feedback when cranked recently replaced pic ups

[steve07]

I have an old mint les paul custom copy. I decided to take it in to have the pots replaced and the neck pic up replaced with a new relativly inexpensive oe look alike and a dimarzio I bought used off ebay on the bridge.
At normal volume levels everything sounds fine.
When my son gets his hands on it running it at 3/4 volume through a 150 watt line 6 amp with distortion mode added it's not playable due to the feedback.
Both pickups cause feedback. Backing the volume off to 1/2 on the amp still didn't help much.
I'm not interested in "potting". I'd like to just replaace the pair
with 2 gold tone pickups that won't give me or my son feedback at high gain levels. At the same time not having to pay an arm and leg. I've had the guitar for 35 years it was made by el degas
when it was in for the work they told me it had original gibson bridge and parts and wanted to make a deal with me to replace them for non oe for free if they get to keep the parts I said no.
So I need 2 gold pickups that won't cause feedback at high power. thanks in advance..

[newey]

Steve07-

Hello and Welcome!

First off, I assume that you've tried "running it at 3/4 volume through a 150 watt line 6 amp with distortion mode added" with other guitars w/o noticing excessive feedback?

I need 2 gold pickups that won't cause feedback at high power.

Unless the HBs have been wax potted into the cover (many are), you can just buy gold-plated HB covers, and fit them to pretty much any bare-coiled HB you like. If you found chrome ones you liked, you can swap the covers for gold ones, again, assuming there's no wax in there.

Another (probably obvious) thing to check is the pickup height. Have you tried adjusting that down a tad?

As far as choosing new pickups, the possibilities are many. What goal did you have in mind by switching the pickups in the first place? Were you, or your son, looking for a higher-gain sound?

[ashcatlt]

I don't have a specific pickup suggestion, though GuitarFetish has great cheap pickups. I haven't tried their full-sized HBs, though.

I do want to clarify exactly what you mean by feedback. Some folks use the word to mean any unwanted sound they hear, and quite often are referring to what I might call buzz or hiss, or noise in general.

Even then, there are a couple different forms of feedback to which electric guitars can be susceptible.

There's the feedback I love and want as much of as I can get, which is resonant string feedback caused when sheer volume causes the strings to vibrate sympathetically. newey's suggestion of lowering the pickups might reduce this tendency, but why would you want to?

I get the idea, though, that you are talking about the microphonic variety. This is where some part of the pickup itself is vibrating sympathetically, and is that high-pitched squealing like when your vocalist forgets where his monitors are. I like this type too, for certain applications. There's nothing that says LOUD quite like a high pitched squeal during the rests. Unless it's a snare rattling like it's about to fall apart... This can be remedied by potting (which you've said you don't want to try) or replacement. Or you could turn down the gain, but why would you want to?

[JohnH]

Ok, so hes a son and therefore needs ultra high gain, like most peoples sons. Until they have sons of there own!

If its the squealing kind of feedback, if he reduces the gain somewhat, he can actually have even more volume before feedback gets out of control!.

[steve07]

Mar 28, 2009 13:20:26 GMT -5 newey said:

Steve07-

Hello and Welcome!

First off, I assume that you've tried "running it at 3/4 volume through a 150 watt line 6 amp with distortion mode added" with other guitars w/o noticing excessive feedback?
::
Yes his Fender Squire works fine with no noise.

I need 2 gold pickups that won't cause feedback at high power.

Unless the HBs have been wax potted into the cover (many are), you can just buy gold-plated HB covers, and fit them to pretty much any bare-coiled HB you like. If you found chrome ones you liked, you can swap the covers for gold ones, again, assuming there's no wax in there.

Another (probably obvious) thing to check is the pickup height. Have you tried adjusting that down a tad?::Tryed lowering them a tad no diff.

As far as choosing new pickups, the possibilities are many. What goal did you have in mind by switching the pickups in the first place? Were you, or your son, looking for a higher-gain sound?

: I'd like to get pickups that would suit blues for me and whatever my son bangs out at high gain. That's why I got the dimarzio on the bridge. Clean stock sound is nice and effects can be added on top that is my thinking just as in recording..keep it clean and add the effects after the track is laid....thanks for your response!..

[steve07]

Mar 28, 2009 14:23:32 GMT -5 JohnH said:

Ok, so hes a son and therefore needs ultra high gain, like most peoples sons. Until they have sons of there own!

If its the squealing kind of feedback, if he reduces the gain somewhat, he can actually have even more volume before feedback gets out of control!.

I hear what you are saying...however lowering the gain still resulted in feedback mainly on the low bass notes.
Obviously the pickups I have are junk.

[steve07]

Mar 28, 2009 13:54:44 GMT -5 ashcatlt said:

I don't have a specific pickup suggestion, though GuitarFetish has great cheap pickups. I haven't tried their full-sized HBs, though.

I do want to clarify exactly what you mean by feedback. Some folks use the word to mean any unwanted sound they hear, and quite often are referring to what I might call buzz or hiss, or noise in general.

Even then, there are a couple different forms of feedback to which electric guitars can be susceptible.

There's the feedback I love and want as much of as I can get, which is resonant string feedback caused when sheer volume causes the strings to vibrate sympathetically. newey's suggestion of lowering the pickups might reduce this tendency, but why would you want to?

I get the idea, though, that you are talking about the microphonic variety. This is where some part of the pickup itself is vibrating sympathetically, and is that high-pitched squealing like when your vocalist forgets where his monitors are. I like this type too, for certain applications. There's nothing that says LOUD quite like a high pitched squeal during the rests. Unless it's a snare rattling like it's about to fall apart... This can be remedied by potting (which you've said you don't want to try) or replacement. Or you could turn down the gain, but why would you want to?

He plays alternative metal....its nothing i've ever been part of.
If his fender squire can take the gain then my 35 year old should
with proper pick ups. Again even with the gain down a tad the bass notes cause feedback. I looked over the potting link on this site and may consider it. Or I see burst buckers on ebay all the time...I would assume they would be potted already from the manufacturer??? thanks for the reply...

[steve07]

Hi Guys, Ok since I'm doing some refinishing on the feedback guitar I took a closer look at the pickups by removing them but not unwiring them. The neck pickup is typical gold coloured les paul style very new and full of wax. This puppy has been potted from the asian manufacturer.??

Now the dimarzio on the bridge is just 2 black coils for lack of better words no cover and some wax. But what I found out of the ordinary was when mounted you can see right into the pickup cavity(hollow space) on either side of the pickup.? Wouldn't this tend to attract feedback since the sound can get in behind?
Then could it be possible that this pickup is wired in a way that when in the bridge position its full on and when switched to the neck position its somewhat on?...I no it's either on or off...I'm just trying to come up with a diagnosis and cure.
I do know the feedback was there regardless of pickup/switch position....Suggestions, opinions....

I saw a pair of vacume potted epiphone picups on ebay from china for $28 I paid $75 for the bridge pickup a dimarzio dp90
I wanted something with some sustain and sensitivity...too much obviously. But money isn't the real issue...Getting stable sound on low and high gain without feedback and I'm a happy camper. When I'm long gone I want it to perform for my son...and his son.
cheers, Steve.

[newey]

But what I found out of the ordinary was when mounted you can see right into the pickup cavity(hollow space) on either side of the pickup.? Wouldn't this tend to attract feedback since the sound can get in behind?

This is not uncommon, and I doubt the openings are large enough to be a feedback producer. But it's simple enough to test, just use some of that low-stick painter's tape to cover the gaps around the pickup. If the feedback goes away, that's your problem.

I would predict, however, that this won't solve the problem.

[ashcatlt]

I'd still like for you to answer my question. Your statement that the bass notes cause feedback just helps to reinforce my idea that it is resonant string feedback we're talking about.

Is this feedback happening while he's playing (say, holding a note or chord), or when he's not playing? Does it happen when all the strings are muted?

[steve07]

The feedback occurs when he stops playing even for a second.
I was able to speak to a guitar tech who when I described the problems said it would be not unusual for hot pickups to act that way under those conditions. Also mentioned my sons fender
that does not feedback at the same levels doesn't have as hot pick ups as the gibson also mentioned single coil verses the dual coil humbuckers. Anyway it has come down to either toning down the levels or using less hot pickups.

[D2o]

Hi Steve,

I was looking at Harmony-Central user reviews to see if I could find any possible culprit, and came across a number of glowing reviews as well as a number of people pointing to the pickups as the culprit. Some of them have indicated their solutions as well.

H-C user reviews are just that - user reviews, and should be taken with a grain of salt.

Nevertheless, it may be worth sifting through the reviews, such as this (I know, I know ... the links are broken):

Repaired link 1. (thank you, Chris)

In which the reviewers say (in part):

The original sound is just awfull and the bridge piece belongs in the garbage. The original pickups will pick all the noise around.
Luckily I found a used dual humbucker from DiMarzio and put it at the bridge. Bingo! No more hum. It pulls a lot on the strings, even with a low setting. Sustain is weak due to the softness of the wood. I also tried a couple of bridges until I put in an Ibanez with tunable saddles. Without those two don't bother, it's useless.
This is a definite rythm guitar, not a gear for a front man.
With a good distorsion pedal it gives you the perfect sound to play Judas Priest or AC/DC, but not suited for blues licks or rich solos.

... and ...

For ANY type of music it sucked equally. The knock-off
P-90's sounded nasal, muddy and attracted so much 60-cycle hum ... uuuuuugly!

and some of the reviewers here:

Repaired link 2. - danke, Chris

say:

I replaced the bridge pickup a few years back with a DiMarzio PAF and that made a big difference. I left the neck single coil in place and now they are out of phase so the middle selection sounds really nice and wispy for a rock axe. It's different enough that I don't feel like getting a humbucker for the neck.

... and ...

I have a Seymour Duncan for the fuzz, and a Gibson Humbucker for the clean.

... and ...

Pickups were some gold sealed units which were tossed (I've actually kept them) in favour of Duncans' JB models

...and ...

2 single coil pickups in humbucker sized cases (replaced the bridge pickup with a DiMarzio PAF and it now sounds excellent)

and the reviewers here:

Repaired link 3. - gracias, Chris

say:

Dual humbuckers ( have removed the neck pickup and replaced it with a Seymour Duncan _George Lynch screamin demon.

... and ...

lt has 2 Humbuckers in it with a coil tap. Now l did buy this used, but it has Dimarzios in it.

... and ...

The humbuckers on mine are pretty much garbage,

So that may give you a couple of ideas which, interestingly, include multiple mentions of the DiMarzio name that you say is aiding and abetting the problem ... weird!

Good luck!

D2o

(thanks again for fixing the links, ChrisK)