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Post by reTrEaD on Jan 5, 2022 9:39:41 GMT -5
No, not her (although that might be an interesting conversation):  What I'm asking about is the system where a 1050Hz signal is piggybacked on the 50Hz AC power lines. If I understand correctly, this ripple is sent in coded bursts to tell certain devices when to turn on, allowing them to operate at off-peak hours, at highly reduced rates for the energy used, in some parts of Australia and New Zealand. While it seems like a great idea, it also seems it would have the potential to be a huge nuisance if it got into the audio. 1050Hz would be a slightly sharp C, two octaves above middle C. Are there any horror stories to tell here, or is this mostly a non-issue? |
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Post by newey on Jan 5, 2022 11:49:36 GMT -5
I had never heard of this, but apparently it is fairly old technology, going back to the 1950s. Wikipedia had this: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zellweger_off-peak Don't know if you saw that or not. From that article: "The noise is often picked up by other equipment, especially audio amplifiers and stereos and the noise can cause problems with other electrical devices. It is especially audible from ceiling fans running at low speed. Even some telephone lines can pick up the noise. The noise can be particularly obtrusive from some fluorescent light systems". I would imagine that nowadays this sort of thing could be done digitally, at higher frequencies, so as to eliminate any audible effects?  |
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Post by reTrEaD on Jan 5, 2022 14:34:12 GMT -5
Don't know if you saw that or not. Yes, I did. Good place to start but I reckon we can learn a good bit more from folks who are living with this thing. Hoping to JohnH, ozboomer, and others from downunder might join the conversation when they visit. |
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Post by unreg on Jan 5, 2022 20:05:45 GMT -5
Possible for gumbo to join? Does the downunder encapsulate Oz? |
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Post by sumgai on Jan 5, 2022 22:27:23 GMT -5
Does the downunder encapsulate Oz? Yes, but it suffers from irritable bowel syndrome whenever it does so. Something, something, upside-down, you understand.  HTH sumgai |
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Post by gumbo on Jan 6, 2022 3:26:20 GMT -5
I resemble that remark.  Anyway, I turn on and off exactly when I want to..... ....as Gandalf would say. ....in fact, when I think about it (not something I do all that often), most of my electrical appliances seem to be totally in charge of when they cease to operate....usually 9.5 milliseconds after the warranty expires.. |
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Post by cynical1 on Jan 6, 2022 7:13:23 GMT -5
...most of my electrical appliances seem to be totally in charge of when they cease to operate....usually 9.5 milliseconds after the warranty expires.. 70 years ago it was accepted as common knowledge that somewhere some engineer was slaving at a drafting table deliberately intent on finding a design for the "better mouse trap". Considerations such as a service factor, or maximum service cycles were actually standards to strive for when designing the best machine or appliance the human mind was capable of producing. What has changed in those 70 years to drive these mantras into a cave and leave us all in such a sorry state? What has happened to take that 9.5 millisecond failure rate down to just nano-seconds past warranty time? AutoCAD 3D. HTC1 |
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Post by sumgai on Jan 6, 2022 11:20:45 GMT -5
What has changed in those 70 years to drive these mantras into a cave and leave us all in such a sorry state? ..... AutoCAD 3D. I'm not sure how a design tool that merely puts an engineer's imagination to (digital) paper earns any disrespect, it's nothing more than a complicated drafting table.... What really drove the downfall, and it took way less than 70 years, is the Harvard MBA. I know that some of you are rolling your eyes at my continual harping on this, but financial history proves me correct. Before the Harvard MBA, companies were in business for the advancement of society, and to gain a positive reputation for helping that advancement. As Harvard MBA's matriculated into the work force, the name of the game became "The 90-day turn-around", where quarter-over-quarter profits were considered the only way to gauge success. The rest is history writ large, as noted (and lamented) by c1. Sorry that helped. sumgai |
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Post by cynical1 on Jan 6, 2022 11:35:22 GMT -5
I'm not sure how it works on the electronics side, but on the mechanical side the 3D module does a pretty good job of simulating the physical world. I have seen this function used to determine the actual point of failure on a drive shaft to determine how much thinner they could make it to increase profitability. The shaft used to be thicker, as the engineers where in the room as the shrapnel flew prior to that tool's arrival...
HTC1
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Post by sumgai on Jan 6, 2022 17:56:34 GMT -5
Good engineering occurs despite whichever tool is used. Bad engineering occurs when ego gets in the way of prudence - no tool can compensate for that shortcoming.
If an engineer is going to refuse responsibility and instead blame the tool, then he/she had best be hiring a mighty good lawyer. Just sayin'.........
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Post by ozboomer on Jan 6, 2022 18:29:03 GMT -5
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Post by JohnH on Jan 7, 2022 2:38:15 GMT -5
This is a deep, dark secret that we were hoping would never have to be revealed to the rest of the world.
But now it's out. There's no more hiding the true facts. And so I have to own up and confess that I have absolutely no idea what it is and have never heard anything about it at all.
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Post by JohnH on Jan 7, 2022 2:51:09 GMT -5
...and also...
I'd just like to state in case it helps, that Rene Z's accent in her portrayal of Bridget Jones was a dead-nuts bang-on accurate representation of an upper-middle-class young female from a nice private school in the Home Counties of SE England. I dated girls like that, and I'm very happy to have married an Aussie girl instead!
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Post by gumbo on Jan 7, 2022 8:04:44 GMT -5
My Electrician/Engineer friend of thirty years has been asked the question, and I'm hoping for a more detailed answer to this ZZZing thing next week when he an I go for our annual breakfast pancake (or two) together... I will report the details after I wipe off all the maple syrup before I start typing... Watch this space..... ....there's not much else happening anyway at the moment..  |
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Post by reTrEaD on Jan 7, 2022 10:59:31 GMT -5
...and also... I'd just like to state in case it helps, that Rene Z's accent in her portrayal of Bridget Jones was a dead-nuts bang-on accurate representation of an upper-middle-class young female from a nice private school in the Home Counties of SE England. I dated girls like that, and I'm very happy to have married an Aussie girl instead! Thank you for elucidating. (TWSS) |
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Post by reTrEaD on Jan 7, 2022 11:02:35 GMT -5
Revectoring the conversation... Thank you very much.  Apparently this isn't as widespread as I had thought. |
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Post by unreg on Jan 7, 2022 16:17:25 GMT -5
I will report the details after I wipe off all the maple syrup before I start typing... Definitely amalgamate hand washing; since, sticky keys halt typing, for the most part, until clean keys materialize. ⦠sry⦠erase ⦠(now the vector should be clearly visible again) |
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Post by gumbo on Jan 11, 2022 9:12:38 GMT -5
Yes, the maple syrup has gone.. :-(
....and yes, the idea did come about after it was realised that 'pure' time-switches would never remain syncronised (my spelling)
..and yes, Australia DOES still have quite a few 'legacy' Zellweger meters (mostly in Queensland and New South Wales) which still operate as originally intended
...and no, my sparky (as we say here) friend has never heard of the blips-on-the-line causing any real problem to anyone, and certainly not to the same extent that interference emanates from fluorescent lighting, for example.
...and yes, all new requirements for remote actuation of equipment are these days covered off by 'smart' meters which access the 4G phone network and (also) tell the authorities about what one is consuming and the consumption pattern being established and what is in the refrigerator while they're about it.
....and yes, the pancakes were GREAT (as always...)
...back to mundane things like living with 40C heat here at the moment..
Stay safe and well, Folks..
g-f-b
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Post by cynical1 on Jan 11, 2022 10:35:38 GMT -5
...back to mundane things like living with 40C heat here at the moment..  |
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