Check Out My Wiring Schematics

[cghoyt]

Hello again guys,
I drew up this schematic kind of as a final product. It's a Les Paul body and I'm going to have to cut another hole to make room for that P-90. I'm also going to put that DPDT switch in the big cavity in the center of all of the pots, kind of how it's like in the picture. The SPDT switch is a kill switch by the way. I also havent drawn out the grounding routes yet, so if you guys have some advice, i'd love it. I'll ask more questions after you guys check this out.
Thanks a bunch again,
Christopher



EDIT: Disregard that slanted black line through the bottom of the picture, I guess when I uploaded the photo it put it there. Sorry.
EDIT ONCE AGAIN: Well now it seems the black slant line is gone. What in the world.

[jimplaysguitar]

Hmmmm *scratches chin*

Your pickup switching idea confuses me.

But, the kill switch should be wired like this..



To prevent your amp from humming when the switch is off.

Jim

[UnklMickey]

Christopher,

the first improvement i'd make would be to move the connection of the wire that goes to the output jack, connect it to pole (center lug) of the SPDT. then one throw connects to the selector switch, the other to ground.

there are big problems with the DPDT.

before we go any farther, could you please make a list of all 9 combinations of the selector switch. for each of these, indicate which pickup(s) is(are) selected. it would be easier if you differentiate between the Gretsch pickups. like call one neck and the other bridge or something.

lastly,

is stengal really gay, or is he just effeminate?

[jimplaysguitar]

unklmickey said:

the first improvement i'd make would be to move the connection of the wire that goes to the output jack, connect it to pole (center lug) of the SPDT. then one throw connects to the selector switch, the other to ground.

I should really stop editing as you're posting, lol.

Jim

[UnklMickey]

jimplaysguitar said:

...I should really stop editing as you're posting, lol......

only way to fix that would be to have multiple windows, so every one could see in real time, what everyone else was typing. doubt that's gonna happen.

[cghoyt]

Ahhh, thanks a whole bunch thus far guys. Thanks for clearing up that kill switch, I wasn't sure how to wire it in off position to keep the amp from buzzing, and now I do. Joy.

Here is the combonation picture for the pickup selection. It's just a standard 3 toggle switch with the DPDT. Hope nothing is confusing, I labled the wire routes to the switches to hopefully make things clearer.



A no, Stengel isn't gay, as far as my friends and I know. And sorry for some of the pics in the photobucket if you guys see them, they were wanting me to put up some pictures from a Dallas trip we took a while back.

[UnklMickey]

cghoyt said:

... I labled the wire routes to the switches to hopefully make things clearer...

yeah, it does.

unfortunately, you wont get the results you wanted.

the first 3 are o.k. (dpdt with the upper throw connected)

the next 3 will be p-90 with both pots, regardless of which position the selector is in. also if EITHER pot is at min, no sound.

the last 3 will be all pickups with both pots, regardless of which position the selector is in. also if EITHER pot is at min, no sound.

a big part of the problem here, is the jumper between the bottom throws of the dpdt.

now that i know what you want, i'll give this some thought overnight and see if i can come up with something close to what you want.

or maybe someone else might have a revelation tonight.



EDIT:

the term "with both pots, regardless of which position the selector is in." probably isn't the best way to describe what happens here. if the selector is in the neck only, or bridge only position, you'll only get throughput from the corresponding pot.

but the loading through the wiper to ground of the opposite pot will affect the level, especially if the opposite pot is at a low or minimum setting.

also BOTH tone controls will be "engaged".

[jimplaysguitar]

I believe these two selections are going to do the same thing, select all of the pickups, because your p90 is connecting both sides of the switch.



Therefore, letting the signal through to the side you don't want to use. I could be wrong, wait for confirmation. ;D

Jim

[UnklMickey]

looks like we're doin' it again.

guess you won't have to wait long for confirmation eh! .:lol:.

[jimplaysguitar]

unklmickey said:

guess you won't have to wait long for confirmation eh! .:lol:.

;D

[cghoyt]

dang, never thought about that bottom connect from the middle pickup bridging over. i'll see if i can also think of a solution so i'll head back to the drawing board (pen on computer paper). thanks for the help guys, and i'm open to any sort of suggestion, like any combo of switches to get what I'm looking for.
Also, as you were saying about the 2nd group of 3, I dont mind so much that both pots will be on. I hear 2 500k pots equal a 250k pot which is what i hear single coils do well on (correct me if i'm wrong?).
Thanks a whole lot once again for all this help. This will save me a good amount of frustration

[UnklMickey]

a single coil with a 500k pot would just be a bit brighter.

the bigger problem is both tone pots being enabled, and the wipers of both volume pots being connected. that would make things REAL clumsy. we'll want to avoid that.

[jimplaysguitar]

What i've drawn is my idea, giving you all your options still (i think). WIll it work? I do not know. ;D

The switch marked with a "1" is basicly a "middle on" switch, but a DPDT on/off/on switch, which "on" possition you use depends on the possition of your pickup selector switch.

The switch marked with "2" is a push pull pot, this will turn off your neck pickup, if you want to use the P-90 by itself.

The selections would be:

Selector in neck possition...
P-90 switch off, push-pull switch "pushed" - neck
P-90 switch on, push-pull switch "pushed" - neck + P-90
P-90 switch on, push-pull switch "pulled" - P-90

Selector in bridge possition...
P-90 switch off - Bridge
P-90 switch on - Bridge + P-90

Selector in middle...
P-90 switch off - Neck + Bridge
P-90 switch on - Neck + P-90 + Bridge

I don't know if this is right. Once again, confirmation, lol.

One question to anyone, can you put a mini toggle on a rear routed guitar? I've only used them on strats, where the pickguard is thin enough to mount a mini toggle.

Jim

[UnklMickey]

Jim,

i had a hard time figuring out what to do with this thing.

i think you got off to a good start, but you started to take a wrong turn somewhere.

things get real messy when you tie the pickups directly together through the switches.

you lose the ability to independently control the volumes of them.

i'll bet you'll have a hard time selling that to the customer (Christopher).



Lets look at this a different way.

we probably can't accomplish all the goals with just one additional switch.

so let's make one switch the "which one".

and the other "whether or not" (decides if we use both stock pickups, or if ONE of the pickups is replaced by a p-90)

does this sound reasonable Christopher?



we'll need 2 DPDTs. (2 position)

they can be either toggles or push-pull. we'll let Christopher decide.

the wires to the wipers of the pots (and nothing else) go to the throws of the "which one" switch.



if you're up to the challenge Jim, take it from there. (i'll help along the way if you need it.)



unk




EDIT:

i just noticed that one thing that won't be included is all three at the same time. is that a "deal-breaker"?


2nd EDIT:

another possiblity would be to "steal" one of the tone pots.
the other one becomes a master tone. the one we steal would become a 3rd volume pot for the p-90. and we add just 1 additional switch (a second selector - p-90, both, whats-selected-by-the-original-selector)

variation on above: leave the stock pots as is, add 2 more and the additional selector. now you have 3 volumes, 3 tones, and 2 selectors. (sounds over the top to me, but it's possible, and easy to wire. might require quite a shoe-horn though!)

[jimplaysguitar]

Hmmm, I'll think about it in my sleep, it's 3:53am here, lol.
Goodnight. ;D

Jim

[cghoyt]

Hey jim and unk,
The way jim's schematic is looking seems to be looking nice. Im not too concerned about controling the volume for the p-90 and gretsch neck pickup independently. In my original design I had intended for non-indepent vol controls.

Though it would be pretty cool to be able to control all 3 pickups' volume independently, i'd much rather have the ability to have all 3 pickups on at the same time.

Also, is it going to be a problem drilling a whole between all of the pots through the maple top to mount the dpdt switch or the kill switch?

EDIT: By the way, where did you guys get that cool program to map out the schematics you all are doing?

[UnklMickey]

would you trade a one tone control, for independent volumes and all 3 pickups?



Runewalker or JohnH had a post about drilling the holes. it'll be tricky 'cause the mini-toggles have a short bushing.

[jimplaysguitar]

cghoyt said:

By the way, where did you guys get that cool program to map out the schematics you all are doing?

Well, i stole this schematic..
static.zoovy.com/img/guitarelectronics/-/wdu_hh3t22_02
And edited it in Paint, lol.

Jim

[jimplaysguitar]

unklmickey said:

would you trade a one tone control, for independent volumes and all 3 pickups?

Master Tone is always the way to go for me, but that's me, lol.

[UnklMickey]

if Christopher is onboard with that, it gets WAY easy.

[jimplaysguitar]

unklmickey said:

if Christopher is onboard with that, it gets WAY easy.

It does? I can't think of anything. Lol.

[cghoyt]

Hmmm, 3 vols and master tone... hmmm. Thats a good option. I'll have to think about it. It does sound kinda cool though, and it'd be a different change from what i'm use too on my other guitars. Since i'm gonna put speed nobs, i can just change the tone real quick.

Also, where is that thread about drilling holes, i cant seem to find it.

Thanks a bunch, so far all of this brainstorming is making me randy.

[UnklMickey]

well here's what that would look like:



the switch just to the left of the kill switch is a 3 position ON-ON-ON type.

so you would get:

..........NECK ........................NECK + P-90.....................P-90

....NECK + BRIDGE..........NECK + BRIDGE + P-90...........P-90

.........BRIDGE......................BRIDGE + P-90...................P-90


for your 9 combinations








runewalkers reply (reply#7) on this thread will be useful:
guitarnuts2.proboards45.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=wiring&thread=1129066935&page=1

i don't know of a source for the reach-nuts that i spoke of.

[cghoyt]

Hey unk,
is there a way i can limit the number of switches on the surface of the guitar to 1. i have a diagram drawn up using 3 push pull pots with the one spdt kill switch. i'll post it up here in a bit so you all can check it. i think it'll give the same desired affects.

Thanks abunch for the refrences.

[UnklMickey]

this oughta do it:





switch to the left is on a push-pull pot (2 position)

the kill switch is 3 position (ON-OFF-ON)

when the kill is in the center position, the push-pull selects stock selections OR p-90 only.

when its in the new position, you get p-90 PLUS whatever is on the selector

(regardless of whether the push-pull is up or down)

(when the push-pull is pulled)


99 and ⁴⁴/₁₀₀% sure this is what you want and that it will work. but i'm getting punchy. time to pull the plug for the night. maybe someone else will proofread and/or offer other suggestions.

!manana!

[jimplaysguitar]

Way to alter my drawing. LOL.

Jim

[UnklMickey]

jimplaysguitar said:

Way to alter my drawing. LOL.

Jim

yeah,

it does seem a bit rude of me, taking your nice clean drawing, smudging it up from jpg-bmp-edit-jpg conversions, erasing things, scribblin' new stuff in, and all that.

but i think we're gettin' pretty close to having a finished idea here.

when the dust settles on this magilla, are you interested in going back a couple of steps, and making the finished drawing and text. we can polish things up here on this thread, and get it read for "the show".

since it was your work i started with here (and the original was pretty clean looking), it would be appropriate if you were to post it on the schematics page.


unk

[jimplaysguitar]

I don't understand

If Christopher is happy with three independent volumes, and a master tone, and he's happy with your schematic.
I could draw it out neatly with text. Is that what you mean?

Jim

[UnklMickey]

jimplaysguitar said:

I don't understand

If Christopher is happy with three independent volumes, and a master tone, and he's happy with your schematic.
I could draw it out neatly with text. Is that what you mean?

Jim

well, from the original drawing we know you could draw it out neatly.

what i mean is: would you?

unk

[cghoyt]

hey unk,

that looks to be the right config for me, but you said when the kill switch is in the new top position, the p-90 will be active regardless or the position of the push/pull pot? perhaps i'm just blind, but wont it only be active in the pull position, because otherwise it wont be on the center lug for the on/off/on kill switch.

and also, are there any other cool little sound altering mods i can use say with 2 other push/pull pots, such as series/parallel, or anything of the sort.

and once again, I can't thank you guys enough for helping me out here.

Christopher