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chesnut
Oct 18, 2009 12:51:21 GMT -5
Post by simes on Oct 18, 2009 12:51:21 GMT -5
Hello.
A friend of mine has just come by an old piece of chesnut of sufficient size to make several Strat or Tele-style bodies.
Does anyone have any experience of this wood for guitar making?
The thickness of the piece after sanding is just 40mm. We are currently pondering whether this will be enough to accommodate the neck assembly, or whether we will have to add laminates.
Cheers,
Simes
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chesnut
Oct 18, 2009 19:34:28 GMT -5
Post by ijustwannastrat on Oct 18, 2009 19:34:28 GMT -5
4cm body, that's pretty thin, going off the top of my head.... But I would think it's do-able.
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chesnut
Oct 19, 2009 12:10:18 GMT -5
Post by cynical1 on Oct 19, 2009 12:10:18 GMT -5
40 cm translates to just over 1.5"... a little thin for a guitar. Most guitars and basses come in at around 1.75" thickness, or 44.5 cm.
It's probably doable unless you have a real thick neck to install. Pickup routings must be precise on a body this then...unless you're looking to install a skylight...
Unless this is a Southern Chestnut (Tiete) then it's going to be relatively soft. If it is Southern Chestnut (Tiete) it's going to be harder then oak and hard on your tooling.
Since chestnut is almost non-existent here in the States it would make for a nice top. I'd consider finding either a top or bottom to thicken the body. You could also consider some semi-hollow chamber routing in the chestnut and use your top or bottom cap to seal it.
Either way, a chestnut guitar is a rarity. Remember to post some pics when you get it done.
Happy Trails
Cynical One
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chesnut
Oct 20, 2009 13:02:16 GMT -5
Post by simes on Oct 20, 2009 13:02:16 GMT -5
I imagine it's European chestnut, as chestnut trees are very common here in Spain.
My friend is intending to use part of the wood to make a Strat body to replace the plywood one on a cheap copy he has.
I was thinking of a 2HB rear-routed Tele for myself with some kind of top or back to make it thicker. However, I would have to buy the neck, PU's and other hardware, which would bring the cost up to that of one of those GFS thinline LP things that I reviewed over on the Guitars thread. I don't know if it's worth building my own under these circumstances.
Regardless, does anyone have any idea of the tonal qualities of chestnut?
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chesnut
Oct 20, 2009 15:46:11 GMT -5
Post by cynical1 on Oct 20, 2009 15:46:11 GMT -5
Regardless, does anyone have any idea of the tonal qualities of chestnut? Well, without opening the whole "tonewood" can of worms, if this is a Spanish Chestnut, the Janka hardness is harder then pine and just barely softer then alder...actually, it's pretty close to alder... The hardware, the fit and accuracy of the craftsmanship, string, pickups...you know the drill...will have a greater effect on the tone then the chunk of wood. That being said, the tightness of the grain pattern, the age of the wood...etc...will also effect the tone. Let me put it this way, if I was in possession of a prime piece of chestnut I'd be making a guitar out of it. You can always drop a harder wood bottom cap on it...akin to a Les Paul with a mahogany bottom and a maple top... In fact, mahogany and chestnut appear to have about the same ratio between hardness as mahogany and maple... And buying the pickups and components on eBay can save you quite a bit of money provided you're patient. Happy Trails Cynical One
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Post by simes on Jan 4, 2010 6:11:49 GMT -5
Here are a couple of photos of the aforementioned chestnut Strat body, which was entirely handmade apart from having the original board levelled at a lumber yard: www.combat-tkd.com/Juan Strat.jpg[/img] www.combat-tkd.com/Juan Strat 2.jpg[/img] Not visible in these pics is the thinner cap put on the back to bring it up to thickness. A reasonably attractive grain, I think, which will benefit from a slightly reddish or yellowish stain.
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Post by simes on Jan 4, 2010 8:05:37 GMT -5
I forgot to mention, these photos are previous to the body being contoured, which is why the curves of the horns look a bit rough and there are no ... contours.
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chesnut
Jan 4, 2010 10:50:58 GMT -5
Post by cynical1 on Jan 4, 2010 10:50:58 GMT -5
That's a nice chunk of wood you got there, kid. Chestnut is all but extinct in the US. There are few salvage lumber yards you can get it from, but it ain't cheap.
Depending on how you want to finish this body, from what I read chestnut takes stains and dyes very well, so go light with your dye mixtures and you might want to rub your stains sooner then normal. You can always add another coat of stain or dye if you want it darker.
You have a very unique guitar there, young fella. I'm anxious to hear what it sounds like once you've finished it.
Happy Trails
Cynical One
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chesnut
Jan 4, 2010 20:26:31 GMT -5
Post by newey on Jan 4, 2010 20:26:31 GMT -5
The European variety is called the "sweet chestnut". And it is a beautiful piece. You just did. Can't reseal the can after the worms are out . . .or maybe it was horses and barndoors. We've postulated that a double-blind test would yield no clear distinctions that would validate the theories of the Tonewood Set. SO far, this has only been a "thought experiment", like Schrödinger's famous cat. Maybe we should arrange an actual double-blind test. All we need is someone to build 3 or 4 identical guitars, identical except for the body wood. WannaStrat already has a headstart . . .
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chesnut
Jan 5, 2010 12:30:28 GMT -5
Post by simes on Jan 5, 2010 12:30:28 GMT -5
Thanks for the comments, guys. So, do I take it that if the other piece of wood has as nice a figure as this one, you would put a cap on the back rather than the front? Or perhaps do something like this: home-and-garden.webshots.com/album/560772088qjmcxwThe guy made a beautiful chambered chestnut/mahogany/chestnut edgebound Tele, then - in my opinion - ruined it with the strange PU placing and bizarre home-made aluminium bridge (it's all in the footnotes for the individual photos). You can always drop a harder wood bottom cap on it...akin to a Les Paul with a mahogany bottom and a maple top... In fact, mahogany and chestnut appear to have about the same ratio between hardness as mahogany and maple... I don't quite catch your meaning, C1. Do you mean that chestnut + maple would be similar to mahogany + maple, or that mahogany + chestnut would be similar to mahogany + maple? And are you talking about hard (rock) maple or soft (bigleaf) maple? I believe the latter is more common in guitar tops while the former is mainly for necks. I'll take note of the staining suggestions.
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chesnut
Jan 5, 2010 14:34:44 GMT -5
Post by cynical1 on Jan 5, 2010 14:34:44 GMT -5
Yeah, that was a bit cryptic...
The chestnut would be similar to mahogany. A harder wood would be used for a top, if you wanted to go that way...if you wanted to emulate the standard Les Paul design.
If you wanted to leave it as just chestnut you'd be fine. Chambering will require either a top or bottom to it.
Happy Trails
Cynical One
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chesnut
Jan 5, 2010 17:44:50 GMT -5
Post by ijustwannastrat on Jan 5, 2010 17:44:50 GMT -5
WannaStrat already has a headstart . . . Do I now? I would love to make a ton of LP bodies with different materials, but I have a very limited amount of cash. Maybe this would be a great 5 year project....
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chesnut
Jan 5, 2010 18:47:30 GMT -5
Post by newey on Jan 5, 2010 18:47:30 GMT -5
I was just thinking your avatar was 1, wannastrat.
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chesnut
Jan 5, 2010 20:41:08 GMT -5
Post by ijustwannastrat on Jan 5, 2010 20:41:08 GMT -5
Oh. That's actually Alder. I was going for a walnut/chestnut type look. I don't know what went wrong, but all my alder scraps are still that color, and my guitar is now a strange red-ish hue. I still dig it, but I am extremely confused. I did the everything the same.
Sorry of being off topic.
Back to the correct topic, I can't wait to see the finished product!
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Post by simes on Jan 8, 2010 9:53:39 GMT -5
A couple more things that have occurred to me: - I'm unlikely to be able to find maple for a cap, but I think iroko - which is readily available - has a similar hardness and might be a candidate for a bottom cap.
- Chestnut apparently has a similar stiffness to mahogany, which would presumibly make it suitable for necks too. The pieces available are not quartersawn, but I imagine that laminating would do the trick.
Here I'm thinking more along the lines of an LP Special double-cut than a Tele or Strat.
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chesnut
Jan 8, 2010 10:24:52 GMT -5
Post by D2o on Jan 8, 2010 10:24:52 GMT -5
FWIW, there is a discussion called " Cheap and Nasty 'Tonewoods' " here, which you may find interesting - there is mention of Iroko towards the end (middle of page 2). Sumgai had found some info that suggests that Iroco glues well, but needs to be filled prior to finishing. Cheers, D2o
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chesnut
Jan 8, 2010 10:39:46 GMT -5
Post by newey on Jan 8, 2010 10:39:46 GMT -5
Wikipedia on "Chestnut"This may affect what finishing you choose, as well as your choice of hardware. The article also notes: This feature might nix its use for a neck. To get a clear piece for a neck, one would need a bigger, and therefore older, piece to start with.
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chesnut
Jan 8, 2010 13:40:52 GMT -5
Post by simes on Jan 8, 2010 13:40:52 GMT -5
Yeah, it was actually me who brought up iroko on that thread.
Regarding chestnut's tendency to split, I would think that as long as the piece chosen is without splits and is carefully worked, it should be fine. I'll ask a carpenter cousin of mine about that.
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chesnut
Jan 8, 2010 13:49:17 GMT -5
Post by D2o on Jan 8, 2010 13:49:17 GMT -5
Yeah, it was actually me who brought up iroko on that thread. oopsy, sorry about that, simes! D2o
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chesnut
Jan 11, 2010 14:38:42 GMT -5
Post by cynical1 on Jan 11, 2010 14:38:42 GMT -5
Just for Reference...and because I have no idea what access you have to wood species where you are, try this link to Janka Hardness of different species. This way you can find something in a similar hardness rating as maple for your chestnut body. HTC1
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chesnut
Jan 12, 2010 12:20:23 GMT -5
Post by simes on Jan 12, 2010 12:20:23 GMT -5
That's great. Thanks, Cynical1
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chesnut
Jan 25, 2010 5:13:36 GMT -5
Post by simes on Jan 25, 2010 5:13:36 GMT -5
Here's a preliminary photo of the Castañocaster, prior to finishing and final assembly. So that's a handmade European chestnut body, Guitarfetish Strat neck with altered headstock, 2 x Duncan SSL1 and 1 x SSL5, other bits and pieces also from Guitarfetish. It seems we may also have access to some European maple (European sycamore), i.e. acer pseudoplatanus. This is different from the American maples (and has nothing to do with American sycamore). It is apparently quite common as a violin-making wood, and also in the bodies of acoustic guitars. It's softer than rock maple, but I've come across a few references on the net to it being used for necks. Any comments?
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chesnut
Jan 25, 2010 14:08:14 GMT -5
Post by cynical1 on Jan 25, 2010 14:08:14 GMT -5
Maple - European {Acer pseudoplatanus} has a Janka hardness of 1200. You are correct in that this is softer then Rock Maple...but not so's you'd notice.
What were you planning on doing with this hunk of European Maple?
HTC1
BTW: That's one pretty chestnut guitar you got there, laddy...
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chesnut
Jan 25, 2010 14:36:02 GMT -5
Post by simes on Jan 25, 2010 14:36:02 GMT -5
The Strat's not mine, unfortunately.
The friend who built the Strat has some more chestnut and possibly some European maple. The idea I have is to make a kind of doublecut LP Special, using the chestnut for the body (if there's enough of it), and a piece of unidentified hardwood (I think it's probably some kind of oak) for the neck.
Another option is to use the Euro-maple for the body (in which case I'd probably have to chamber it for weight reasons),or for a cap on top of the chestnut or even for the neck if it is stable enough.
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chesnut
Jan 25, 2010 20:37:12 GMT -5
Post by newey on Jan 25, 2010 20:37:12 GMT -5
Simes-
That's a pretty guitar, but could you downsize the photo a bit, please? The width causes it to blow off the side of the monitor, meaning horizontal scrolling is needed to see it all.
TIA-
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chesnut
Jan 26, 2010 4:39:28 GMT -5
Post by simes on Jan 26, 2010 4:39:28 GMT -5
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chesnut
Mar 16, 2010 3:03:59 GMT -5
Post by simes on Mar 16, 2010 3:03:59 GMT -5
The Chestnutcaster is finished and road-tested. It’s lighter than I expected, has good sustain (string-through hardtail) and gives a nice full tone in the neck and in-between positions, plenty of body but very Stratty at the same time. The combination of the wood and the pickups ( 2 x Duncan SSL1 and 1 x SSL3) is quite bright, and sounds a little strident in the middle and bridge positions. The middle position is rarely going to be used, so I’ve suggested to the owner that he change the middle tone to the bridge pickup, which I imagine will tame it a little. The guitar plays well, and seems to prefer clean or slightly overdriven sounds. The finish is French polish, which was very laborious but looks great. You’ll notice in the photos that the front looks darker and redder than the back. This is just my poor photography, as both are similar. The front has a darker stain on one side, absent on the back. This was due to us wisely making the body from the less regularly coloured piece, then building it up to thickness with a beautifully even back.
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chesnut
Mar 16, 2010 7:17:14 GMT -5
Post by cynical1 on Mar 16, 2010 7:17:14 GMT -5
simes -
Yes, Virginia, that's one pretty guitar you've got there.
I've always liked the SSL pickups, and the SSL-1 & SSL3 normally compliment each other well. I agree with you completely on assigning the middle tone control to the bridge pickup.
Very unique looking guitar...and if you blindfolded a dozen tone Nazi's and put them in a room with that guitar none of them could guess the wood used.
+1 for your work, and for taking the time to post back on the finished results.
So, what's the next guitar gonna look like?
Happy Trails
Cynical One
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chesnut
Mar 16, 2010 8:35:10 GMT -5
Post by simes on Mar 16, 2010 8:35:10 GMT -5
Thanks.
Next one will probably be a set-neck model, either an SG or an LPS. Or it could end up being a Tele. We'll see.
Cheers,
Simes
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chesnut
Mar 16, 2010 15:27:58 GMT -5
Post by wolf on Mar 16, 2010 15:27:58 GMT -5
Guess I'm replying very late to this topic but that is one heck of a nice guitar you have built there simes.
And returning to the beginning of this thread, I have an SG (one of the thinnest guitars made) and a caliper. All this time I never measured the darned thing. Well it is 1.36 inches thick (or thin?) which is just a bit thinner than 1 and 3/8 inches.
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