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Post by newey on Jan 13, 2022 6:09:29 GMT -5
First off, the diagram omits this as being understood, but the upper lug of the volume pot (where the black wire from the tone pot connects) needs to be grounded, usually to the pot shell. The circuit shows grounding to the base of the push/pull switch (which must then be grounded to the circuit's grounding point), but without also grounding the volume pot's 3rd lug, your volume pot won't work properly when in "bright mode"
The circuit makes things brighter by removing the load of the tone pot from the circuit. More brightness could be achieved by removing both pots from the circuit, making it a "direct out" switch.
Your treble bleed should be wired between the lower lug of the volume pot, where the switch is connected, and the wiper (center lug).
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Post by newey on Jan 12, 2022 22:41:48 GMT -5
It just occurred to me that my control cavity has conductive paint in it. Could that be part of the problem too? Doubtful. But if you're concerned, you can cover it with electrical tape to be sure nothing is getting grounded improperly through it.
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Post by newey on Jan 12, 2022 12:12:26 GMT -5
admsavage- Hello and Welcome to G-Nutz2!Everything work's apart from Pos 3 (two outer HB coils.) Are you also still having the problem with the bridge HB sounding "thin"?
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Post by newey on Jan 11, 2022 20:25:41 GMT -5
Nice, thanks for sharing the sound samples. But, while I know what guitar you're using from the other thread, someone coming along won't know what axe you're playing. You describe the amp, pedals, etc but not the guitar. Maybe link back to your thread on the wiring.
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Post by newey on Jan 11, 2022 19:24:49 GMT -5
dirthead-
Hello and Welcome to G-Nutz2!
stratocasserole hasn't been back since May, so I doubt he'll get back to you. But we'll be happy to help. A well-focused shot of your existing wiring would be helpful. When you say you're doing the same to your guitar, exactly the same? P-rails with triple shots? And, are they already wired together?
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Post by newey on Jan 10, 2022 13:54:59 GMT -5
Challenges with physical depth in the electronics cavity of these perhaps thinner bodies??? Could well be an issue. AFAIK push/pull pots and push/push would be the same depth. Do you perhaps have a spare you can use to measure? Also, CTS now makes a Push/Pull pot with a PCB board which may be a bit shorter than the ALpha ones, at least looking visually, I didn't check actual dimensions. As for preferences for push/pulls versus push/push, many people don't like push/pulls as it is easier to push down to change a setting rather than pulling up, particularly if switching in the middle of a song or solo. But push/push pots are harder to find. I don't recall hearing anyone with a bias against push/push pots. As for shaft diameters, US-spec solid shaft pots are 1/4", which is 6.35mm. Metric ones are typically 6 mm. US-spec split shaft pots are a bit under 6 mm. So, if you are using US-spec solid shaft pots, you will need to ream the holes out just a tiny bit. If you are using split-shaft pots, no problem. And import pots will fit the slightly larger 1/4" US-spec holes no problem, tightening the hex nut takes care of the tiny bit of "slop" of the hole. Also, however, be aware that there is a difference in the number of splines on the split-shaft pots. US-spec ones have 24 splines (IIRC), and imports have fewer (I think). Anyway, be aware that import knobs don't fit well on US splined shafts, and vice versa (you can cram them on, but they don't sit right). So if you buy US-spec split shafts, be sure to get US-spec knobs, and import knobs if you have import-spec pots.
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Post by newey on Jan 10, 2022 6:20:11 GMT -5
The "tone wood" debate is never-ending, and all subjective. As far as electrics go, IMO the wood type has only a minimal contribution to the overall sound. Acoustic guitars are another matter entirely.
By its price?
If one is building one's own bodies or necks, then the wood's hardness and "workability" will be a prime consideration. Harder woods will be more difficult to work with, and will require better-quality tooling. If one is buying a finished guitar, see above re: "tonewood" debate.
I guess durability also plays a part- Fender's old pine-bodied Teles got chipped and dented pretty easily, the wood was so soft.
Nowadays, one must also consider the source and sustainability. Many exotic types of wood, particularly ones sourced from rainforests, will have limited availability due to import restrictions- and the prices rise accordingly. For some species, once any existing supplies are sold off, no more will be forthcoming.
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Post by newey on Jan 9, 2022 17:21:21 GMT -5
Either switch should work.
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Post by newey on Jan 9, 2022 17:19:20 GMT -5
BRIDGESeries = 13.57k Split = 7.22kThis seems suspect to me and my limited know-how.. I may have a bad connection on that one, but it seems that the split should roughly be 1/2 of the series reading, like the other 2...? I'd say it's close enough, within a margin of error. The split will only be exactly half if the 2 coils are identical, and there are always manufacturing variances. Let me take a look at a diagram, real life work intrudes at the moment. You know, the kind that pays the bills . . .
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Post by newey on Jan 9, 2022 17:14:37 GMT -5
pnwmule- Hello and Welcome to G-Nutz2!Yes, it will. The three-way pickup selector switch is likely a single-pole double throw (SPDT) switch. To bypass both caps in the center position (as shown on the Swede schematic you posted) you will want a DPDT On-On-On switch. Alternatively, a single-pole (or double pole) On-Off-On could be used, but those are going to be harder to find on guitar parts websites; you will likely have to go to one of the electronics supply houses to find one.
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Post by newey on Jan 6, 2022 14:40:44 GMT -5
I will look harder. I have no problem paying more for a switch that will do the job, and fit. Once you get up to 6 position rotaries, you will see many that can be set up (as I mentioned) by changing the indexing, such that you can get anywhere from 6 to 12 positions. You will see those listed, where the choice is "number of positions" as being "2-12" or some such. If you only search for ones with 6 (and only 6) throws, your options are more limited.
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Post by newey on Jan 6, 2022 9:20:03 GMT -5
I suppose once Mark the Anti-Christ perfects the metaverse a Katana Air will be the only thing your avatar will ever need. When I come home frustrated from work, an amp sim through headphones or a sound card just won't cut it. I want to crank my Peavey to 11 and work out my frustrations. That's not going to change anytime soon.
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Post by newey on Jan 6, 2022 6:21:46 GMT -5
As is very common with rotary switches, the shaft on the one you linked to is a flatted "D" shape so that the knob doesn't twist on the shaft as you rotate from one position to the next. That's all well and good, just be aware that it will limit your choices of knobs to fit it. Also, the one you posted seems to have more decks (and more poles) than you would need. This type allows you to change the indexing on the switch, so it can go from a 6 position switch up to 12 (I think- hard to see on the picture). It also seems to be lacking any solder lugs? So, caveat emptor and all that .. . But the price from AliExpress is dirt cheap. Mouser has sealed Grayhill mil-spec ones with 2 decks, 4 poles- but it's a $30 switch! Of course, you have a vision, and far be it for me to dissuade you, but 5-position rotaries are more common, cheaper, and smaller. I suspect that you will find that the series OOP setting is more useful than the parallel OOP. As we often say around here, "SOOP is better than POOP". If you eliminated the POOP setting, you would simplify the wiring, use a cheaper switch, and one more likely to fit the cavity without problems.
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Post by newey on Jan 6, 2022 6:06:32 GMT -5
Have you taken a meter reading of all three of them sumgai- Yes. he laid out the DCR of each coil in the first post, and they seem OK. needmorefingers: The reason for the dual-gang pot is to separate the tone for the middle pickup from the other 2, given the separate volumes. You can wire a regular "master tone" for all 3 pickups, but it will behave a bit wonky when multiple pickups are activated. For example, with the master tone wired to all 3 pickups, the middle volume pot will also turn down the B and N pickups when the middle is active with them, and vice versa with the B/N Volume. OTOH, people do build guitars wired that way. Probably only a minority of players use their tone controls anyway. Up to you if you want to try that. Anyway, I'll try to work up a diagram of your "wish list", although it may be the weekend before I can get to it.
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Post by newey on Jan 5, 2022 22:33:33 GMT -5
Could anybody help me out by marking up what I have, or at least explaining moving a wire(s) from point 'A' to point 'B' to achieve some of your thoughts? Yes, we can do that. But it tends to work better if you say "I want a diagram to do this and that", rather than, well, we draw up a diagram to see if you like it, only to have you say "well, I'd rather have this other thing". Now, if it were my HHH guitar, I'd have: One push/pull to turn the middle pickup on/off, and to serve as a middle pickup volume. I would not bother to split the coil on the middle "dual blade" HB, those small coils don't sound like much when split IMO. This will give you all the middle combos with the N and B HBs. 3-way toggle switch would give you N/N+B/B, just as with any HH LP-style guitar. With one hole for the 3-way toggle, you'd be back to three pots. One, as above, would be middle volume (rather than tone), and would be a push/pull to add the middle. The second would be a Bridge/neck volume, also with a push/pull, which would split both HBs simultaneously to single-coil operation. The third would be a master tone, using a dual-gang pot, with one gang for the middle pickup, and the other for the bridge/neck tone. If a blower switch is also desired, a dual-gang pot with a P/P switch does exist, I bought a couple a few weeks ago.
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Post by newey on Jan 5, 2022 17:37:30 GMT -5
3 tiered 3P16T rotary switch. You may be able to find a 3 pole rotary switch with all 3 poles on a single deck. The 4-pole ones will more commonly have 2 decks, with 2 poles per deck.
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Post by newey on Jan 5, 2022 15:52:57 GMT -5
I assume squiggly lines are pick up coils.. Yes, that's the symbol for an inductor, which is essentially what a pickup is. Angellahash's schematic uses 3 poles of a 6-position rotary switch (3P6T). However, he erroneously labelled it as "1P6T". The three poles he uses are designated "a", "b" and "c". You will probably find it more easy to secure a 4-pole 6 throw rotary, so you would have an unused pole, but 3 pole ones aren't that common.
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Post by newey on Jan 5, 2022 11:49:36 GMT -5
I had never heard of this, but apparently it is fairly old technology, going back to the 1950s. Wikipedia had this: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zellweger_off-peak Don't know if you saw that or not. From that article: "The noise is often picked up by other equipment, especially audio amplifiers and stereos and the noise can cause problems with other electrical devices. It is especially audible from ceiling fans running at low speed. Even some telephone lines can pick up the noise. The noise can be particularly obtrusive from some fluorescent light systems". I would imagine that nowadays this sort of thing could be done digitally, at higher frequencies, so as to eliminate any audible effects?
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Post by newey on Jan 5, 2022 6:58:48 GMT -5
nmf- Hello and Welcome to G-Nutz2!Looks like your questions are pretty much answered, so just consider me the Welcoming Committee (of one). Even if that were your playing style, a push/pull is not a great option for a kill switch, it's hard to get that "machine gun" effect pulling up on a knob. And, mechanically, push/pulls are more flimsy than a toggle, so unlikely to stand up to the kind of use that a kill switch gets. The point made about loading the circuit with all the volume pots is a valid one. jhng's idea of a blower switch therefore has some merit here. Coincidentally, I have a 3-volume Strat-type guitar in the works (got the pickguard all wired up, but I have to secure a body and neck to put it into . . .) Mine, however, does not use a master volume, and I'm using pots with a SPST On/Off switch with a detent, similar to those used for radios and so forth. That way, each pickup can be "clicked off" when turned all the way down, thus taking the pickup and its pot out of circuit when not active. Not saying you should do that, just another similar idea. As drawn, with the RWRP middle, you will be splitting the middle pickup to the South coil, and the B and N to the North coil. When split, therefore, N + M and B + M will be hum-cancelling, but N + B will not. If you think you would be using N + B moreso than other split combos, you might consider splitting either N or B to the SOuth coil, so that the N + B combo would be hum-cancelling. You would then lose hum-cancelling, though, in one or the other of the middle pickup combos. Or, alternativley, you could use the 4th P/P to swap the coils on one pickup so as to maximize hum-cancelling. Just a thought.
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Post by newey on Jan 3, 2022 6:17:46 GMT -5
JohnH would be the one to ask. A resistor will just cut all frequencies from the one pickup, the idea of the cap is to atttenuate the highs from the one coil, but leaving the lower frequncies for some added "heft" in conjunction with the unaffected coil.
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Post by newey on Jan 2, 2022 22:47:19 GMT -5
Sorry for the bum steer there. If you want to have it like you envision it, wire it this way: EDIT: I should clarify that, on your latest diagram, the bridge red wire changes color to white after the series/parallel switch. I left it as red.
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Post by newey on Jan 2, 2022 22:21:58 GMT -5
Now that I look at it, not sure I told you right. You still won't get the bridge pickup on the 5-way at 1 and 2 without flipping the switch. Prpbably best to do it the other way, just wire the bridge to output from one end of the switch, other end goes to the 5-way. So, switch "down" gives you the normal 5-way selections, switch "up" adds the bridge to whatever is selected by the 5-way. The selections then would be N + B/ N + M + B/ M + B/ M + B/ B
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Post by newey on Jan 2, 2022 18:51:27 GMT -5
Looking much better now. The bridge on switch will work as drawn, it adds the bridge in at positions 4 and 5, so B + N and B + M + N are added conbos. But I'm not sure you want to do it as you have shown it. If the "bridge On' switch is "up" (per the diagram, that is, the lever will be down), the bridge "hot" is disconnected from positions 1 and 2 on the lower left pole of the Superswitch. So, if you're playing with the Bridge On in positions 4 and 5, and you want to switch to position 1 (bridge alone) or position 2 (B + M), you will have no output from the bridge (unless you first flip the Bridge On switvh the other way). To fix this, just send the "bridge on" signal directly to the volume pot and don't worry about the 5 way switch. That willl give you the "bridge On" at all positions of the 5-way switch. Or, if you really just want to add the bridge in positions 4 and 5, then use one pole of the Superswitch to switch the bridge alone. The "Bridge On" switch then connects to either lugs 1 and 2 or to 4 and 5, and send the commons to output as shown.
But the Neck tone? Are you sure you want it active in positions 2 through 5? As drawn, you have the bridge tone in positions 1 and 2, the neck/middle tone is in positions 2 through 5, and then when you use the "bridge On" switch, now it's a master tone in positions 2 through 4, and you'll have both tone controls active in position 2. If that's what you want, fine, but I think you'd do better to run the bridge tone right off the bridge "hot", before you get to the bridge on and the 5-way switch. The neck/mid tone can stay as is, but if you want to avoid the interaction at position 2, just limit the neck/mid tone to positions 3,4,5.
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Post by newey on Jan 2, 2022 18:29:18 GMT -5
Based on Charlie's experimentation, I figured I wouldn't worry about balanced output. But if it's that easy, sure, why not?
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Post by newey on Jan 2, 2022 13:54:12 GMT -5
HMM, let me take a look.
Edit: The cap will work there, but there may be a better way, let's let others weigh in.
I also note that you have added another switch, which looks to be a "bridge on" switch, but I can't follow where the green wires go as they run into the light blue.
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Post by newey on Jan 2, 2022 7:48:56 GMT -5
For the parallel position of BV, I think the exit point of the signal is on the BT phase switch since I connected NS and SS to either side of the phase switch. OK, you're right, I missed that. And if you only want the coil splits to work when in series, then OK. However, you should integrate the pickup selector into the diagram just to be sure that's correct as well.
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Post by newey on Jan 2, 2022 0:00:36 GMT -5
I only draw the switch part to prevent a messy diagram That's fine, and understood. I assume that the light blue wires coming from BT and NV, and which are not the ones labeled "to hot" are going to ground? Assuming that is correct, you're getting closer but still not there. First, your coil split switfh will only work when that pickup's series/parallel switch is set to the series setting. You won't get any coil splitting when the switch is set to parallel, becasue the split switch isn't connected when each pickup's series/parallel switch is set to parallel. I figure that this is probably not what you want to have happen. Also, the wiring on BV is wrong for the parallel setting. When pulled up, BV connects SS (green wire) and NF (white wire, grey as shown) together, but doesn't connect them to ground or to hot. Compare the wiring of BV and NV and you'll see what I mean.
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Post by newey on Jan 1, 2022 23:27:32 GMT -5
Thanks, that does help.
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Post by newey on Jan 1, 2022 17:16:34 GMT -5
It's really easy to get a balanced output with a humbucker design - just invert the phase of one of the coils relative to a normal humbucker, and use the center coil split point as ground. But volume and tone control become more problematical since you have two signal phases. Not quite following how that would work. Is the second coil like a "dummy coil" then?
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Post by newey on Jan 1, 2022 16:53:15 GMT -5
Thanks, Charlie Honkmeister- I remember the thread on the LP recording. The fact that I will likely never own one is one of the reasons I brought this up. I will have to peruse the pickup makers forum, never looked at that before.
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