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Post by morbe on May 28, 2009 14:46:22 GMT -5
I'm faily new to gigging. and setting up amps for live performance. I have a been mic-ing a 100watt fender Front man to a PA which of course allows it to be amplified through the PA. Giving a louder sound as you all may know.
But then Im looking into preamps I may be a bit stupid but can some one please explain this to me. It will boost the guitar signal as it goes into your amp making a louder sound? almost like a PA right but just not as loud.
Then I got to thinking. If I had a 60 watt practice amp and used the external speaker out to the preamp in of my 100watt fender amp will I get 160watts of volume sound? Or or atleast a but of a louder sound? Or will I just ruin my Amps all together Some one please explain this to me, if you know
Thanks!
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Post by ChrisK on May 28, 2009 17:49:59 GMT -5
Yes, right up to the output power capability of the PA.
It will boost the voltage level of the signal, increasing the output level right up to the output power capability of the amp.
You mean "will I get 160 watts of output power". The answer is no.
The output might get louder sooner (at a lower output voltage level from the guitar), but it will still be limited by the output power capability of the amp. In this case it's 100 watts.
Now, if you run the same guitar signal to the inputs of both amps, the total output power with both amps fully driven would be 160 watts.
The "preamp in" circuit might get a tad fried.
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Post by newey on May 28, 2009 18:57:40 GMT -5
morbe-
ChrisK said:
Let me "amplify" this statement. Chris is engaging in understatement there, to make his point, which is:
Don't do this!
A very long time ago (I won't tell you how long ago it was, but to give you an idea, I had a solid state guitar amp- and no one I knew had ever seen one before . . .) Under the banner of "More Power!", we tried daisy-chaining guitar amps together in the manner you suggest We ended up frying the second amp in the chain with some regularity.
We didn't know any better. You now do.
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Post by morbe on May 29, 2009 8:28:57 GMT -5
How do you do this? I have no pre-amp. Here is the long explaination. this is where is get thrown for a loop. I have a fender Amp 100watts. It PLays to it's full capacity. Im sure I can gig a small venue with it. But I also have a 90 watt Bass and Bass Amp the amp is 90watt. But it totally gets drowned out by the fender amp. and when you ad what the vocalist,and drums (Not Mic-ed) are putting out forget it. you cant even hear the Bass!
I do have that 60 watt crate 1 (guitar amp) that seems louder than the Bass Amp. How would I get the Bass to plug into both amps?
Also. In my manuel for the Bass Amp states that you can unplug the main speaker and connect an external speaker, What if I use a splitter and and connect another 8ohm speaker to it. Running two speakers. Will I then be pushing 90 watts to both speakers? or will it split 45watts per speaker?
Im just trying the cheapest way to get more Ballz out of my 90 watt Bass Amp.
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Post by morbe on May 29, 2009 9:10:15 GMT -5
You know I think I may have found my solution to play through both amps at once. By using an A/B/Y pedal. That Rocks. Now My only other question is. Playing a Bass Through This: www.musicgoround.com/detail.aspx?id=688317its a cheap amp that I picked up off Craigslist. I've heard of playing Bass through guitar amp will damage the Amp but this amp seems pretty solid. |
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Post by newey on May 29, 2009 15:45:47 GMT -5
Morbe-
I have an identical Crate CR-1. It's nowhere near 60 watts, I believe it's 20 watts RMS. Might be 60 at peak, but you're not going to see anywhere near that on a regular basis from this thing.
Playing a bass through a guitar amp won't hurt the amp, but it can damage the speaker, if you crank it up at all. I run a bass (well, currently the bass is in pieces, but I did so a while back) through my Crate- but never above about 1/4 volume, just for practice levels only.
Bass speakers are built differently than guitar speakers, they're meant to take those low frequencies. If you want to play a bass through a guitar amp at significant volumes, you'd need to replace the speaker with a bass speaker.
You also have to be careful to match impedances when adding more speakers. If your amp has an 8Ω speaker, adding another 8Ω speaker in parallel gives you only 4Ω which may damage your amp. And, no, you won't be pushing 90 watts out of each speaker, either.
The reason you can't hear the bass over the guitar, vocals, drums etc is that it takes more power to produce low frequencies (bass) than higher frequencies, like guitars or vocals. Of course, everyone's needs and styles may differ somewhat, but just to give a crude example of this, a guitarist might well be able to play a bar gig with about a 30 or 40 watt amp, provided the drummer isn't bashing too loudly. A bass in the same room probably needs more like 100 watts to avoid being drowned out.
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Post by morbe on May 29, 2009 16:01:11 GMT -5
Hmm thats odd because that Crate amp and Hartke Side by side the Crate is way louder. The crate amp doesnt have a wattage rating in it but it is louder. But I guess that solidifies what you said about needing more power to create lower sounds. I was looking into some new gear there is a guy that selling a 200watt Crate head and a GK 600 watt cab but he blew the speakers and replaced them with Pyle Speakers. Im not sure what the speakers are rated at but he claims that its a great loud set up.
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Post by ChrisK on May 29, 2009 21:02:16 GMT -5
About the only guitar amp that one should play bass through would be the Fender Bassman (oh wait, that's a bass amp).....
Guitar speaker enclosures generally do not acoustically load the drivers at bass frequencies, and the drivers (speakers) can (and will) be damaged through excessive cone excursion.
Bass speaker enclosures are often closed-back cabinets. Most guitar cabinets are not.
Generally, watt for watt, a bass player needs about 3 - 4 times the output power as a guitarist.
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Post by sumgai on May 30, 2009 13:16:04 GMT -5
Just to add some more long-windedness to the fray.... Oh, better take care of business first - morbe, Welcome to the NutzHouse! ;D OK, let's take a look at physics (one of Chris's Top 5 favorite topics)..... Studies have proven what electronics formulas have shown for decades - for normal listening levels, approximately 70 - 80 dB, a guitar amp actually puts out about 1 to 1½ watts RMS, through most speaker setups. The need for high wattage is absolutely mythical, when all is said and done - for normal playing levels and styles. So why do we insist on so many watts? Fidelity. We want the amp and speaker to reproduce exactly what's being fed into them, and from a guitar, that means the pick attack. That pick attack is a very sharp transient, which translates to a steep increase in required power in order to replicate the sound. That means lots of watts for a very short time. That's why that big wattage number, even though the necessity for that number is on the order of 1/100th to 1/1000th of the total time the guitar is feeding a signal to the amp. Now, that said, most of what's gone before in this thread is true, to be sure. Specifically, the lower the frequency, the more steady power required in order to hear the signal at the same volume level. A bass amp will need to feed out about 3 to 4 watts of power to the speaker in order to make the signal about 70 to 80 dB of audible volume. The picking attack transients aren't nearly as sharp as a regular guitar (even when using a pick) because the strings have so much more mass, they simply don't move as quickly from standing still to full motion. That means that a bass amp doesn't need 800 watts to fill a room with a pick attack (although it may well need most of those watts to fill a stadium), but it will need something like 200 watts to keep up with a 100 watt guitar amp. And so far, we've dealt with idealized speakers and cabinets. Sadly, that would not be the real world.  Speaker efficiency is rarely mentioned in these halls, but the fact is, two speakers can sit side-by-side and have completely different output levels, from the same amp, due simply to how well they translate the incoming signal into mechanical motion. Chris referred obliquely to this with "cone excursion", one of the criteria making up the speaker efficiency rating. Without going into pages of math formulas and such, let's just cut to the chase and say that for very low volume levels, like your bedroom, you can pretty much safely play a bass through a guitar amp. Anything louder than this, and you won't get the desired results. Worse, you risk damaging the guitar amp's speaker - bad juju.  One more thing on wattage.... if you read a wattage rating on the back panel of an amp, be sure that the label is right next to the output jack, or that it at least says "Output - xx Watts". Maybe it'll say 'maximum' or something, it might not. And it may also say "At xx Ohms", again, it may not. But the real warning here is, if you see "xx Watts" anywhere else, particularly near the incoming power cord, you're not reading the output power, you're reading the total power consumed by the amplifier just in order to be turned on and running. Your take away from this paragraph is that no amplifier is 100% efficient - there will always be more watts going in that what comes out of the speaker jack. For tube amps, that can be a rather hefty percentage, but even solid state units will suffer anywhere from 20 to 40% losses, depending on several factors. OK, enough drivel for this morning, it's off to the weed wars. (And I don't mean the bogartable kind, sadly, I mean the garden kind.) HTH sumgai |
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Post by gitpiddler on May 30, 2009 23:12:57 GMT -5
Welcome morbe! Speakers blow over time because they aren't allowed to cool down slowly after a gig, like a cool-down lap. The glue in the coils eventually piles up across the gap, rub on the magnet, and short out. Power may have little to do with these failures. The A/B/Y is a winner in my book. The Pyles may not have the definition of the original GK's, but if it sounds good, get it. Does the PA have a sub-woofer? We forgot to turn the sub on at rehearse today and every one was looking around like something was missing-but what?  |
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Post by morbe on Jun 1, 2009 9:56:13 GMT -5
Hey yeah Thanks every one for the input and the education. Im not sure what the PA has on it but every thing sounded great. I just hate asking this guy to hook into his PA. Becuase Mainly it's his PA you know. It's what he sings out of. So i get the feeling that he just thinks Im invading his person gear space or something. So practice can be a little pain full at first but when we all get into it. Its lot better. My brother actually plays live all the time for him it's a career but He just tells me that every one can play with practice amps. He states that the music that he plays is so low that he can have conversations on stage with other band members. but they Have a giging PA that every one goes through. And that provides the noise.
But about that Amp and head. They guy has a very reputible buisness and states that he built the cabinet for the That head and suggest that even though the speaker are rated for 800 he wouldnt put any other head on top of it!
So there is another question. a 200 watt head going to a HEad with all seakers rated at 600 watts. all is matched at 8 ohms. (in Thoery)Does each speaker get fed 200 watts or does will they get fed 50 watts each?
And why would it be unsafe to but a 600 watt head on it?
Oh and yeah both amps side by side sounded like crap. I would never do that again maybe with another Bass Amp but this did not sound as well as I would hope.
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Post by ashcatlt on Jun 1, 2009 13:15:12 GMT -5
So there is another question. a 200 watt head going to a HEad with all seakers rated at 600 watts. all is matched at 8 ohms. (in Thoery)Does each speaker get fed 200 watts or does will they get fed 50 watts each? So you've got 4 x 8 Ohm speakers? Depending on how they're connected, the total impedance is probably either 2, 8, or 32 Ohms. First thing to check is the power output at that impedance. Assuming this does come out to 200 watts, then each speaker gets about 50. The amp's rating is the maximimum it's ever going to put out at that given load. The power rating on the speaker is the maximum it can handle before it gives up - usually forever. This is a bit of a tricky question, and it sort of depends who you're asking. A 600W head would put 150W across each speaker (assuming the impedance matches, as above). This can't even come close to hurting any of the speakers, if each is rated for 600W handling... ...Unless the head is cranked all the way up and asked to try to produce more than 600W output. This will cause it clip (distort) the top (and bottom) of the signal wave off. The design of the amp will determine how close to a square wave the result will look. Square waves are flat across the tops and bottoms, and look to the speakers like pure DC voltage. DC voltage is bad for speakers. Even though the speakers in this case are grossly over-rated for the head, they could burn out from these momentary injections of DC voltage. Tube amps tend to have trouble putting out actual square waves - for one reason and/or another - which is why we tend to prefer the sound of tube distortion to that created by solid-state devices. This is also why we can get away with pushing a tube amp into power amp distortion without frying the speakers as long as the speakers are rated to handle the output wattage. Solid state amps (like most PAs nowadays) are actually pretty good at creating nice flat square waves. This tends to sound pretty nasty, and will fry speakers, as I noted above. A speaker which is being driven with nice roundish (unclipped) waves will usually give you plenty of warning (by sounding very bad) before it blows from being over-powered. This gives you a chance to turn it down before causing serious damage. But send it one good blast of DC (or the square wave equivalent) and you get no warning. So it's not a bad idea to choose speakers for tube guitar amps which have a higher power handling than the amp can put out, at least if you want power tube distortion. It's also not a bad idea to choose a solid state amp for your PA which will put out more power than the speakers can handle. You won't want to turn it up all the way, but it will have plenty of headroom to avoid clipping even the biggest of transient peaks, and can actually save you in blown speakers. |
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Post by morbe on Jun 2, 2009 12:44:50 GMT -5
Yeah I found out about those speakers in the Cab. There really 200 watt but they can take a jolt of 600 watt. So i guess that mean there really 200 watt. but are protected incase you get a spike. But hell 200 watt is still better than 90 watt. I mean It's got to be louder.
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Post by sumgai on Jun 2, 2009 13:52:54 GMT -5
But hell 200 watt is still better than 90 watt. I mean It's got to be louder. No, that's not true at all. Did you read my above post about efficiency?  The wattage rating of a speaker is what it can handle, not what it produces - speakers are passive components. (Well, technically, they are transducers, they convert energy from one form to another - electromagnetic to mechanical.) But while putting more watts into a speaker will make it sound louder, putting twice the watts into a speaker with only half the efficiency as another will give you roughly the same perceived volume level. Higher wattage ratings are there for the simple fact that we want to pump more power into a speaker for a brief moment (to get higher fidelity for the pick attack transient), yet we don't want to melt it down to slag. Don't laugh, it's happened to many a surprised musician who didn't understand why there are ratings, and why it's really a good idea to match them whenever possible. Re-read ashcatlt's comments above, they're right on target vis-a-vis an amplifier putting too much into a speaker, versus too little power. Some of the details could stand some clarification, but his bottom line is correct - too little power can be just as bad for a speaker as too much. All of which means, matching ratings tends to make things sound better and last longer.  HTH sumgai |
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Post by morbe on Jun 3, 2009 8:34:36 GMT -5
Yeah I read all the posts but all that electrical jargon gets me lost. I appretiate all the insite but I need all that jargon broke down "meat and potatoe style" LOL if you know what I mean. Like I truley need the idiots guide to Guitar Amps and live sound if they have one. So I guess what you are trying to say is. if theoreticaly you have one Amp head that will transfer 100 watts to a one speaker cab. on a scale from soft to loud to louder it would be loud. But if you put a 200 watt head on a cab with two speakers and the amp was giving 200 watts of power to the speakers efficiently then really its like not going to be louder because you really just boubled the volume of the noise level in the first scenario? Increasing volume but not power. but still are in the loud range?
Okay when I talked to this guy he states that he has a 200 watt head. The CRATE BXH 220 from the online manuel "The
amplifier will deliver 220 watts into 4 ohms, or 150 watts into 8 ohms" but what thows me for a loop is ohms thing
Cab imp. 8 ohms #cabs 2 Total Imp 4 ohms
16 ohms #cabs 2 Total Imp 8 ohms
16 ohms #Cabs 4 Total Imp 4 ohms
"WHAT DOES THAT MEAN?"
Also like I said this guy rebuild G-K Cab with 4
pyle Speakers. PPA-10 its 200 watt RMS and 600 watt PMPO
The cab has 4x10 inch speakers so they guy states that this will give you more Punch. what does he mean by punch? Is that the pick attack?
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Post by sumgai on Jun 3, 2009 12:55:03 GMT -5
morbe, Whoa, that's a lotta questions! Lemme take 'em one at a time, but be aware that they related, so try to tie them together in your own mind, as we go along. Not quite, but close. First off, we haven't talked about noise until now, and for our purposes of talking about loudness and such, noise is not a factor. We can bring it in to the conversation later, but for now, it's just muddying the waters. Next, when we speak of a single source of sound, such as one cabinet, then we are dealing with a "baseline" for our measurements. When we introduce another speaker cabinet as an additional sound source, then we run into a phenomenon called "psychoacoustics". This is the branch of science that deals with how our brains interpret what we hear, and particularly for us, how we perceive volume levels when we are listening to more than one source of sound. The upshot, to put it in meat and potatoes language, is that if you spread the sound around from several sources, they won't appear to be individually louder, but collectively they will appear to be much louder. Which is ideal for a musician, because those same several sources also each tend to sound much more clearly - little or no distortion from one signal interfering with another signal right at the speaker itself (nor in the amplifier either). Now, to say that feeding two cabinets with twice the power is not really gonna double the level is hard to answer as "yes" or "no". As just noted, way too many variables must be considered, so let's just retreat to the single speaker sound source, OK? And by that I mean, we can have a number of individual speakers (Pyle calls them "drivers") within a single cabinet, and that's our single sound source for this discussion. It means that the amp can deliver so many watts into so much impedance. Adding more cabinets can, and usually does, change the impedance seen by the amplifier's output circuit. Your chart is correct where the cabinets are wired in parallel, which is the easiest way to connect them, so that's what most musicians do. Note that adding a cabinet reduced the impedance, thus the amplifier is able to deliver more power when needed. This doesn't mean that all sound is automatically louder, only those that need more power to be faithfully reproduced will be a bit louder, but that faifhfulness will make a world of difference to the listener - for the better, thankfully. Are you starting to see the real problem here? We can't just "double the numbers" and get louder. In fact, there's an easy way to remember what it takes to get louder - is the amplifier drawing more power from the mains? If it's still drawing only, say 100 watts, to feed all those speakers and all those cabinets, then the power put out by the amp is being divided up amongst them, not multiplied for each of them. Does this make sense to you? Yes, punch can be translated as pick attack, but more likely, he means that the bass will be more faithfully reproduced. (They are related, in a way.) Bass strings have more mass, and take longer to begin sounding out so that we can hear them. This means that by the time the signal gets through the amp and to the speakers, it sounds flabby - it's not a faithful reproduction. It turns out that cheap speakers are the culprit - they don't "transduce" correctly. Better speakers can do the job much more like what we expect, if we were able to hear the strings directly. Have you ever held a good bass guitar against your body and plucked the low E string? The body vibrated, a lot, right? That's what the speakers should be able to do, and cheap ones can't do it very well, if at all. We call that "flabby". But if an amp & speaker can make your guts quiver when the bass player hits a low E, then that combination is said to have punch (like you've just been punched in the stomach). On the whole of it, I'm of a mind to advise the following: If the impedance matches, then at least try it. It may sound "right" to you, it may not. If the impedance does not match, then pass it up. Wattage ratings (how much a speaker can handle) don't mean squat. All speakers are designed to accomplish a particular purpose, and Pyle does not make speakers intended for regular or bass guitars. They are high-fi units, and yes they can pump it out when installed into a rice-burner, but those cabinets are worlds apart from what you and I use on stage. Think about that for a moment..... Again, if you listen to the speakers as installed into the cabinet, and it sounds right to you, then by all means, go for it. Just because it's not what the manufacturer intended, that doesn't mean that you can't color outside the lines! ;D But the chances aren't real high of you getting a better sound than from a unit made explicitly for a bass. Plus, what's the cost of replacing one of those puppies, should it blow up on you?  Pyle carries a name that adds to the cost without adding to the benefit/value, just as other "top name brands" do. Just something to think about, that's all. And finally, unless you're playing The Coliseum, then you should ask yourself, do you really need more than one cabinet? The right cabinet will sound better, just as loud if not louder, will be less hassle to cart around and set up on the stage, and finally, will be cheaper to buy and maintain. Me? I feed a Gallien-Krueger 400RB into an Ampeg SVT 410HLF - goes down to 28Hz, which tends to fluff the bedroom pillows - in the neighbor's house!!  Now that's my definition of punch!! ;D HTH sumgai |
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Post by ashcatlt on Jun 3, 2009 13:19:27 GMT -5
Sumgai has basically been trying to explain that different speakers are harder to push than others. Using the same amp, a more efficient speaker will be louder (all other things being equal), than a less efficient speaker. It's possible for a 50 watt amp connected to a very efficient speaker to be louder at max volume than a 100 watter connected to a less efficient speaker. I was just answering the one question about matching ratings between amps and speakers, and I think sumgai summed that up pretty well. Now that we've cleared that up, let me confuse things just a little more. Double amp power will not give you double the percieved volume, even if the speakers have similar efficiency ratings. This is because we're working with a logarithmic scale. Theoretically, it actually takes 10 times the amp power to get a doubling of SPL output. This is why we tend to prefer log (or "audio") tapered pots for volume knob applications. Then there's your new question re: impedance. When you connect multiple resistances in parallel (the easy way to connect multiple cabs to a single amp) the total overal resistance "seen" by the amp will be equal to the reciprocal of the sum of the reciprocals of the individual resistances. R(total) = 1/(1/R1 + 1/R2 + ...) It works out to where if you combine two equal resistances in parallel, you get half the resistance. Impedance is not eactly the same thing as resistance, but in this equation they are basically interchangeable. |
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Post by morbe on Jun 4, 2009 8:18:07 GMT -5
yeah I sort of figured that out.
So I have been reading a lot of reviews of the Crate BXh 220
Some good some bad. Well really the only thing bad I hear is at loud volumes it tends to distort a little. I play hard rock so Im sure It wont be that bad will it. Or are we talking about an entirley different kind of distortion. Any how this only angered half the people in the other half dont seem to mind. I figure I'd get the Head and 4x10 cab. and then later doen the road I can get a 1x15 cab to add getting full 220 watt.
I noticed that on the back of the head there are two outputs for speakers. are the both used for each speaker cab?
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Post by newey on Jun 4, 2009 15:22:56 GMT -5
Well, if you have one cab, you would use one or the other of the output jacks, not both. If you have 2 or more cabs, you would use both jacks. There is a little impedance chart printed right underneath the jacks, very handy. It tells you, as we've discussed here, that the 2 jacks are wired in parallel, and thus if you connect 2 8Ω cabs, one to each jack, the result is 4Ω. If you have 2 16Ω cabs, the total combined impedance is 8&Omega, etc. It also warns against using less than a 4Ω load. Make sure you do not drop below 4Ω. An example: If you plugged 2 8Ω cabs into each jack, for a total of 4 cabs, that would be only 2Ω and may damage your amp. 4 16Ω cabs would be 4 Ω total, which is OK. Again, this assumes all the cabs are in parallel.
To get the full 220 watts requires the use of 4Ω total load, whether it's one cabinet, or 2 or more.
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Post by cynical1 on Jun 4, 2009 15:37:31 GMT -5
For reference, I have a Crate BX-220H bass amp. This thing will drive a 2x10 w/horn, or 2x15" cabinets with ease. I've tried the 2x10 and 2x15 simultaneously. Aside from the wife's strong protests, it handled it without breathing hard at all. The attack was crisp and as long as I monitored the gain I never drove it into distortion in the 50' x 100' barn I was playing it in.
I know, whenever you mention Crate everyone sneers and turns their nose up, but for a 20 year old amp this thing is bombproof. The effects loops is very handy as well. With the EQ built in it handles a guitar with greater ease.
Just me 2 cents.
Happy Trails
Cynical One
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Post by morbe on Jun 5, 2009 10:28:35 GMT -5
that's awesome to know. it's just a matter of saving some money to get this stack. but I hoping it will be good enough to not have to rely on the privately own PA.
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Post by ChrisK on Jun 5, 2009 21:58:15 GMT -5
Oh, and you're worried about the effects of electrical things on farm animals?
Them cows are spouting orange juice by now.
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Post by newey on Jun 5, 2009 22:04:33 GMT -5
No cows were harmed in the making of that recording. They had earplugs. |
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Post by ChrisK on Jun 5, 2009 22:11:36 GMT -5
But, like the Energizer Bunny, now they just keep on going and going....
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Post by sumgai on Jun 6, 2009 0:34:24 GMT -5
But, like the Energizer Bunny, now they just keep on going and going.... I think it's more like "keeps on moooing and moooing..." Kinda reminds me of that Troggs song: "Wild Thing, I think you really mooooooo me!" |
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Post by cynical1 on Jun 6, 2009 9:53:30 GMT -5
Oh, and you're worried about the effects of electrical things on farm animals? All proper wiring and grounding has been inspected and certified to "Meet or exceed Code" in the house and all outbuildings...it was a conditional clause I set in our offer to buy this place three years ago...they dropped just over three grand into new panels and various other upgrades and removals of sub-code service. The PSC had to do an onsite to verify and certify there was no stray voltage from the rework. ...and who do you think was sitting in on guitar and keyboards...the people here all play country...only the cows rock...though I do prefer a Paso Fino on the drums...after all, they are a 4 beat gaited horse... Happy Trails Cynical One |
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Post by ChrisK on Jun 6, 2009 22:06:49 GMT -5
That's a really cool albeit twitchy horse that you got there. How much did you save off of the price of a normal horse? ;D ;D If that thing tried to gallop, it'd probably explode. |
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Post by cynical1 on Jun 6, 2009 22:24:34 GMT -5
That's a really cool albeit twitchy horse that you got there. That's not a twitch, it's a bridle. ;D Actually, they're about 3-8 times the cost of a standard trail quarter horse. The trick is to buy them as foals right after weaning. What you see in the video is the Fino gait. A very fast walk. They also have a Corto, similar in speed to a trot and a Largo, which is slightly faster, as a rule, then a cantor. The "gait" part comes in as they only have one foot off the ground at a time while they are in gait. That's why the rider doesn't bounce. They can also trot and cantor and gallop. My horse has outrun 17hh Standardbred and Westfalians. Speed is relative though, some horses have it and some don't. Ok, everyone out to the paddock with a rake and a wheelbarrow...time for lesson 2... Happy Trails Cynical One |
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Post by ChrisK on Jun 6, 2009 22:45:06 GMT -5
So, can you play bass while you're riding it?
If'n you find a lead guitarist, the two of you could be a power trio.
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Post by cynical1 on Jun 6, 2009 23:17:24 GMT -5
Yes, I imagine you could play and ride...provided you were wireless. But in this case, with a guitarist and bassist on Paso Finos it would be a power brio... Happy Trails Cynical One |
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Speaker efficiency is rarely mentioned in these halls, but the fact is, two speakers can sit side-by-side and have completely different output levels, from the same amp, due simply to how well they translate the incoming signal into mechanical motion. Chris referred obliquely to this with "cone excursion", one of the criteria making up the speaker efficiency rating.
Pyle carries a name that adds to the cost without adding to the benefit/value, just as other "top name brands" do. Just something to think about, that's all.
Now that's my definition of punch!! ;D