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Post by Yogi B on Jan 8, 2019 14:13:01 GMT -5
What I make of the three incorrect positions (1, 3 & 4) would seem to imply that somehow the neck pickup ground lead was somehow connected to either middle pickup ground lead or the purple (blue on the diagram) wire coming off the middle switch, but that would also mean that row 6 would result in M + N.
Oh, and with as much as I can tell from your pictures everything looks right, and taking another look I can't see an obvious place where the above would occur.
But taking that second, look I've thought of something else: are you doing the measurements with the pickguard assembled to the guitar; and if so have you cut the grounding connection on (all) the pickup claws yet?
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Post by solderburn on Jan 8, 2019 14:34:24 GMT -5
Thanks! I'm taking the measurements with the temporary pickguard on. It's just a piece of cardstock until my little brother gets a real one custom made, probably from pickguardian.com.
And no, i didn't cut all the grounding connections on all the claws, i believe i only severed it on the bridge PU. And i haven't soldered anything to the severed connection. Sooooooo. I feel like a total idiot. But also quite happy that you're making such great headway at finding my mistakes.
I must go to work now, but i'll be thinking about this all day and open up the guitar when i get back home.
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Post by solderburn on Jan 9, 2019 3:43:35 GMT -5
The new readings after severing all claws and grounding them to the output jack....
old new 1 DDDD 17.09 0.L 2 DDDU 17.07 17.25 3 DDUD 14.02 16.95 4 DUDD 6.15 11.97 5 UDDD 2.36 2.38 6 DUUD 5.84 5.87 7 DDUU 11.08 11.20 8 UUDD 3.00 3.01 9 DUDU 6.12 6.16 10 UDUD 3.84 3.86 11 UUUD 5.89 5.86 12 UDUU 11.08 11.19 13 DUUU 0.00 0.00 14 UUDU 6.12 6.16 15 UDDU 3.96 3.98 16 UUUU 0.00 0.00
Also i'm now getting readings that look relatively normal for the middle positions and out-of-phase selections, compared to before when i was getting readings that were below 1.00. Cool.
It's late at night here so i can't plug it in to an amp 'till tomorrow morning. hmmm. i think it's getting closer to being correct. Thanks all for your awesome help so far. not sure why i'm now getting 0.L on the all down setting with 20k. When i switch it to 200k i then get 22.7.
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Post by sumgai on Jan 9, 2019 11:06:32 GMT -5
'burn,
OL (not 0.L) means "out of limits". It means that your range is set too low, which was proven by your switching to 200KΩ, then getting a usable reading.
Most general purpose meters are called "2½ digit" units. This convention comes from the fact that a meter can go up to a reading of 1.99, but then "runs out of range". Similarly, a 3½ digit meter can go up to 1.999. Some meters can go up to 4 digits of resolution, but those are more costly. The 2 refers to the number of digits to the right of the decimal point*, and the ½ refers to the number of possible-to-display units to the left of the deciimal point. And yes, there are such things as 3¾ meters, they can display either 0, 1, 2, or 3 in the left-most digit, with 3 digits of resolution to the right of the decimal point. (Want an industrial-strength unit with lab-quality accuracy? You can can mortgage your home for a 6¾ unit, should you so desire.)
And of course, there's the auto-ranging meter, which is almost always digital. It lights up an indicator on the readout to tell you what range was used, thus reducing your time to take a reading.
HTH
EDITed to add: Sometimes you'll see a meter that can go up to 2.99, and it will be called a 2½ design. Technically, that should be called a 22⁄3 unit, because the left-most digit can read out as 0, 1, or 2. To break down that fraction, the numerator is the highest value that can be displayed, and the denominator is the total number of possible values that can be displayed.
sumgai
* Yes, I know, it's properly called a radix point, but in meters, the reading is always in decades, hence.....
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Post by solderburn on Jan 9, 2019 11:55:46 GMT -5
Hello, thank you, Sumgai! I'm learning a lot here on Guitarnutz! This project is my first big guitar wiring project and troubleshooting experience, i came to the right place!
Now i just need to learn how to take that knowledge and apply it to troubleshooting why my PU selection is giving me such a reading when it's not expected to.
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Post by Yogi B on Jan 9, 2019 12:40:58 GMT -5
When i switch it to 200k i then get 22.7 Which is roughly what we'd expect based on the values of the individual pickups, the positions with all three pickups in series are the only ones which should be over 20k: as Bridge ≈ 11k, Middle ≈ 6.2k, Neck ≈ 5.9k the resistance of all three in series is (roughly) 11k + 6.2k + 5.9k = 23.1k, (yes, that's a little higher than your reading, but that's because your not just measuring the pickups in isolation, but the pickups in parallel with the volume control which has a small effect on the measured values) OL (not 0.L) means "out of limits". Interesting, I tend to read it as "over limit", "open loop", or "one of the damn test leads has worked loose again" depending on the circumstances -- out of limits on the low side just reads zero. That notation has always bugged me, but I guess it's better than having to deal with logarithms, i.e. 0.00 -> 1.99 having log 10(200) ≈ 2.301 decimal digits of precision.
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Post by solderburn on Jan 9, 2019 13:45:51 GMT -5
YES!!!!! You guys are AWESOME!!! It works. As it should. And sounds really cool. First song i played on it was "Now I'm Here". Huge thank you to thetrajichero, newey, JohnH, sumgai, and especially Yogi B!!! I owe you gentlemen. Let me know if you're ever in Orange county California and need anything. It's a pure pleasure for me to be here as part of this forum, thank you all for sharing your skills and time with me. And i hope some other newbie in the future will find this thread useful. I will share a youtube video of my little brother playing on this beast. And when we get the custom decals for the headstock they will have mention of guitarnutz in fine print. You guys are really amazing. THANK YOU!
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Post by JohnH on Jan 9, 2019 14:13:47 GMT -5
Congrats! You just wired up one of the most complex switching schemes from this side of the galaxy! What next?
So what's the most interesting non-standard tone that you've found?
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Post by solderburn on Jan 9, 2019 14:33:29 GMT -5
Congrats! You just wired up one of the most complex switching schemes from this side of the galaxy! What next? So what's the most interesting non-standard tone that you've found? Not sure what's next. I have squier bass VI that i'd like to hot rod. Just looking for the right limetreuse flake, it needs to be very large flake. .025'' or bigger, and very bright. And I think i'd like to try a wiring variation similar to the one we just did, except use slide switches. I'll be scouring guitarnutz for the next rad scheme. I love the tone of neck + bridge in parallel for a clean tone. And when i'm rock'n i love bridge+middle in series, then for scorching leads i like to use neck out of phase against the bridge and middle in phase in series, very Brian May. I have a Brian May special, and a fender cyclone II, the special is in series, and the cyclone has 3 Jaguar PUs in parallel, so this latest guitar is sort of like combining them both. I noticed my little brother really likes my Brian May guitar so that's why i thought to do this project with him, although i did most of the work, of course with all of the help from guitarnutz. Man what a ride. Honestly, i could die today and be happy.
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Post by sumgai on Jan 11, 2019 0:22:13 GMT -5
OL (not 0.L) means "out of limits". Interesting, I tend to read it as "over limit", "open loop", or "one of the damn test leads has worked loose again" depending on the circumstances -- out of limits on the low side just reads zero. Ya know..... I always forget that "over limit" description. I blame it on too much TV in the '60s - Twilight Zone, Outer Limits, etc. You know the drill.
Jeez, Yogi, a logarithmic display would definitely be "out of limits"! sumgai
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