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Post by JFrankParnell on May 21, 2010 11:27:18 GMT -5
Uh, i guess this might go in the lutherizing board...but... [Edit: No, it's fine here, it deals with wiring-mod issues more than chopping up some Tone-Plastic© (copyright Runewalker, 2006).]
Yeah, as i was winding up and tuning my strings for the umpteenth time, I was thinking it would be cool to cut the pickguard in two. Be able to leave the pups' half on the guitar and play with the wiring by unscrewing the other half. Kinda like on a tele, i guess. You could test new wiring without even putting the bottom half back on if youre careful.
Anyone tried this?
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Post by newey on May 21, 2010 20:54:13 GMT -5
In a discussion of Santellan's "circuit board with DIP switches" mod, which is now being marketed, I suggested a hinged section across the control area, for easy access to his DIP switching. Since then, something similar is being marketed as the G-WirThere is, truly, "no new thing under the sun".
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Post by wolf on May 22, 2010 23:43:35 GMT -5
Here's something I did a few years ago: It's similar to jfrankparnell's idea and it does make rewiring a lot easier. Sort of makes you wonder, why didn't Fender do this with its Strat™ type guitars decades ago? (or even now)
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Post by sydsbluesky on May 23, 2010 2:41:58 GMT -5
My single biggest complaint about strats is fully mitigated by this simple mod.
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Post by gumbo on May 24, 2010 8:44:55 GMT -5
Hmm... I actually thought about doing something similar to this a while back...but I was going to use a chrome plate to mount all the pots, switches AND the jackplate....the design was going to follow the thought-pattern of my Jazz Basses...
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allmektig
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Post by allmektig on Jun 2, 2010 12:07:41 GMT -5
This gave me an idea.
I have several extension cords for computer fan cables lying around. If I were to use them and put them between the pickups and the controll module, and between the control module and the jack output, I could create a truly modular design where I could easily change between different wiring schemes.
I don't see any practical purpose to doing this really, but if something CAN be done, that's enough reason to do it.
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Post by D2o on Jun 2, 2010 12:43:24 GMT -5
This gave me an idea. I have several extension cords for computer fan cables lying around. If I were to use them and put them between the pickups and the controll module, and between the control module and the jack output, I could create a truly modular design where I could easily change between different wiring schemes. I don't see any practical purpose to doing this really, but if something CAN be done, that's enough reason to do it. Interesting idea - and it CAN be done. I recently did something similar, by soldering male and female connectors to the bridge ground, signal and signal return wires between the loaded pick-guard and the bridge and jack on the guitar body. This makes it a lot easier to simply “unplug” the pick-guard from the guitar when I need to work on some wiring. You are looking to take that concept a step further, including the extra connectors between the pickups and the controls, and I don’t see why you can’t (just mind the signal and signal return when you are doing this, so you don't create a phase issue). Your extension cord idea may be better or worse than my method, depending on how reliable the connections are – try it and let us know! FYI, I used something along the lines of the connectors below. Pretty hot. Cheers, D2o
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Post by sumgai on Jun 2, 2010 12:48:23 GMT -5
I don't see any practical purpose to doing this really, but if something CAN be done, that's enough reason to do it. Almost sig-worthy! ;D Just needed to have the Nutz imprimateur in there somewhere..... But seriously, the idea of modularizing needn't be for everyday use, it's sufficient to use modules for testing purposes only. Once everything is setup the way you like it, you can then sanitize the mess and be sure that it works, and that it'll give you stable performance for as long as you like it. But that begs the question - how long before the Muse drives you to seek out yet newer sounds? At that point, you might wish you'd left all that modularity intact, eh? sumgai
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Post by JFrankParnell on Jun 2, 2010 19:24:35 GMT -5
Exactamundo! I'm going to cut my two pgs in half, going to wire my current circuit into one of them, and start working on my crazy double-barrel mod on the other. With quick connectors on the wires, I'll be able to test out my new circuit, and be able to plug my working circuit back in for jam night if needed. I'm really a "figure one bit out at a time" kinda guy, testing physical locations and switches and stuff, not to mention figuring how to cram all my wacky switches in there. As for , heh, no kiddin'. I think if I can cut a straight line with a very thin kerf, it could be a permanent-ish feature, might be only slightly noticeable. Thats not going to fly once i get my custom flame-job pg made, but by then, I hope i have my circuits all dialed in.
I'm not sure how, what with the pups being screwed to the pg, but there might be a way to make the cut under the strings which would be fairly invisible.
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Post by gumbo on Jun 3, 2010 8:13:49 GMT -5
The preceding text may contain hyperbole and derision, substances which the State of California has determined can cause cancer and advanced stages of whining. You have been fairly warned!
....makes me glad sometimes that I'm not in California.....
...then one can also get to the stage of the completely modular test-bed built into a cr@ppy Chinese Strat body just to help figure this stuff out before one does the Iron Man thing on the REAL guitar....
...hmm, this is getting out of hand..it's your fault S-G...
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Post by ashcatlt on Jun 3, 2010 12:15:04 GMT -5
I think these are great ideas. A friend of mine just offered to cut me a stainless steel "permanent" pickguard for my strat. I'm definitely going to have him cut it in 2 pieces so I can get access to the controls. I've been looking (not hard) for solutions to the quick-connect problem. I had thought about some of the connectors found inside computers. Some of those get kind of bulky and tough to fit in an already crowded control cavity. Also, I don't have any on hand. When I wired my Rick recently, I tried to use a pair of 8-pin IC sockets. My implementation only half worked, but I think it's a viable option. I don't like the idea of spade connectors. First, I've never seen them sized for the tiny wires I'm using. Second, they seem to take up way more space than necessary. You could probably fit all of your connections in a space the size of one of those honkers. Best would be to search through all the connectors listed in the Mouser catalog and find something that suits your build. I'm thinking that with the wide variety of different configurations available, it would be hard to come up with one a one-size-fits-all solution.
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Post by D2o on Jun 3, 2010 13:29:55 GMT -5
Some of those connectors are rather large - but they do come in various sizes. I bought some small ones at a local electronics surplus store.
The male part of the connectors I am using is about .11” (2.8 mm) wide, so the male+female really doesn’t take up very much space.
To put it in context: with two push pull pots and one standard pot, one 5 way switch, one DPDT and two SP3T switches all wired together in my control cavity, there was still no space issue using the connectors.
Cheers, D2o
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Post by ashcatlt on Jun 3, 2010 18:01:31 GMT -5
I'm not trying to poo on your idea there D20 (welcome back, BTW), but there's the 3rd reason I won't use those spade connectors:
My strat has 3 x 4 wire (plus shield) humbuckers. Then there's the 2 wires to the jack and the bridge ground wire. The pickup shields are redundant with the cavity shielding, but this still leaves me with 15 little plugs to mess with any time I want to take it apart!
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Post by D2o on Jun 3, 2010 18:37:43 GMT -5
That's okay, Ash (actually, even though you weren't trying to poo on the idea, nothing is sacred). Thanks for the welcome.
Holy toledo! that's a lot of wires you're talking about ...
Which reminds me: when I was putting things in context before, I failed to re-state that I am only talking about using three connectors in my guitar: the signal and return to the jack, and the bridge ground.
Allmektig was talking about something a bit more involved than what I've done, and your application is way more involved than what I've done. I see your dilemma.
Cheers, D2o
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Post by JFrankParnell on Jun 3, 2010 18:51:34 GMT -5
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Post by newey on Jun 3, 2010 18:55:11 GMT -5
On the 4Caster, I used 12V auto-style plug connectors, in the same manner as D2o- to the outjack and bridge ground only, for a quick disconnect of the pickguard.
But after wiring it like that some time ago, I tested it and had no output. My meter readings looked good up to that point, so I suspect a bad connection in those verdammte connectors.
But there it has sat, for many months now. One of these days i really need to get to seriously troubleshooting that project . . .
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Post by ashcatlt on Jun 3, 2010 23:24:02 GMT -5
To be fair, my Rick (2 pickups) only required 6 connections. Shields met bridge wire at the jack sleeve before going to the "plug". An SC strat only needs 8. If I'm reading it correctly, this will take up more space than a 5-way switch and may be too deep (when mated) to fit in most solid-bodied guitars.
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Post by JFrankParnell on Jun 4, 2010 1:21:17 GMT -5
bahhh i hate it when i jump the gun like that
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Post by ashcatlt on Jun 4, 2010 19:43:17 GMT -5
Ah heck! We're just throwing around ideas here anyway. Those might work fine in some contexts. They seem to be at least an inch in every direction. Wouldn't have to be mounted up-and-down like a switch, or even necessarily in the control cavity itself. My strat (and many nowadays) has a "bathtub route" for the pickups with quite a bit of unused space between.
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Post by sumgai on Jun 5, 2010 2:43:40 GMT -5
jfp, Which "upper left corner of WA" are you speaking of? If you're over on the peninsula, it's a bit of a drive..... but if you're up by say, B-ham or some such, you can motor on down to Vetco Electronics in Bellevue, they have a very rich assortment of multi-contact connectors. If you do plan on such a trip, PM me for my phone number, and we'll get together for a bit - I'm about a 20 minute drive away from the place. sumgai
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Post by gumbo on Jun 5, 2010 6:07:26 GMT -5
We are unable to ship to addresses outside of the United States at this time. ....Grrr!
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allmektig
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Post by allmektig on Jun 5, 2010 6:23:37 GMT -5
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allmektig
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Post by allmektig on Jun 5, 2010 6:37:09 GMT -5
We are unable to ship to addresses outside of the United States at this time. ....Grrr! www.myus.com/
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Post by sumgai on Jun 5, 2010 10:45:21 GMT -5
We are unable to ship to addresses outside of the United States at this time.
....Grrr!
www.myus.com/Or good ol' moi. As you yourself have already benefitted from, gumbo! sumgai
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Post by JFrankParnell on Jun 5, 2010 16:02:08 GMT -5
jfp, Which "upper left corner of WA" are you speaking of? If you're over on the peninsula, it's a bit of a drive..... but if you're up by say, B-ham or some such, you can motor on down to Vetco Electronics in Bellevue, they have a very rich assortment of multi-contact connectors. If you do plan on such a trip, PM me for my phone number, and we'll get together for a bit - I'm about a 20 minute drive away from the place. sumgai Cool I'm in Anacortes. Yeah we'll have to get together if either of us is near the other. I'm interested to see the man behind the paper bag. I'll just tell ya now, I wont be sporting the mullet from my avatar ;D I picked up some of these: www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2102497 they are quite easy to wire, each lead goes on a little pin/receptor that is supposed to be crimped, but i soldered em, then they all go in the connector. Prolly hack those mounting plates off the sides. Nice and small. Then, while doing that, I thought, well, if i had a d-sub extension cord, could just cut it in half like this www.cablesondemand.com/category/DB9/URvars/Catalog/Library/InfoManage/9-PIN_D-SUB_CABLE_%28DB9%29.htm with one end male, one end female. Get out the dremmel and try to cut off all the extra stuff on the ends. I dunno, might work.
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Post by JFrankParnell on Jun 6, 2010 21:05:13 GMT -5
Hey, if youre trying the d-sub connectors, 2 things: 1. They have them with straight solderable terminals, like you dont have to put terminals on all the wires, then stick the sterminals into the plug. B. You can dremmel that outer metal housing off easily and they work fine and are more compact. Here's my axe with my easy module: this is the Malibu Mod, but with the Schaller/Eyb M switch for a slightly different combo set. guitarnuts2.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=wiring&action=display&thread=5006 The rocker switches are Bridge Override, No Vol-Tone, and Phase switcher for Neck.
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Post by ijustwannastrat on Jun 7, 2010 10:46:53 GMT -5
I suspect a bad connection in those verdammte connectors. Whoa, such language! But seriously, to go towards connectors to remove electric components, why not go towards PCBs? It could save space, possibly simplify wiring issues, and for those of you that know how to sketch already, it wouldn't really be hard.
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santellan
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Post by santellan on Jun 7, 2010 16:05:17 GMT -5
Good to see this thread going on. Here's my new concept on simplfying the strat wiring. santellansounds.com/wiringkits.aspx. I have the 5 way switch mounted directly to the board. The bare wires from the pickups and output jack connect to the board via a terminal block and the pots have a small connector to plug into the board. It makes the wiring process easy to do. Unfortunately the 5 way switches have an 8 week lead time so I will have the boards sitting around until then. Any feedback is appreciated.....
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Post by D2o on Jun 9, 2010 13:32:18 GMT -5
Frank, allmektig may have hit the nail on the head when he wrote “I don't see any practical purpose to doing this really, but if something CAN be done, that's enough reason to do it.” In terms of easy plugging and unplugging of your module, you’ve executed the harness well : you have the pups, signal and return, and – presumably – bridge ground all wired into the one plug. If you are going to do it, I would say that seems like a good way to do it – one action and you’re done. I see you’ve got some other cool stuff going on there, too, with the phase and bridge switch. Actually, there is enough nuttiness in there that it’s gotta be worth a +1 for at least some of it … … but something’s been bugging me about that harness: So, you have this cool axe with the Malibu Mod (and some modifications) and the “easy module” … now what? Does the removable control cavity work with anything else … I mean, do you have one or more other guitars that also use the easy module? If so, does every easy module jive with every guitar? … for example, can you now have the Malibu Mod in whatever guitar you please … or do you now have just the one easily removable, functional control panel that applies to just the one guitar? The idea of easy access - so you can tinker - is cool, but if you subsequently tinker with the wiring, you'd have to be mindful that you don't overlook correspondingly tinkering with the harness wiring (if required, depending on what you've done). Obviously, if you tinker with it, you will take your time to make sure everything jives … but, if that is the case, does the easy module strike you as overtly “easy”? Anyway, +1 for doing it … and for all the cool looking mojo – “that’s enough reason to do it” (1)You know, if you were to do something like JohnH / JohnA’s Strat Lover’s “Other” Strat mod, you would end up with a pleasant variety of parallel, series, and out-of-phase sounds … you may not even have the urge to go in your axe again for a very long time! (I realize your strat is HSS configuration, but you know what I mean) Good stuff! Don’t ever stop tinkering, and remember these immortal words – and this is easier said than done : “Simplicity is”. (2)D2o (1) (allmektig, © 2010)
(2) (ChrisK, © 2005-2009)
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Post by JFrankParnell on Jun 9, 2010 16:42:28 GMT -5
Thanks man! It's really fun. Your questions: Yeah the + and - of all three pups, plus the ground (trem/body/etc) and hot to jack are on the connector. There was one spot left over, I stuck a grey wire on it just on the weird chance that i need it someday. The module thats in there is the Malibu (or I might have called it "easy"). It is the only module I have done and my only strat. I am working on my really nutty 2 channel double barrel (2CDB) circuit now: guitarnuts2.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=wiring&action=display&thread=5012 I have new ideas since the last post on that thread, and have some new electronics to go in it. I should update that one. So the big advantage to me is that I can continue to work on the 2CDB while having my guitar ready to rock. And there will probly be a couple prototypes for the 2CDB before it gets finalized, so it's going to be great to just plug it in and smoke test it, etc. Something to think about, if anyone is going to try to do this and have it be really good looking, you'll need 2 pgs for every module. Because, youre going to have a kerf cut out of the pg and you'll need another bottom, cut at least a kerf width taller, to make it match up exactly.
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