Need help wiring a quad humbucker guitar..

[xhrist]

Ok this is what I have so far, will this work? Also if possible, is there a way to get the two "groups" into series parallel with each other before the final 3-way toggle?

[newey]

xhrist-

Hello and Welcome to G-Nutz2!

Where did you find that diagram? I'm curious because it'll work but it's wonky, and there's a better way.

The issue applies to both pairs of HBs since both pairs are wired the same way. First off, let's define "switch up" as meaning when the upper lugs of each switch are connected to the center (common) lug as shown on the diagram, and "switch down" to be the opposite. Which direction the switches are oriented IRL may be different than the diagram, but we're just dealing with the diagram here.

The issue is that, with the series/parallel switch "up", you will only have the series connection of both HBs when their respective selector switch is in the "up" position. If the selector switch is down, you'll have one HB by itself (the upper one of each pair as shown on the diagram). So, it will work but would require manipulating 2 switches, potentially, to get the series setting. This issue is fixable, you need to have the series/parallel switches override the selectors, so that flipping to the series setting gives you both HBs in series regardless of which way that selector switch is set.

So, if you use the diagram "as is", it will work but the switching will have that issue. If that's not a deal-breaker for you, fine, you can use the diagram as is. If you'd prefer to have the series/p[arallel switch override the selector, we can help you to do so.

Also if possible, is there a way to get the two "groups" into series parallel with each other before the final 3-way toggle?

We'd have to take a look at that, but it will definitely require more switching. I suspect a 4-pole switch would be required at a minimum. These are available, but they are sizeable and you will already have a cavity that's pretty full with 7 switches as it is, not sure you'll be able to cram more switching in there.

[xhrist]

I made that diagram, that's why, lol. It was as far as I could get myself, first time attempt at creating my own wiring. Yeah I can route out however much it takes, I'm open to any and all suggestions. It's a pair of Seth Lovers, a JB Junior, and a Little 59'. From the neck, it's HSHS with the JB junior closest to the bridge.

[xhrist]

Just to clarify, are you saying when the respective 3 way toggle switch is "up", and the series/parallel mini toggle dpdt is down that I'll only get the one pickup, so I need the 3 way toggle in the center to use the series mini toggle? Because that I pretty much assumed. I'm very curious to see the better way though, because I drove myself crazy even keeping this much in my head, lol. And to think I was originally going to try in phase/out of phase variations along with the rest.. I pretty much gave up on that one.

[sumgai]

xhrist,


First, to The NutzHouse!


Second, you've over-thought how to achieve your goal, and needlessly complicated it - that resulted in something that I'm sure you won't want to take on stage. As newey explained, you will benefit from instituting a "series-override" setup. By that we mean, selecting series from a (single) switch will override whatever position the pickup selector is set to at the moment. Here's a diagram showing how to go from parallel to series-override:

Now in your case, you have four pickups. Since you're not doing coil-splits, you can safely replace the humbucker design of two coils with just a single coil representation of your pickup... just like in the diagram above. (BTW, that image comes from a post by reTrEaD, back in 2018.)  If you apply this arrangement to each pair of pickups, then apply it to the overall (final) selector switch, you'll have actually lowered the  number of required switches to just  six.  There should be enough space in your control cavity for that, correct?

If this wasn't clear, then don't hesitate to ask for help. 

HTH





sumgai

[newey]

Just to clarify, are you saying when the respective 3 way toggle switch is "up", and the series/parallel mini toggle dpdt is down that I'll only get the one pickup, so I need the 3 way toggle in the center to use the series mini toggle?

Yeah, that probably needs clarification since I didn't mention the center switch position on the pickup slelectors.

For either pair of HBs, with the series/parallel switch "down" (series setting), the 3-way pickup selector will give you the following:

1) Selector switch "up"= Lower HB in series with upper HB
2) Selector switch in center = Lower HB in series with upper HB, with the series pair in parallel with the lower HB
3) Selector switcch "down" = Upper HB only

I don't know what that center combo would sound like since the pickups are dissimilar. It probably would not be mucjh different from both HBs in series, but I could be wrong on that.

Here's the skinny on how to do this via overriding the 3-way switches. A lot of the discussion therein has to do with the "Jimmy Page mod" which doesn't apply to your build, but the basics are the same.

guitarnuts2.proboards.com/thread/8215/global-series-switch-guitarnutz-proper

EDIT: sumgai beat me to the link to this. But if you have trouble digesting schematics, there is a wiring diagram further down in that thread.

[xhrist]

Yeah space won't be an issue, I'll already have to route for the extra single coil humbuckers anyway. It sounds like what I need to do, thanks a ton!

Also thanks newey, I see the diagram you're talking about, so basically put the coil splits before it and the selectors after it if I'm understanding this correctly?

[sumgai]

xhrist,


Yes, you are correct - put any coil-split switching before any pickup selection, individual pickup or some combination. In fact, the same goes for any phasing operation - put that switch arrangement before the pickup selector. And here I'm staying on-topic - I mean for you to include the series override switch as part of the pickup selector section.

Simple diagram:

pickup -> coil-split -> phase -> selector -> Master Vol/Tone controls -> output jack.

Where individual controls for each pickup are desired, use this one instead:

pickup -> coil-split -> phase -> Individual Vol/Tone controls -> selector -> output jack.

But for that latter arrangement, do pay attention to the discussion in the link provided by newey. We (the Nuts in the House) have been hashing this out for a long time, for various posters and discussions. The provided link sums up the whole ball of wax and simplifies it very nicely. But as usual, questions are free, no points will be deducted for asking for help.

HTH





sumgai

[ashcatlt]

I know we're past this point, but...

Jan 10, 2024 12:42:08 GMT -5 newey said:

2) Selector switch in center = Lower HB in series with upper HB, with the series pair in parallel with the lower HB

That's just shorting the top of the stack. Both ends of that upper pickup are connected together. You'll hear the lower by itself.

[xhrist]

I've been looking into a Freeway 6 position Toggle swich, using the three humbucker mode with on/off/on dpdt switches for coil splits inner and outer and humbucker mode before it. Then putting the the two middle humbuckers in a normal 3-way toggle before it gets to the freeway switch. I'm thinking to just forget about the series/parallel options, it's making it way too difficult.. I'll draw up a diagram in a bit, still thinking my way through it. Been working on the aluminum full body pickguard in the meantime. I went with 1/8", it's thick but looks awesome!



monkey emoticons

[newey]

xhrist-

Not clear on what exactly the Freeway switch is going to be doing here, since you mentioned other switches for the coil splits and another toggle for the two middle pickups. It's probably best if you draw up what we call a "truth table"- i.e., a chart showing all the different switch combos you want.

I built a 4-pickup Strat with a pair of Fender Vintage '57s and a pair of Vintage '62s. One pair was in the first and third positions, the second pair at 2 and 4. So, with your layout, you'd be combining like with like- the two single-coil sized HBs are switched together and the 2 PAF-style ones are the other pair. Then the two pairs get combined. Just a thought.