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Post by vonFrenchie on Apr 16, 2012 12:02:19 GMT -5
Hey everybody. I am totally revamping my Aria LP copy so it will be a Swiss army knife. I am replacing the rubbish neck and half way decent bridge "Samsung" pickups. I also want to replace the 30 year old tune-o-magic. So the real question is what tune-o-magic would be best for metal (old Metallica, Danzig, Death, etc) and if possible what is the best piezo bridge? Along with that would I be better off getting a high end standard tune-o-magic for less than half the price of a piezo and an acoustic pedal or should I just go full bore and get a piezo?
There are songs that I would definitely use piezo/an acoustic pedal so te "just buy an acoustic argument" isn't quite valid. It's difficult to switch from an acoustic to electric in a snap for me. Thanks for the advice in advance as I know you all always give your best.
vF
Ps if there are any misunderstandings let me know. I am typing this on my pho e and for some reason it zooms in and won't let me see what I'm typing so I am relying heavily on autocorrect.
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Post by yakkmeister on Apr 17, 2012 4:50:48 GMT -5
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Post by cynical1 on Apr 17, 2012 7:08:54 GMT -5
I really need to back the Yakk on this one. GraphTech is, IMHO, the best one out there for piezo saddles. All the bridges I've seen are all top quality and the saddles have all been consistent. There is a love 'em or hate 'em thing with GraphTech, but considering what they do, the number of working pros who use them and how versatile they are they're really worth checking out.
You can also just buy the saddles and retro fit them into an existing bridge.
And as long as you're talking about acoustic simulation, GraphTech has an Acousti-Phonic board that connects to these saddles to give you about the most convincing acoustic sound you're ever going to get out of an electric guitar.
And if you get froggy, you can even add the Hexpander board, which piggybacks with the Acousti-Phonic board, and have MIDI output from your guitar.
Jack Thammarat is a very talented guitarist, and has one of the best videos out there displaying exactly what you can do with this system. It has subtitles, so don't let the language barrier stop you from checking this out:
Of course, they can also be used as just piezos...sort of like keeping a Ferrari in second gear, though...
Happy Trails
Cynical One
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Post by vonFrenchie on Apr 17, 2012 19:39:36 GMT -5
I have no interest in MIDI capability, I live in a big city so I would never get a Ferrari above second gear anyway, so I could (in theory) just wire the piezo volume to one pot, bridge volume to another, neck volume to the third and have a magnetic master tone correct?
I would probably go full bore and get the acoustophonic board or whatever its called. I could then replace one of my pots with a DPDT switch for switching between the two and my mono jack for the stereo one provided by Graphtech correct?
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Post by vonFrenchie on Apr 17, 2012 19:41:12 GMT -5
One more thing. I found an official graph tech video that said I would need an acoustic amp. Would a VOX AD60VT (the valvetronic modeling amp) set to clean suffice? I would run my magnetic pickups through my Marshall.
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Post by reTrEaD on Apr 17, 2012 22:21:44 GMT -5
I found an official graph tech video that said I would need an acoustic amp. The big difference between an acoustic amp and an electric amp is the tone stack. An electric amp usually has a strong scoop in the mids. If you use an eq that has a mid boost with an electric amp, that will give you a relatively flat output like an acoustic amp. |
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Post by 4real on Apr 18, 2012 5:01:37 GMT -5
While I went piezo in my last project, I did buy a cheap behringer copy of a boss AC acoustic sim pedal and so would like to offer some support for this kind of thing...at $40 retail, that is a lot easier and can be used on any guitar and without modification. It comes with 4 models and it does produce an acoustic sound. The cheaper version does have some hiss...but then so do many piezo systems. Does it sound like a fully fledged acoustic...no, but neither will any solid body with piezos either...don't equate piezo with 'acoustic' it is just another pickup system.
Also, the sound that sounds good with your electric may not and probably will not be the kind of thing for electric. This pedal and similar will allow you to send this to anotehr amp tweaked for a good effect in that way...handy for recording too where you can send the electric sound to one channel and the acoustic to the other and mix to taste on different tracks.
Here is a good demo of the thing...
So, yeah...a lot to go for this approach, able to use it on any guitar, no mod to yours or batteries required, most likely as cheap as one would want, not a bad sound and 4 'modes' as well as level, enhance and resonance controls for shaping, power option or batteries as well as out and optional direct out.
So definitely something to consider and while I was thinking of doing something with some of my kahler equipped guitars in a piezo DIY thing and have tinkered with a few things, I really don't think it could compete with this kind of thing for convenience, price, performance and flexibility.
To get the best out of these things or a peizo thing, yeah it is better to have two amps. You can get a decent sound out of a guitar amp that will do...but can you realistically change all the eq settings to optimise for this in a performance, I think not. Perhaps if you have an amp with multiple channels this might be possible but that applies to either approach.
For the 'money' I would definitely at least get to a store and check it out or if you have 'money' check out the legit boss or the kinds of things that are often found in digital effect devices that do a similar job...some really are quite impressive in their own way.
Try it/them to see if they are for you or fit the purpose, piezos have other 'problems' too in that they can often be susceptible to handling noise especially with bridge damping and such...
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Post by ashcatlt on Apr 18, 2012 10:45:52 GMT -5
The big difference between an acoustic amp and an electric amp is the tone stack. An electric amp usually has a strong scoop in the mids. If you use an eq that has a mid boost with an electric amp, that will give you a relatively flat output like an acoustic amp. I think most acoustic amps also have an extended treble response - often via a seperate HF driver - which most "electric" amps won't be able to reach. I'd probably be fine with that, but some folks like that extra zing. |
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Post by vonFrenchie on Apr 18, 2012 13:44:27 GMT -5
I hadn't ever heard of the Behringer acoustic pedal. I am really skeptical of Behringer as all of the products of theirs I bought either crapped out on me or had very poor tone. I will still take a look at it, I am never against being proven wrong. Even if I do use an acoustic modeller I would still have to use a second amp as my Marshall doesn't exactly like clean tones. I put the preamp to 3 and cranked the poweramp to about 7 and it was still fairly dirty when I wasn't finger picking single strings.
I think I will have to head over to the music store and see if they have any piezo guitars and try them out on any of the valvetronix that they have. I don't think I will be very displeased with the tone but if I am I know I would be able to EQ it out. Whether it be a mid scoop, which I would believe, or treble "zing," which I would also believe, I am sure I can either get it close to what an acoustic would sound like or get it to a position where I like the tone.
I am not at all against modifying my guitar, so long as it isn't aesthetic (it has a beautiful black dye which is the whole reason I bought it).
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Post by JohnH on Apr 18, 2012 15:30:42 GMT -5
A couple of suggestions:
For using a guitar amp with acoustic, piezo or acoustic modeler., you can add a piezo tweeter or two across your guitar speaker to get that high end. Put about a 100ohm resistor in series with the tweeter (or tweeters), and it doesnt change the load on the amp significantly. The tweeters are only a few $ each. I have this built into my cab, but it can be a seperate box.
Zoom do a very good acoustic sim in their modellers, I have had the G2 and also the current G2nu - its better than the versions I have heard in Boss modellers.
cheers
John
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Post by vonFrenchie on Apr 18, 2012 17:49:55 GMT -5
Much like Behringer, I have tried (even own) a few Zoom products. Good is not a word I would use to describe them. Granted mine is probably 10 years old. The only useful function on it is the delay and the "violin" feature. But, also much like Behringer, I will check it out. I like the expression pedal on the G2.1Nu. I sold my Vox wah a while back and it would be nice to have a wah to toy around with here and there.
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Post by vonFrenchie on Apr 23, 2012 17:28:09 GMT -5
Well after scouring the internet for videos and sound clips I have decided to go piezo. I was thinking about the Boss AC-3 but after listening to all the Ghost demos the AC-3 sounded like a toy. So within two weeks (pay checks and what not) I should have all the parts. So far I have picked up two pickups to replace the Samsungs, a Duncan JB and Jazz.
After looking at the schematic info for the Ghost and acousti-phonic preamp I was thinking of replacing two of my pots with push-pull pots. One would be wired for an all on feature and the other would be wired to switch between piezo and magnetic. Obviously the all on switch would bypass the piezo/mag switch. Does this sound feasible? I would drop in a mag/all/piezo switch but I don't want to drill into the finish.
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