any clearance issues inside a standard tele cavity. I'll tag newey as I'm sure he'll be interested in that switch. I wonder if it's better than the one at guitarelectronics. I've gotten three from there, and all of them have exhibited some looseness in the spindle, meaning extra unwanted wiggle. The one in reTrEaD's link offers a choice of tip colors too, though a) they cost a touch more and b) they might take longer to arrive, at least to the US. |
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Post by stevewf on Apr 30, 2023 10:17:40 GMT -5
You can find DPDT switches in most form factors these days, so I don't know why this wouldn't work. This uses a 2-position selector switch and blends in the opposite pickup. That looks to me to be a solution for a parallel-only setup. The pot would have to be wired differently for a series setup, which would require more poles in a series/parallel switch... but the number of poles might be reduced if a 2-gang pot is used (one wafer for parallel, the other for series). Also, it might be better to wire the tone control "upstream" from the volume control. I've read in this forum many times that it makes the tone/volume duo more predictable. |
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Post by gckelloch on Apr 30, 2023 12:37:43 GMT -5
Looks like the same construction as a Fender/Oaks Grisby. I agree. It looks like the same detent mechanism. Not a fan of that or the CRL. Much prefer the MegaSwitch. I wonder if the other Kaish switch you have is similar to that. It's closed up in the guitar right now, but I suspect it has a ball-bearing rachet system like the cheap old import switches that may wear out after a while. The unique routing is shown here: rigosgarage.medium.com/kaish-heavy-duty-3-way-switch-diagram-and-instructions-17f934003eccI'd do think the 2 & 3 and 6 & 7 lugs can be split to allow for individual tone knob routings per position with my blend scheme. I won't need the SS if that's the case. |
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Post by JohnH on Apr 30, 2023 16:57:43 GMT -5
I thought about and tried an idea like this on a Strat. Very simple, just wiring two lugs of a pot (centre and one outer lug) between the hot lugs of two pickups. The pot was 'no load' so it cuts off to infinite at one end. It's a 250k log pot because with this idea, most of the blended tones happen at low resistance 0 to 25k, so its best if that's spread across the first half turn
Then, select one pickup on the switching and you get 100% of that, and blend in the other from 0 to 100%. Select the other pickup and they swap. No added switches.
But, for me, it wasn't kept because I wanted to set just one blend from one pickup, and always be able to quickly switch back to 100% of the other PU, rather than finding that to be blended too.
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Post by gckelloch on May 1, 2023 1:01:51 GMT -5
I thought about and tried an idea like this on a Strat. Very simple, just wiring two lugs of a pot (centre and one outer lug) between the hot lugs of two pickups. The pot was 'no load' so it cuts off to infinite at one end. It's a 250k log pot because with this idea, most of the blended tones happen at low resistance 0 to 25k, so its best if that's spread across the first half turn Then, select one pickup on the switching and you get 100% of that, and blend in the other from 0 to 100%. Select the other pickup and they swap. No added switches. But, for me, it wasn't kept because I wanted to set just one blend from one pickup, and always be able to quickly switch back to 100% of the other PU, rather than finding that to be blended too. That's precisely why I outlined a scheme with the blend on only the middle pos on the 3-way. I have no tone knob in that pos on a few guitars. One could even wire a different tone knob on pos 1 & 3 with different cap values from the spare lugs to each knob if desired. Let's face it, Push/Pull knob switches are slow, and Push/Push pots are unreliable. Nearly half I've installed were defective in some way. Two mini DPDT's could be positioned so they can be switched at the same time with two fingers. |
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Post by David Mitchell on May 2, 2023 10:07:00 GMT -5
Wow, this thread blew up all of a sudden! Thanks for your suggestions, tubejockey, gckelloch, stevewf, and JohnH. (Of course you've already tried it, JohnH — almost every idea I've had I've found you've thought of too!  ) I started looking for the toggle switch that would be necessary (I don't have a blade switch) and suddenly it didn't seem like such a good idea. I did find a couple of candidates on Mouser, but they are expensive, and I don't know how they would feel for guitar use. It might make more sense to just go for one of the Freeway six-way switches. I'm still undecided about what approach I want to take, but I plan to start with something pretty basic and then experiment with adding on features until I find the right mix.... |
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