Superswitch diagram question

[cdrick]

Hi, first time poster, from The Gear Page, but figured maybe more answers here. I’m having trouble seeing how positions 2 and 4 ground out the north coils in this diagram. I see the ground on position 3 in the upper right pole but I don’t think it’s electrically connected to positions 2 or 4 of that blade. What am I missing? 

guitarelectronics.com/2-humbuckers-5-way-lever-switch-1-volume-1-tone-00/

[reTrEaD]

Mar 12, 2024 15:08:15 GMT -5 cdrick said:

Hi, first time poster, from The Gear Page, but figured maybe more answers here.

Hello cdrick . Welcome to GN2. The Gear Page is a busier forum, so you're likely to get more answers there. But not likely to get better answers than you'll get here.

Mar 12, 2024 15:08:15 GMT -5 cdrick said:

I’m having trouble seeing how positions 2 and 4 ground out the north coils in this diagram. I see the ground on position 3 in the upper right pole but I don’t think it’s electrically connected to positions 2 or 4 of that blade. What am I missing? 

guitarelectronics.com/2-humbuckers-5-way-lever-switch-1-volume-1-tone-00/

The North coils of the HBs are never shorted to ground. They're bypassed when the hot of the North coil and the series link are both connected to the CW lug of the Volume controls.

In the case of the Neck HB, the series link is connected to the CW lug of the Volume control in position 4, via the upper right section of the superswitch.

In the case of the Bridge HB, the series link is connected to the CW lug of the Volume control in position 2, via the lower right section of the superswitch.


It works, but we try to avoid shunting coils or having unused coils hanging from hot.  And it clearly is avoidable in a scheme this simple.  Imho, this diagram is lame.

[cdrick]

Cool, thanks reTrEaD for having a look. I have a lot to learn, this helps!

[reTrEaD]

You're welcome!

Mar 12, 2024 18:40:29 GMT -5 cdrick said:

Cool, thanks reTrEaD for having a look. I have a lot to learn, this helps!

If you're interesting in learning something from this particular scheme, I'd be willing to present a very good structure as a starting point, then you could complete the drawing. Are you interested?

[cdrick]

Mar 12, 2024 20:16:24 GMT -5 reTrEaD said:

You're welcome!

Mar 12, 2024 18:40:29 GMT -5 cdrick said:

Cool, thanks reTrEaD for having a look. I have a lot to learn, this helps!

If you're interesting in learning something from this particular scheme, I'd be willing to present a very good structure as a starting point, then you could complete the drawing. Are you interested?

Heck yeah, that’d be great!

[reTrEaD]

Here's the structure:



You'll notice the South Starts are both connected to ground.

The North Finishes are each connected to a common of the superswitch. That allows for a series link (connect to the South Finish), or a connection to ground. Whatever is needed in any particular position of the switch. (I already drew in the Neck North Finish to ground connection, needed in position 3.)

The other two commons of the superswitch are both connected to hot (the CW lug of the volume control) that allows for up to two parallel paths.

Complete the connections to get the original pickup selections specified in the upper right corner of the image. I'll check your work.



After we put this one to rest, I'll tell you all the possible goodness you can extract from the basic structure.

[cdrick]

Cool, I’ll work on this in the AM. It looks like there’s editing software on this site that I can utilize?

[stevewf]

Mar 12, 2024 22:34:38 GMT -5 cdrick said:

Cool, I’ll work on this in the AM. It looks like there’s editing software on this site that I can utilize?

Here's how I've used a reTrEaD drawing like that one.

It's very low-tech:

Print out the structure drawing.

Get a transparent covering for it, like a piece of plexiglass or a plastic sleeve for documents; plus, get a dry-erase pen, and something for erasing it.

Lay the transparency over the printout. Maybe tape the two together to prevent slippage while drawing. Then start drawing lines where wires would go. Small mistake? Or time to start over? Dry-erase to the rescue!

Once I've got a schematic that I think works, I check it by mentally doing a position-by-position "run-through", making a crude summary line-style drawing of what coils and switches are in the signal path for each switch position. (Then I ask the GuitarNuts2 forum for a double-check).

[cdrick]

Alright reTrEaD I’m almost certain this isn’t correct but here’s what I came up with:

[cdrick]

Mar 12, 2024 22:53:15 GMT -5 stevewf said:

Mar 12, 2024 22:34:38 GMT -5 cdrick said:

Cool, I’ll work on this in the AM. It looks like there’s editing software on this site that I can utilize?

Here's how I've used a reTrEaD drawing like that one.

It's very low-tech:

Print out the structure drawing.

Get a transparent covering for it, like a piece of plexiglass or a plastic sleeve for documents; plus, get a dry-erase pen, and something for erasing it.

Lay the transparency over the printout. Maybe tape the two together to prevent slippage while drawing. Then start drawing lines where wires would go. Small mistake? Or time to start over? Dry-erase to the rescue!

Once I've got a schematic that I think works, I check it by mentally doing a position-by-position "run-through", making a crude summary line-style drawing of what coils and switches are in the signal path for each switch position. (Then I ask the GuitarNuts2 forum for a double-check).

I ended up using my photo editor on my iPad. I like your method, but don’t have those supplies atm. In any case you guys will see I’m a novice at the wiring. Here to learn

[reTrEaD]

Mar 13, 2024 0:15:29 GMT -5 cdrick said:

Alright reTrEaD I’m almost certain this isn’t correct but here’s what I came up with

You did reasonably well.
The good news is, you have all the connections necessary to achieve the combinations on the list. The bad news: You have two extraneous connections that are unnecessary and connect unused coils to hot. I've edited your drawing and chopped up the extraneous connections so you can see where they are.

---

---

Tons of goodness possible.
If you start with the structure I originally gave you (without the ground connection in position 3), you can wire that to achieve any FIVE of the long list of possibilities below, with no shunting of coils and no unused coils hanging from hot.


8 Hum-canceling two-coil combinations:

Neck HB (coils in series)
Neck HB (coils in parallel)
Neck North in parallel with Bridge South
Neck North in series with Bridge South
Neck South in parallel with Bridge North
Neck South in series with Bridge North
Bridge HB (coils in series)
Bridge HB (coils in parallel)

8 Three-coil combinations:

Neck North in parallel with [Bridge HB (coils in series)]
Neck North in series with [Bridge HB (coils in series)]
Neck South in parallel with [Bridge HB (coils in series)]
Neck South in series with [Bridge HB (coils in series)]
Bridge North in parallel with [Neck HB (coils in series)]
Bridge North in series with [Neck HB (coils in series)]
Bridge South in parallel with [Neck HB (coils in series)]
Bridge South in series with [Neck HB (coils in series)]

1 Hum-canceling four-coil combinations:

[Neck HB (coils in series)] in parallel with [Bridge HB (coils in series)

4 singles:

Neck North
Neck South
Bridge North
Bridge South

I've indicated my personal choice (in bold) for the five I would choose but your tastes might lead you to a different five.

[cdrick]

Good deal, thanks reTrEaD
in retrospect, despite my influenza and Niquil stupor last night, I can see why those two connections from the hot are not needed. Glad I was able to get a basic diagram down. I haven’t decided exactly what I’m going to do with the guitar I’m working on yet. I’ve incoming SD pickups and have a few ideas of sounds I do want (bridge series, bridge (S) + Neck (N), neck (S)). Not sure what else I’ll do but will check some sound clips and see what sticks. I almost never (or maybe never) use the neck HB series. And if I need that I have other guitars to do that.

[reTrEaD]

Mar 13, 2024 11:19:44 GMT -5 cdrick said:

Good deal, thanks reTrEaD
in retrospect, despite my influenza and Niquil stupor last night, I can see why those two connections from the hot are not needed. Glad I was able to get a basic diagram down.

You're welcome. And thanks for participating in this skill-building exercise.

Mar 13, 2024 11:19:44 GMT -5 cdrick said:

I haven’t decided exactly what I’m going to do with the guitar I’m working on yet. I’ve incoming SD pickups and have a few ideas of sounds I do want (bridge series, bridge (S) + Neck (N), neck (S)). Not sure what else I’ll do but will check some sound clips and see what sticks. I almost never (or maybe never) use the neck HB series. And if I need that I have other guitars to do that.

Whenever you do narrow your choices down to five, feel free to post the circuit you plan to use and one of us can put eyes on it, to verify you'll get what you are aiming for.

One other suggestion I'll offer is to consider rotating your Neck pickup 180 degrees such that the slug coil (North) is closest to the Neck.  By doing that, you could have two very different sounding hum-canceling parallel pairs. Inners (Neck South in parallel with Bridge North) and Outers (Neck North in parallel with Bridge South)


Another thought would be to add a push-pull pot which would allow you to switch between series and parallel mode. That would result in a maximum of 10 different combinations. Guitar Wiring Design Tutorial: Strat-o-Various Project pt3 (the no-load pot and capacitor are optional - not required)

However you might prefer to keep things simple, skip the push-pull, and just have 5 selections.

[cdrick]

Sounds good reTrEaD. I’ll check back in soon with a plan. I haven’t decided if I can deal with the complexity of a push-pull pot, though I do have one I could use. It certainly would be good to have more options!