Wiring Squier Stratocaster with HSH Lace Alumitones HELP!

[markt62]

Hello everyone, I have a Squier Stratocaster that I bought used and have been fixing up. So I bought me some Lace Alumitones and I am trying to wire the pick guard I have been trying for many moons. I can not find a wiring diagram and my electric skills stop at following directions. I was hoping even though I am brand new to your forum you might help me. I have a basic wiring diagram from lace for these pickups.

cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0...cker_Single_Single_with_Split_Diagram.pdf?235

and I have the wiring I found here which is not what I am trying to do but is close.

guitarnuts2.proboards.com/thread/7342/wiring-diagramm-super-switch-push

I have searched for weeks but not found a diagram that uses the special wiring of these Alumitone pickups and I have run out of options Please help me. I have some much money in this Squier trying to do this and I have everything I need this time but know how.

I would like it to look like this starting with standard Stratocaster setup.

HSH - Fender Super Switch, 3 posts Push/Pull, 1 Volume, 2 tone. If I don't need all 3 push/pulls that is fine have none push/pull pots as well.

1. Neck Pickup Split
2. Neck Pickup Split & Middle
3. middle
4. Bridge Pickup Split & Middle
5. Bridge Pickup

and

1. Neck H
2. Neck H & Middle
3. middle
4. Bridge H & Middle
5. Bridge H

1. Neck H & Bridge H
2. Neck H Split & Bridge H Split
3 Neck H Split & Middle & Bridge H Split
4. Neck H & Middle & Bridge H

That is were and I am trying to get or as close as possible. I have been looking for weeks and I really could use your help Please!

[jhng]

Hello. Sorry to hear that you are struggling with it. I've suggested a straightforward way of doing what you intend below. You only need to use two push/pulls and you don't need to use the superswitch.

First, do look at the Lace Alumitone wiring diagrams and make sure you know what wire is what: cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0026/5469/9593/files/Alumitone_Humbucker_Normal_Split_Wiring_Diagram.pdf?235



Then proceed as follows:

1. Wire the guitar like a normal stratocaster and using the stock stratocaster switch, except swap two of the pots for push/pulls (don't connect the push/pull switches to anything yet). There are lots of diagrams for stock stratocaster wiring. Be careful to make sure that you are following the Alumitone wiring guide linked above.

2. Use one of the push/pulls to do a double coil split on the two humbuckers. There will be diagrams for this on the internet for sure as it is very common. It looks like the Alumitone humbuckers have only one coil split wire, the white one. The push/pull has six lugs in a little 2x3 grid on it. Wire one white wire to each of the central pair of lugs. With one of the other pairs, wire them together and then to the ground (often stock wiring uses the back of the volume pot for a ground connection). Which pair you use for the ground connection will determine whether the coils are split when the push/pull is down or when it is up.

3. Use the other push/pull for a 'Neck on' switch. Again, diagrams all over the internet as this is basically the most common strat mod. Find the lug on the main switch where the hot from the Neck is connected. Take a wire from that lug to a centre lug on the push/pull. Take a wire from the neighbouring 'outside' lug, attach it to the lug on the volume pot where the hot from the main switch is attached.

Stages 2 and 3 can both be done after the guitar is already wired as a standard strat. So can do the standard wiring, test it out and then proceed with the additions as a second phase.

What you will then have is:

1. Bridge
2. Bridge + Middle
3. Middle
4. Middle + Neck
5. Neck

Plus:

A push/pull that converts the two humbuckers into single coils and vice-versa (whenever they are selected)
A push/pull that always turns on the Neck pickup giving the following:

1. Bridge + Neck
2. Bridge + Middle + Neck
3. Middle + Neck
4. Middle + Neck
5. Neck

I think that if you find diagrams online for standard stratocaster wiring, double coil-split and 'neck-on' switch you will be able to work it out from there.

[markt62]

Thanks for helping it is much appricarined. It has been one of those projects that just keeps on taking money until it's gone. I have bought 3 switches for this guitar the first two where the $40 kind I have two Freeway switches B0501 and B0502 because they said I had to buy the sencond to do the splitting then it won't split these pickups. Then a $20 dollar Fender Super switch because I was told it would work. To shorten this long and bitchy story I really need to use the super switch I have hundreds of dollars spent on this project and I have to use what I got. I don't mean to turn down help an pd hope I'm not.

I will say I have really enjoyed learning and doing the setup and fret work as well as this has made this guitar mine and I have so much more knowledge then I did before but I have enough part to build and setup another strat if only to sell now I need to get this guitar working before I go broke.

I read you can not run the Alumitones in series or parallel but on the wiring for the single it says you can.

cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0026/5469/9593/files/Lace_Sensor_Alumitone_Single_Coil_Diagram.pdf?235

the above drawing indicates that they can be don't know for sure but if yes we can add those to any of the switches used. I left them out because I read you could not do that.

Again you guy are life savers!
Mark

[newey]

Nov 22, 2021 18:48:09 GMT -5 markt62 said:

I read you can not run the Alumitones in series or parallel but on the wiring for the single it says you can

The link is for the single-coil alumatones, not the HB. The link doesn't say anything about series versus parallel wiring The link mentions splitting the coil and wiring it out of phase, series /parallel wiring is not mentioned.

And, in looking at the wiring, it would appear that you could not wire the HB versions in series or parallel, as this is not the standard, 4-conductor HB wiring (even though there are 4 wires coming off the coil, one is a shield/ground wire, so really only three that alter the connections to the coils.)

[markt62]

Thanks!

[jhng]

Nov 22, 2021 18:48:09 GMT -5 markt62 said:

I really need to use the super switch I have hundreds of dollars spent on this project and I have to use what I got.

You can certainly do it with a superswitch (and more as well). However, if still have the stock Squier switch and it is in good condition, you could also use that with the mod I outlined above. Then you could ebay your three unused expensive switches and get some cash back.

If you decide to do it with the Superswitch, then you can also opt for something a bit more tailored to your specific needs. For example, a push/pull that splits the HBs but only in certain position 2, 4 and 5 so that you get an HSS configuration, with both of the 'in between' positions split, and then use a second pot to split the Bridge in position 1 for true strat.

The 'Neck on' switch could also work in a more tailored way, potentially. For example, I think you could probably do it like this:

1. B(hb)
2. B(hb) + N(hb) (like Les Paul middle position)
3. B(hb) + M + N(hb)
4. B(sc) + N(sc) (like Tele middle position)
5. N(hb)

if you are going to use the Superswitch if gives lots more flexibility, so do take the time to think about what would actually be convenient when playing the guitar. Then I'm sure someone can you whip up a diagram.

[markt62]

Thanks, I am learning a Lot but I started this part because I was interested in getting as many sounds as possible because I want to play and get a chance to hear a sampling of a lot of guitar sounds. I may be a Strat guy or a Telecaster guy et. et.. I also have learned so much replacing the tremolo bridge and the tuners and the tremolo Block. Wow before these changes the guitar was out of tune after just a few min. I also could not tell where the vibrations were suppose to come from. I felt the block the wood and could not feel much of anything then after the work the hole guitar vibrates WOW what a difference. I also redid the fretboard sand and level frets, work on edges a little, replace Nut, Dress and polish Fret board as well as check and adjust neck. Now rewiring but to say that there is a big difference in what I brought home from Guitar Center Used for $85 is an understatement. Now the electric and pickups and I am so looking forward to hearing it. I have a pickguard that looks good.



I am a little hooked it seams.



Down to it, I know it is a big ask but if someone could draw one up I would lavish thank you upon you and return that favor anywhere I can. I am good with computers - networks and other things. Anyway it would sure help. I have looked for something already and I have picked a HSH Strat config as suggested. I have already got the humbuckers split with one switch so I will change that and I am armed with a voltmeter this has got me this far. I follow directions well and I would love to really have a super Stratocaster to enjoy all it nuance's. I ramble I'll work on that..
 
Mark

[jhng]

So, maximum versatility and exploration of sounds. Would this work for you:

Five-way controls Neck and Bridge:

1. Bridge
2. Bridge x Neck (series and out of phase)
3. Bridge + Neck (Parallel)
4. Bridge x Neck (series)
5. Neck

Volume 1 - Volume for N and B (on the five-way)
Volume 2 - Volume for Middle (so it can be blended with the five-way or stand on its own if the five-way is turned down).
Tone control - single master tone control

Push/pull 1 - Coil split on Neck
Push/pull 2 - Coil split on Bridge
Push/pull 3 - phase switch on Middle

Since you are potentially combining a SC Middle with HBs, having separate vols might help balance the differing output levels

If that would work for you, I can point you towards relevant diagrams.

[jhng]

Alternatively, here is a simpler set up that is more classic and may be easier to use in practice. Still a full range of traditional Strat, Tele and Les Paul combinations.

1. Bridge (hb)
2. Bridge (single) + Mid
3. Bridge (hb) + Neck (hb)
4. Neck (single) + Mid
5. Neck (hb)

1, 3 and 5 are the classic positions from an HH guitar like an LP. 2 and 4 are the classic in between positions from a stray (the ‘Strat quack’ positions).

Push/Pull 1 - Coil split on Neck in 3 and 5
Push/Pull 2 - Coil split on Bridge in 1 and 3
Push/Pull 3 - Adds Middle to 1, 3 and 5. Switches 2 to Middle only.

I can do you a diagram for that.

[markt62]

As Neway pointed out the Alumitone pickups do not do some of that. I don't think they will do the series /parallel but they will do Phase. I would be intreated in all the sounds except the things they won't do. I would like the standard Strat sounds on the first five if possible so all shut down, it would work like always and then the rest of the sounds in what ever order needed. Happy Turkey day to all and I have a Birthday on Friday no biggie just another day but I might get that Gretsch I Have hinted at. LOL! No it won't happen and I would want my Strat anyway!






 

[jhng]

The Alumitone pickups will do series/parallel in combination with other pickups. However, they will not do parallel configuration within the pickup between the two coils of the humbucker. Anyway, since you have two humbuckers already, extra series combinations will be less useful anyway. On an SSS guitar they add really useful humbucker-like sounds, but with HSH you have that already.

You say that with all pots down, you want it to be normal Strat. Do you mean with single coils instead of humbuckers for the 'all down' position? That's doable. But since you have HBs it would be more normal to retain HBs in 'all down' position. You should consider retaining HB at least for the Bridge pickup in the 'all down' position, like on an HSS strat, which has become a classic configuration.

Also, how much do you like the Middle pickup on its own? Lots of people very rarely use it on its own and so swapping position 3 for something else in the standard 'all down' setting, like N+B (which is classic Tele or LP middle position depending on whether split or not) is often a very useful tweak. You can still have the option of middle pickup on its own by pulling up pots, like in my second suggestion above.

[gckelloch]

You should also consider which model of Alumitone HB you have. The standard HB model is listed as having a 1.4H inductance. That's ~1/4 the value of a typical PAF. That generally means they can get high-end extension into the 8kHz+ range with a low capacitance cable, like a Filtertron neck pickup, so there's really no need to wire one in parallel mode. The standard SC model is listed as 3H. They should have essentially the same core-induced efficiency and high-end roll-off, so the output shouldn't be much different, but the lower inductance of two parallel-wired pickups will dominate. So, using just one ~0.75H coil of the HB should then be even more dominant in parallel with the 3H SC model. If you do want an SC sound from either HB, I'd look into wiring a resistor on a switch in the path of just one of the coils of that HB to achieve a SC-like sound without affecting the inductance. It may then balance better with the 3H SC. Otherwise, forgo coil-splitting altogether and go with a switchable HOoP blend option or something like that. Newey had just recommended the Schaeller "M" model Megaswitch as a better quality Superswitch. I'd consider that instead of the Oak Grisby/Fender.

[newey]

gckelloch-

markt62 already bought the Superswitch, so he wants to use that.

Call me contrary, but I've always liked the middle only setting on Strat-ish guitars. So jhng's idea of a push/pull to add the middle to 1,3,5, but then to get it alone in position 2 is interesting. Most designs we've see that use a switch to add the middle to the 5-way lose the middle-only option

[Deleted]

Im falling a sleep at work

Thats better

SORRY
Angellahash's's first diagram requires a Superswitch and a DPDT switch (which could be a push/pull pot).
The second requires 3 DPDT switches (which could be push/pulls on all 3 of the pots), plus either a 2-pole "half Superswitch" (as shown on his schematic), or a regular 2P3T Strat switch, as he suggests.

[markt62]

Well I bought the hight output pair from Lace. I did this because it was a Strat I felt it need that from what I had read. They have a higher output according to my Voltmeter they are what Lace says they are. I did go ahead and get the switch it will serve for now and in the future I will thanks to you guy have enough info to do a better job when this switch bites the dust.

[markt62]

Well thanks for doing this instead angellahash. Thanks you for deciding to help!

[Deleted]

I never know how to read this as there is no Tone on it
I always get TOLD OFF for ADD bits so STICKED to what you asked for

1. Neck Pickup Split
2. Neck Pickup Split & Middle
3. middle
4. Bridge Pickup Split & Middle
5. Bridge Pickup

and

1. Neck H
2. Neck H & Middle
3. middle
4. Bridge H & Middle
5. Bridge H

1. Neck H & Bridge H
2. Neck H Split & Bridge H Split
3. Neck H Split & Middle & Bridge H Split
4. Neck H & Middle & Bridge H

So with the Coil Switch it likes you Pick North (did i read that wrong! Splite! this meaning you want SINGLE Coil or BOTH Single Coils!)
If its just Single Coil then OK, if you want Both Singal Coils Sort of Neck North + Neck South, to change to Neck North x Neck South then i would need a Switch for Bridge and Neck

But going on if you mean Split as in just a single Coil then the Coil Switch will change it to ever North or South on the Bridge or Neck. meaning you have Done all the TOP 5
and the next 5 on the List, just leaving the 4

ALL Switch brings in the Bridge and Neck to the output and as you can go between Humbucker and Single coil would do all that
infact dont need a 3rd Pole .. only need 2 Poles.. could do this with a CHEAP S-Type Start Switch really

i'll shut up with this circuit diagrams that no one can read

[jhng]

The first diagram by @angellahash above should work for you, markt62, if that gives you what you need. The second needs to be adjusted a little bit since the Alumitone humbuckers are three conductor not four. So the coil splits need to be simplified and done as in the first diagram.

Regarding tone controls, you have a spare pole on the five-way switch if you use @angellahash's first diagram (and two spare poles if you use the second). So you can attach the tone controls there and decide which tone control works in which position.

Does that give you what you need?

newey, I always think it is shame when people lose the Middle pickup altogether, since it is one of the original three Strat sounds from when the guitar was first designed. I always made sure I had it. But I since I use it less I don't mind if it is buried a bit in the switching. Incidentally, in the setup I suggested above, you only need one pole of the DPDT to do the 'Middle on' switch, obviously, so the second can be used to disconnect the Bridge in position 2, leaving Middle only. I haven't drawn it out, but it should be simple enough.

[newey]

Nov 24, 2021 12:05:50 GMT -5 @angellahash said:

i'll shut up with this circuit diagrams that no one can read

Well, I can read them . . .Nice job on both.

markt62-

Angellahash has now given you two schemes to choose from. If either one of these hits your tickle meter, and if you can read a schematic, then you're good to go. If you can't read a schematic, let us know and one of us will translate the scheme you want into a wiring diagram.

Angellahash's's first diagram requires a Superswitch and a DPDT switch (which could be a push/pull pot). The second requires 3 DPDT switches (which could be push/pulls on all 3 of the pots), plus either a 2-pole "half Superswitch" (as shown on his schematic), or a regular 2P3T Strat switch, as he suggests.

[gckelloch]

Much respect for the work Angellahash has done. I don't want to spend time trying to figure it all out, but I'm wondering if it makes more sense to just wire an "always on" bridge or neck pickup switch to allow the B+N and B+M+N options so you don't have to memorize a nonintuitive pickup configuration for each of the 5 positions?

[markt62]

Thanks you all so much for your assistance and Newey I would love a wiring diagram as I can most likely work this out but I am much more comfortable with a wiring diagram. You all have been so nice and I have been do helpless! I am looking so forward to having this guitar backup and working. I hope I like the Alumitone pickups they look really nice but I am some what of an audio buff and this are said to have a HIFI sound and that appealed to me so that is how I got in this mess. It is amazing the thing I can get into when I setup to learn something. I am looking forward to playing this guitar and I will post pictures when I am done.

Thanks You jhng, gckelloch, angellahash, and Newey for all your schematics and Ideas as well as you time and work. You guys saved my bacon on this one.

Mark

[gckelloch]

The high output (5k DCR) Aluma's should be 2.24H, yet with a higher peak freq than the lower inductance models. The high-end cut-off depends on the pickup inductance under a capacitance and resistance load. The other models list a peak in the 2~2.5kHz range, which is very low for the inductance. Not sure how that's measured, but I would assume it has to do with how the design rolls off the high end to lower the resonant freq, so I don't see how the high-end would be any more extended than a 3H Steel core pickup i.e. less than a typical AlNiCo pole Strat pickup -- not HiFI at all. The 1.4H versions might be considered more HiFi, but not really. Maybe the transformer design isolates the coil structure from the capacitance load to produce better high-end extension?

[Deleted]

Nov 24, 2021 16:35:25 GMT -5 gckelloch said:

Much respect for the work Angellahash has done. I don't want to spend time trying to figure it all out, but I'm wondering if it makes more sense to just wire an "always on" bridge or neck pickup switch to allow the B+N and B+M+N options so you don't have to memorize a nonintuitive pickup configuration for each of the 5 positions?

Will be the same as the Top of the Two Circuits but than the outputs the grounds
i have to change the state of one of the other end to make it non-active/active

People ask for custom designs and that comes at a cost of complex a lot of the time.
i do enjoy then cutting out bits you dont really dont need (why im not a brain surgeon)

as we have a 4P5T you could force more of the work for the coil change on to it
i think would make a lot more cables and solder.

[jhng]

markt62 -- Here is a picture for you based on @angellahash first design. There are two tweaks:

1. The mode switch is tweaked to give the alternate modes as follows:

1. Bridge
2. Bridge + Middle + Neck
3. Middle
4. Bridge + Neck
5. Neck

So you reduce duplication when in the alternate mode and the three single pickup selections remain consistent across both.

2. Second tweak is on the coil splits. @angellahash had one of the coil splits going to hot in order to give a different coil. That works for most humbuckers and probably works for the Alumitones. However, because the Alumitones are an unusual and novel design, it would be safer to follow the Lace instructions exactly and do both coil splits to ground.

Maybe see if someone else can quickly look over the diagram first, in case I've messed it up, then you should be good to go.

[newey]

jhng-

Your diagram looks good to go

markt62- You didn't say which scheme you ultimately decided to go with, but you can use jhng's diagram if that's the one. Note a couple of things on his diagram. First, the white coil-cut wires from the pickups are rendered in light blue so they can be seen against the white background. Second, on the lower right-hand pole of the Superswitch, note the little orange jumper wires to connnect lugs 1-2 and 4-5. These are a bit hard to see on the diagram.

[markt62]

Again Thanks just one question is all. The single Coil has 4 wires with the White wire gets taped or in my case heat wrapped off. But the third wire (White/Black Strip) which is a ground from the single would go the same place as the Green? Also I know it is nite picky but I was hoping as I was talking about before to have the first setting anyone in-counters be the standard Strat sound. It will not stop me from using he digram you have drawn and being happy that you did this much to help me.

I am so excited to have my answer. After Thanksgiving I will have the table back and I can complete my Strat.

HAPPY THANKSGIVING to all and enjoy your Friends and Family as well as the food!!

[jhng]

Nov 25, 2021 12:42:04 GMT -5 markt62 said:

Again Thanks just one question is all. The single Coil has 4 wires with the White wire gets taped or in my case heat wrapped off. But the third wire (White/Black Strip) which is a ground from the single would go the same place as the Green? Also I know it is nite picky but I was hoping as I was talking about before to have the first setting anyone in-counters be the standard Strat sound. It will not stop me from using he digram you have drawn and being happy that you did this much to help me.

I am so excited to have my answer. After Thanksgiving I will have the table back and I can complete my Strat.

HAPPY THANKSGIVING to all and enjoy your Friends and Family as well as the food!!

If the single coil is also Alumitone, then the black and white striped one will be the shield ground and can go to the same place as the green wires from the HBs, as you say.

In terms of the switching, with all the pots down you have:

1. B(hb)
2. B(hb)+M
3. M
4. N(hb)+M
5. N(hb)

This is standard Strat pickup selections, with the B and N pickups in their 'natural' humbucker state (i.e. not coil split). Is this not what you had in mind for normal Strat? I can very easily tweak.

Hope you are all enjoying Thanksgiving! I'm in the UK where we are not yet into holiday season.

[Yogi B]

Nov 25, 2021 4:26:46 GMT -5 jhng said:

2. Second tweak is on the coil splits. @angellahash had one of the coil splits going to hot in order to give a different coil. That works for most humbuckers and probably works for the Alumitones. However, because the Alumitones are an unusual and novel design, it would be safer to follow the Lace instructions exactly and do both coil splits to ground.

Agreed, but critically the LACE diagrams swap the ground connection between the normal (black/white) ground wire and the (solid white) tap wire — thus the unused coil isn't shorted. This distinction is especially important when the coils are tightly coupled as will be the case here (the Alumitones' transformer coils).

[jhng]

Tweaked diagram to take into account comments by Yogi B and others above. Ironically, after recommending following the Lace coil split instructions exactly, I must have then misread their diagram.  The Alumitone pickups look beautiful -- hopefully sound beautiful too.

[markt62]

I hope everyone had a great Thanksgiving and that the food was good and the love of those around us was warm and wonderful where ever possible! 

Jhng- I just realized that what I am calling Standard Strat sounds is just a matter of splitting the Humbuckers and I am there so Either way will work fine.

Again Thanks Guys I would not have ever been able to do this without your help. On a Side note today is my Birthday and it was a good one. This Drawing tops it off because I can now finish my wonderful and long project ending with a beautiful instrument that we all together have made and it looks and sounds impressive.

PLEASE READ I just realized that with the Humbuckers not split the setup is the single coil version so I am all set